Player Features and Ideas Discussion

I want spaceship X.

Miners suddenly start blowing up, making it difficult to produce spaceship X.

They necessarily raise their ore costs to cover their losses (or mine in places and in ways they cant be blown up, such as tanking, which lowers their output).

Now spaceship X costs more for me to buy, but Im a mission runner, and essentially have access to an isk printer. That means I either pay out more from my missions, or run more missions to offset the higher price.

In either circumstance, the miner is receiving more value, and I'm receiving less, for an equal amount of "work" or "labor", because at the end of this day (a 24 hour period of this kind of exchange), I, as a mission runner, have less surplus ISK in my wallet for an equivalent period before this shift, and they, as miners, have more isk in their wallets.

They have grown more wealthy. You were correct in explaining that wealth is always and very simply a comparison to others within a group, as some people with rare beads or shells in a primitive society were "richer" than others in that same society, even though by today's standards they had "weath" equivalent to an 8 year old who went to the beach once or twice.

However, you didn't go far enough with your analysis, to flesh out what I did above, proving that wealth comes through trade inequalities, not through a set value of a commodity, since that value is subject to change as through examples similar to above.

Eve is a sandbox --> no more NPC should be needed we need a player solution. You could start to lower income for highsec ativitys by about 25% to push the people into low/wh/0.0

mfg

No honey, I tried that twice, isn't worth the hassle.

And we need less capital ships, not more and bigger(ererer) ones. Even battleships are more of a burden than a benefit.

Number 1 also isn't the greatest, because while that would increase the profit of mining it would also increase the cost of everything in the game relative to mining, so the buying power of miners wouldn't change much except for NPC goods which are fixed-price.

And those who do or did were largely the major boxers who were actually in null or medium-large indy corps, and frequently are lumped into the category of industrialists because they realize that it is much easier to make isk moving finished goods than raw materials at several levels of the game, especially once one has BPOs that are researched.

Mining is the lowest level of resource production, therefore it should not pay that well. If you want to make more, move higher up the production chain or cut out the middlemen.

In the alternative, CCP could lower bounties and mission payouts some, thereby lowering the amount of ISK coming in, and raising the value of basic minerals.

Another option wilould be to add a new item, like Rare Asteroid Cores, for which there would be NPC buy orders. These would only appear randomly and if the Rock was completely mined out. That would be a way to raise income through mining without putting more minerals on the market. Or perhaps certain pirates could have hidden things inside of some asteroids. Or some other random treasure hunt boost.

Still, I think mining is fine. It is still a scale able activity that is easy to learn in terms of player skills. My issue with it is that Specializing in it is frankly pretty stupid as the skills are no good for anything else. If a train a miner, he can mine. If I train a ratter, he can also PVP. That is why I support lowering the amount of raw ISK coming into the game. Making more specialized professions earn more is a good thing.

Most T1 basics are seeded by NPC anyway. Blueprints, skills, etc.

The funny thing is that without mission runners since the beginning of eve, bounties on rats in belts, and so on, there'd never be any isk in the game. You can't sell ore without mission runners and ratters farming ISK.

Thats like saying oil drilling is the lowest level of resource production IRL and shouldnt pay well. You're espousing a belief based on perceptions rather than facts. If someone developed a large mining conglomerate to restrict people from getting ores, the minerals would choke, and people would have to pay a higher price to this conglomerate who is keeping the ore out of the market, while selling only small bits of it into the market at a high price.

Then, if this happened prior to experiencing EvE, you'd think that ore should pay well, and have different reasons why.

Perception is a funny thing.

Like I keep saying, miners are their own worst enemy. They continue to mine ore, and specifically low ends, when the real money is perhaps today in certain gasses, or ABCs. Instead of taking the time and effort to find the best thing to harvest, they stick with low ends, which means that low ends, already a commonplace ore/mineral, saturate the market further, driving down prices of said low ends more.

Miners are too lazy to follow the money.

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If the economy was based on people wanting to succeed, because it was "more serious", we'd realistically see rural and backwater systems be cheaper sources of raw materials, while central hubs (jita, amarr) would be more expensive sources of raw materials and cheaper finished products, and then back to the rural and backwater systems, finished products there would be more expensive than at a hub.

Cheap --> Expensive.
Finished product:
Hub -> backwater.
Raw material:
Backwater ->hub.

Strangely, this rarely plays out. The first time I started EvE, I thought there could be a lucrative business in gun running, selling those exhorbitantly priced ammo and turrets to pirates. This doesn't work out in practice due to market demand insulation vis a vis ALTS. The economy in EvE is really just a mockery for a multitude of reasons. Not the least of which is alts being able to avoid consequences for a life/playstyle choice, keeping your prices low.

We always complain that miners are risk averse, which is why people regularly **** on them, but honestly, what's more risk averse than trying to be a dastardly pirate, and then just using alts to circumvent all the logistical issues that arise from being a "pirate"?