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Dev blog: A quick update from Team Security - Recap from Fanfest 2015

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Tara'Quoya Rax
Atlantis Asteria
#81 - 2015-04-14 22:18:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Tara'Quoya Rax
So we can't even bind simple shortcuts like Alt+C (Inventory), Alt+R (Market), Alt+B (Browser), ... to Logitech G-keys anymore for easier access? Where is the comfort line drawn?


On a side note, being a software dev myself, when writing software we always have to take into account accessibility.
I understand that macro's in general can often provide players with an unfair advantage towards others in some form or shape, and can even lead to the collapse of a game altogether when abused in large scale.
But in all fairness, for a number of players who suffer from physical disabilities, using macro's may be the difference between a playable and an unplayable EVE experience. I expect this player population to be very very small, but they might be out there still.
ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#82 - 2015-04-15 05:19:51 UTC
Tara'Quoya Rax wrote:
So we can't even bind simple shortcuts like Alt+C (Inventory), Alt+R (Market), Alt+B (Browser), ... to Logitech G-keys anymore for easier access? Where is the comfort line drawn?


On a side note, being a software dev myself, when writing software we always have to take into account accessibility.
I understand that macro's in general can often provide players with an unfair advantage towards others in some form or shape, and can even lead to the collapse of a game altogether when abused in large scale.
But in all fairness, for a number of players who suffer from physical disabilities, using macro's may be the difference between a playable and an unplayable EVE experience. I expect this player population to be very very small, but they might be out there still.

I agree. But I think with Eve having a 1 second "tick" of the server between actions I don't think it is a difficult line to draw. You would need to build some kind of time element into it to do complex actions which I don't even know if that is possible with the logitech software.

Any way to me it would seem that if you press a key and a single action happens I don't see how that can be a problem. So like you said even if you are combine keystrokes like Alt + C or shift + r for example those are defaults which are remappable anyway so you are not changing the way that you play the game.

If CCP would just make a statement along those lines with regards to G keys that would be enough to solve many of these questions.

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Dersen Lowery
The Scope
#83 - 2015-04-15 16:44:35 UTC
Kinete Jenius wrote:
Dersen Lowery wrote:
That's because there has to be some human-level discretion involved, because of the sheer number of variables in play.

[...]

So CCP have to be able to rule out the use of system tools and features if they enable impossible levels of speed or efficiency.

Because that really is the goal.

What you've typed is madness absolute madness.


Sorry, no.

Your definition of "getting good at the game" is not theirs. Binding a series of keystrokes to a programmable mouse is automating client input, not getting good at the game. You can become a terrific CEO, FC, or PVP pilot, or miner, or mission blitzer, or incursion runner, or explorer, or diplomat, with a completely vanilla client and with an ordinary, dumb keyboard and mouse. EVE is not a twitch game.

That's the point.

Kinete Jenius wrote:
How do you think bots work? They utilize one of a couple standard languages that come with the OS and they utilize some of the functions. Here's the thing though. The bot itself doesn't come with windows as part of it's feature set. You're the one producing the bot. At this point when you're comparing a bot to ease of access tweaks that are naturally part of windows you're comparing an apple to a car.


That part of my argument didn't concern ease of access features. The first part did. The part where I said that using accessibility features as intended was not going to get you banned, but using them to give you capabilities beyond what would be available to a person using a default configuration with ordinary hardware probably will get you banned.

And if you don't like the "enhanced performance" metric, then what do you want them to use? That's pretty much the only way they have to measure anything, and it has the advantage of not caring whether you're getting the enhancement from software you wrote, or from input accessories, or from wooden dowels and duct tape.

Kinete Jenius wrote:
I just want to know that I'm not going to get banned for running in windowed mode and I can't even get that out of CCP.


Because there isn't a simple answer to the question, and I suspect that you know that. Do you want to run in windowed mode in order to be able to interact significantly more efficiently than you could otherwise? Then you'll probably get whacked. If not, then you won't.

Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables.

I voted in CSM X!