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Why does everyone (sort of) want to making mining easier?
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1-Up Mushroom
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2011-12-24 20:59:25 UTC
I see all these threads about people trying to make mining more of a passive isk maker and increasing hulk tanks and bigger and better ships to make mining easier.

What they really should do is make mining harder, make it so less people do it, so then mineral prices rise, causing it to be more profitable.
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Halcyon Ingenium
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#2 - 2011-12-24 21:01:13 UTC
1-Up Mushroom wrote:
I see all these threads about people trying to make mining more of a passive isk maker and increasing hulk tanks and bigger and better ships to make mining easier.

What they really should do is make mining harder, make it so less people do it, so then mineral prices rise, causing it to be more profitable.


The problem isn't the "people" who mine. Assuming there are any actual people left who mine at all.

By the way, since we're already talking, do you want to buy a rifter? I've got the cheapest rifters in Metropolis. If you can find a cheaper rifter, buy it!
Eladanus
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#3 - 2011-12-24 21:05:08 UTC
I guess people want to make it easier so that it balances out against the boredom or AFK'ing. That and to compete against bots.

People probably want to just increase hulk tanks as a reaction to all the hulk/miner killing recently
1-Up Mushroom
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2011-12-24 21:11:12 UTC
Eladanus wrote:
I guess people want to make it easier so that it balances out against the boredom or AFK'ing. That and to compete against bots.

People probably want to just increase hulk tanks as a reaction to all the hulk/miner killing recently


But making it easier won't make it funner, also it's already extremely easy.

Yea I can kind of understand that, but at the same time that's decreasing the amount of miners, increasing ISK/hour of mining ever so slightly, so miners that aren't idiots and don't mine where gankers are start to make more money
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Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#5 - 2011-12-24 21:12:32 UTC
I am acutally one of the ones on the other side of the fence and want to make it alot harder.

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Velicitia
XS Tech
#6 - 2011-12-24 21:18:38 UTC
Nova Fox wrote:
I am acutally one of the ones on the other side of the fence and want to make it alot harder.


^this.

Way I see it is -- in general, the miners are in the "this is like every other MMO" crowd, and don't quite get a few things:

1. They're selling to other players
2. The market can only soak up so much Trit (or Mex, or Pyer, etc).
3. Every other miner/botter has an adverse affect on their ISK/hour ratio


So, they think -- hey, if I could mine 10 or 20 or 30% more per hour, I could sell another n-million units of Trit (or Mex or Pyer) and make bank. While they're thinking this, they're completely neglecting to account for the other few thousand miners who will all get the same bonuses they will.

Granted, I'm getting a little pissed off at the price hikes of the past month or so. Cool

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Eladanus
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#7 - 2011-12-24 21:20:22 UTC
1-Up Mushroom wrote:
Eladanus wrote:
I guess people want to make it easier so that it balances out against the boredom or AFK'ing. That and to compete against bots.

People probably want to just increase hulk tanks as a reaction to all the hulk/miner killing recently


But making it easier won't make it funner, also it's already extremely easy.



No but making it easy (more profitable) makes up for the fact its boring as hell. Theres no way to make it more fun, not without making a whole little mini-game out of it
1-Up Mushroom
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#8 - 2011-12-24 21:22:10 UTC
Eladanus wrote:
1-Up Mushroom wrote:
Eladanus wrote:
I guess people want to make it easier so that it balances out against the boredom or AFK'ing. That and to compete against bots.

People probably want to just increase hulk tanks as a reaction to all the hulk/miner killing recently


But making it easier won't make it funner, also it's already extremely easy.



No but making it harder (more profitable) makes up for the fact its boring as hell. Theres no way to make it more fun, not without making a whole little mini-game out of it

Fixed
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Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#9 - 2011-12-24 21:28:08 UTC
Full Officer fit CNR's get ganked in hi-sec. You can't tank a hulk enough to stop a gank. You can however make it harder to farm them.

You see it as 'making it easier to mine'.
The miner sees it as 'making it harder to farm him'.

It's all about perspective.
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2011-12-24 22:39:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaroslav Unwanted
Skydell wrote:
Full Officer fit CNR's get ganked in hi-sec. You can't tank a hulk enough to stop a gank. You can however make it harder to farm them.

You see it as 'making it easier to mine'.
The miner sees it as 'making it harder to farm him'.

It's all about perspective.


Well yes you can gank 500k ehp ship if its worth it..
People shooting exhumers for fun..

Difference.

Anyway mining harder or easier.. its not an question

Mining interesting on the other hand..
I heard something about comets etc. which would be interesting.

Not that i would actually start to mine anytime soon.. got mining lvl I since i was born with that skill Cool
Jask Avan
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#11 - 2011-12-24 23:57:20 UTC
Make mining easier, and prices drop a little. Make mining harder, and you just drive the players away while the bots adjust as it's boring and annoying.
The only way you'll get people mining is to break bots and nerf refining/ drone drops.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#12 - 2011-12-25 00:07:29 UTC
1-Up Mushroom wrote:
I see all these threads about people trying to make mining more of a passive isk maker and increasing hulk tanks and bigger and better ships to make mining easier.

What they really should do is make mining harder, make it so less people do it, so then mineral prices rise, causing it to be more profitable.



That would work. Except that mining only sets the prices of Trit (maybe Py) and then only because it's a not really worth it to move it from the drone regions to hisec for sale. Mining doesn't produce the bulk of the more expensive minerals (not sure on how much trit is mined vs gunmined).

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Arklan1
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2011-12-25 00:11:20 UTC
the supply of minerals doesn't come mostly from mining (it's reprocessed mission/drone loot) for starters, so the effect of changes to mining itself is a more complex disucssion...

but, in my view, any changes need to be two fold in effect: up the "play" and down the ease of botting. course, EVERYTHING should be thus...

or, if you can't make mining actually interesting, then make the extracting part completely passive, and let us just haul the stuff from our "mining platform" or whatever. course then it's just PI, but in mining belts, isn't it? blah.
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#14 - 2011-12-25 00:24:44 UTC
Step 1 Make System wide belts
Step 2 Make asteriod ambigously unknown
Step 3 Add several dozen new grades of each asteriod.
Step 4 few of the included grades are 'worthless' with lower than normal refine rates and 'dangerous' vareity of rocks that react very badly when mined.
Step 5 sit back and watch the miners complain they have to think on mining.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Merovee
Gorthaur Legion
Imperium Mordor
#15 - 2011-12-25 00:31:47 UTC
Bigger rats, these mosquitoes they keep sending, I no long longer blow up, I just turn on the shields and they keep buzzing around my head.

What would be nice is a mining drone redo. new models and hold more ore. Maybe they should look like bubble bees since they no longer land on the roids. Blink

Empire, the next new world order.
Atticus Fynch
#16 - 2011-12-25 00:36:22 UTC
Mining is fine as is. Miners are already at a disadvantage with can flippers, gankers and the sport for the phallically challenged...Hulkaggedon.

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MadMuppet
Critical Mass Inc
#17 - 2011-12-25 00:37:02 UTC
I would like mining to be something more complicated so that the bots get screwed up. I would like it to be more interesting so that I don't fall asleep at the keyboard. With ships like the new BCs, a mining ship stands little to no chance or survival. Being in a fleet doesn't matter when they have a one-shot wonder gun. WIth that I would like to see some materials ONLY be available via mining so that it would be viable. Right now I just mine for beer and ammo.

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Il Feytid
State War Academy
Caldari State
#18 - 2011-12-25 00:39:50 UTC
The mining yield should be a direct result in the amount of effort put into mining.

Also please remove the reprocessing skill.
OmegaZeda
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2011-12-25 00:46:16 UTC
Nova Fox wrote:
Step 1 Make System wide belts
Step 2 Make asteriod ambigously unknown
Step 3 Add several dozen new grades of each asteriod.
Step 4 few of the included grades are 'worthless' with lower than normal refine rates and 'dangerous' vareity of rocks that react very badly when mined.
Step 5 sit back and watch the miners complain they have to think on mining.


This actually sounds like a number of good ideas. Make mining more interaction based would also force out the majority of bots as well.

I'd take it a step further. You would have to scan the asteroids and use something like the Planetary Interaction interface where you would have to manually lock the strip miners onto a mineral deposit. The richer the deposit the more can be mined. Maybe even introduce some sort of purity scale where some deposits require less refining to bring the material up to manufacturing grade.

I've not really touched anything industrial in over a year but if they made it somewhat entertaining rather than a headache and chore I'd at least consider doing it again in my spare time.
Endeavour Starfleet
#20 - 2011-12-25 00:59:23 UTC
I asked for massively increasing hull HP in responce to the ganking going on. What is the issue with that? You cant tank anything decent with a hull repper.
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