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Thinking about getting a POS

Author
Kelur Hunter
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2015-04-03 09:53:31 UTC
Hello capsulers. I am thinking about getting a POS in Hi-sec for industrial reasons. I want to do inventions,copying, refining, researching, and manufacturing. Pretty much everything hehe. I would like to know the pros and the cons of owning a POS, as well as if owning a POS is even worth it. I already know what I plan to use the POS for, I just need some tips and advice from more experience players who either owns or owned a POS. I'm looking forward to hearing back. o7
Kiddoomer
The Red Sequence
#2 - 2015-04-03 10:00:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Kiddoomer
Hello, it's been some months since I bought my small caldari POS, I can already say that I don't regret buying it. I use it to research some BPO (T2 components, missiles and mining crystals), invention (T2 mining crystal for me) and compression/refining/manufacturing to build T1 and T2 cruiser and mining barges.

But since I'm solo, I only anchor it for 2 days every two weeks to do everything and repackage it again until I mined enough ore to build a dozen of ships.

I'm not really interested in maxed out profit though, mostly for fun and doing something than mining or missionning, but I build ship that sells well and pretty fast (ishtar, retriever, arazu or stabber). And the research/invention for missiles and mining crystals is for my own use, so I don't use the BPO/BPC in big quantities.

I have a vexor BPO (10/20 that I want to sell :x), but all of the others ship BPC (T1 and T2) are bought on the market, and I buy the advanced moon materials in trade hub or in providence.

In the name of Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen : “Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.”

Faile Leahan
State War Academy
Caldari State
#3 - 2015-04-03 10:34:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Faile Leahan
Can I suggest watching the videos from fan fest before you continue with this investment?

The entire structure side of the game is expecting a overhaul and pos's are going to be phased out over the next 6 months or so.
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2015-04-03 11:08:33 UTC
Mostly it's a cost calculation.

A POS gives you a 2% material bonus when manufacturing and a large time saving on jobs. It uses fuel to operate. So the question is, can you manufacture enough that the extra profits from the material reduction and time reduction exceed the cost of the fuel every month.
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2015-04-03 11:09:40 UTC
Faile Leahan wrote:
The entire structure side of the game is expecting a overhaul and pos's are going to be phased out over the next 6 months or so.


I thought they said that the first set of new structures would be on TQ by the end of 2015, not that the entire set would be in by October 2015.
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#6 - 2015-04-03 13:42:38 UTC
POSes also completely eliminate NPC corporate taxes. But not job costs. Don't forget to figure that in your cost calculations.

A POS is also the only place where you can compress raw ore.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY

Kelur Hunter
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2015-04-03 16:45:17 UTC
Thank you all for the info. @Faile Leahan, I'll check it out. You guys said a lot of good things about owning a POS. What about the bad things?
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2015-04-03 16:51:19 UTC
They're expensive. They're a pain to manufacture in as materials have to go into the individual arrays. BPOs have to be in the hangers, so if you get wardecced you may have to choose between cancelling an expensive job or risking an expensive BPO (assuming it's highsec)

Kelur Hunter
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2015-04-03 17:48:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Kelur Hunter
Elena Thiesant wrote:
They're expensive. They're a pain to manufacture in as materials have to go into the individual arrays. BPOs have to be in the hangers, so if you get wardecced you may have to choose between cancelling an expensive job or risking an expensive BPO (assuming it's highsec)


How expensive are jobs normally? This seems like a huge Con hehe.
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2015-04-03 18:46:38 UTC
Errr.... depends what you're building...
Kelur Hunter
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2015-04-03 19:11:32 UTC
Elena Thiesant wrote:
Errr.... depends what you're building...

Sorry thought you meant research jobs hehe.
Kelur Hunter
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2015-04-03 19:13:49 UTC
Faile Leahan wrote:
Can I suggest watching the videos from fan fest before you continue with this investment?

The entire structure side of the game is expecting a overhaul and pos's are going to be phased out over the next 6 months or so.

It seems they are making changes to structures, I guess to improve everything in general by removing certain structures and replacing them with better structures. "Out with the old in the the new".
LuckyQuarter
Eden Dominion Coalition
Scary Wormhole People
#13 - 2015-04-03 23:22:12 UTC  |  Edited by: LuckyQuarter
A small pos isn't that expensive at all to run compared to potential profits and if you just have a single assembly array structure. electronics warfare modules + shield hardeners, and one ship hanger online will be reasonably defensible and not attract wardecs. Now that the faction standing requirement is removed, I'm not sure why any industrialist wouldn't have at least a small pos active.

Medium pos allows you to provide a bigger defense, 1 more assembly array, and perhaps a single research lab w/o being a wardec target. The right way to pay for this is to do pi on several planets in the system your pos is located in. Collecting/selling planetary resources with a single character 1-2 times/week can easily generate 60M-100M/week. Just make sure to put a solid defense at all six axis's of the pos.

The minimal getting started costs with the above are fairly balanced against the knowledge that structure changes are coming down the line and will change everything. As long as you don't go all out and get a big tower unless you really need it for expensive bpo's and more arrays, you should be fine and not lose too much isk when the changes finally occur.
Kelur Hunter
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2015-04-04 00:39:03 UTC
LuckyQuarter wrote:
A small pos isn't that expensive at all to run compared to potential profits and if you just have a single assembly array structure. electronics warfare modules + shield hardeners, and one ship hanger online will be reasonably defensible and not attract wardecs. Now that the faction standing requirement is removed, I'm not sure why any industrialist wouldn't have at least a small pos active.

Medium pos allows you to provide a bigger defense, 1 more assembly array, and perhaps a single research lab w/o being a wardec target. The right way to pay for this is to do pi on several planets in the system your pos is located in. Collecting/selling planetary resources with a single character 1-2 times/week can easily generate 60M-100M/week. Just make sure to put a solid defense at all six axis's of the pos.

The minimal getting started costs with the above are fairly balanced against the knowledge that structure changes are coming down the line and will change everything. As long as you don't go all out and get a big tower unless you really need it for expensive bpo's and more arrays, you should be fine and not lose too much isk when the changes finally occur.

Thanks this is great info, which guns should i use for defense? How many?
Kelur Hunter
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#15 - 2015-04-04 00:41:12 UTC
I'm also getting a small POS.
Nyanatiloka Mahathera
Aideron Applied Science
#16 - 2015-04-04 00:50:35 UTC
I also have been considering this (getting a POS that is) just so that in a few years I can reminisce with the other bittervets about the bad old days of POS.

Seriously though, I look at what EVE Isk Per Hour says about the potential profitability for T2 manufacturing at a POS v. the station I'm using and am seriously tempted to take the plunge. Seems like you need about 350K ISK/hr worth of production going 24/7 to pay for the fuel for a Caldari small tower.
Raphael Celestine
Celestine Inc.
#17 - 2015-04-04 02:05:53 UTC
Nyanatiloka Mahathera wrote:
Seriously though, I look at what EVE Isk Per Hour says about the potential profitability for T2 manufacturing at a POS v. the station I'm using and am seriously tempted to take the plunge. Seems like you need about 350K ISK/hr worth of production going 24/7 to pay for the fuel for a Caldari small tower.

Bear in mind that a significant part of the ISK/hr increase at a POS comes from increased production speeds, which means loading jobs more frequently. It doesn't matter what your theoretical ISK/hr is if your production lines are dead for half the day because you can't log in every two hours to restart jobs. POSes are definitely useful, but not always as useful as they look at first glance.

I don't remember whether IPH has an option for ISK/hr rounding up job lengths, but you'll want to work out the ISK/hr you can actually achieve, including potential down-time between jobs, before you take the plunge and buy a POS.
Nyanatiloka Mahathera
Aideron Applied Science
#18 - 2015-04-04 02:27:50 UTC
Raphael Celestine wrote:

Bear in mind that a significant part of the ISK/hr increase at a POS comes from increased production speeds, which means loading jobs more frequently. It doesn't matter what your theoretical ISK/hr is if your production lines are dead for half the day because you can't log in every two hours to restart jobs. POSes are definitely useful, but not always as useful as they look at first glance.

I don't remember whether IPH has an option for ISK/hr rounding up job lengths, but you'll want to work out the ISK/hr you can actually achieve, including potential down-time between jobs, before you take the plunge and buy a POS.


If I could ever get my brother, who is the corpmate with real mfg skills, to just put in AF BPs for the full four runs and not **** around with making the components for one, building it, making the components for another etc. this would not be a problem for me...
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
#19 - 2015-04-04 13:51:50 UTC
Kelur Hunter wrote:
Thank you all for the info. @Faile Leahan, I'll check it out. You guys said a lot of good things about owning a POS. What about the bad things?


Anchoring and permanently onlining a POS tends to draw attention of an unsavoury kind towards you corp and will often end in a wardec and the destruction of your POS. This destruction of assets then gets noticed by other unsavoury types who get the 'gud fights' feeling and you get a semi-continuous flow of wardecs. Smile

" They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. " Rick. " Find out what ? " Abraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. " Rick. Season four.   ' The Walking Dead. ' .

Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#20 - 2015-04-05 10:48:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Zappity
I don't have much experience running a POS but I have benefited greatly from others' laxness. Do not let it run out of fuel. Ensure it is stronted. Ensure it is at least lightly defended with hardeners (especially for EM) and ECM or guns.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.

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