Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Ok now that I have your attention with the nerf word.

Generally speaking anything you can do permanently with little to no effort in game is boring and bad/flawed game mechanics. Apply this to this the importance of capacitor in the game and the permanently creating more of it from sturdy and resilient platforms (Carriers and Logistics ships) and it seems this is a bad mechanic.

The fact that Cap chains are so resilient against their direct counter (energy neutralizers) make this problem even worse. How to fix this?

Straight up nerfing the bonus's seems a little harsh or hard limiting the number of transfers to be fitted to a ship (like in the AT) seems to be artificially limiting in a sandbox game. So perhaps a new mechanic.

Make energy transfers always generate heat. Now hold your horses, don't get all up in arms yet logi bro's. Lets look at a specific example. As it is a pilot with Thermodynamics V in a two large energy transfer Guardian (for arguments sake lets take an all meta IV high slot guardian) can heat both of them simultaneously for 4mins37s.

Now the heat damage and emission stat can be lowered some (if it seems a little harsh atm), maybe even straight up halfing those stats. With the option still there for overheating as normal.

What does this do? It still allows cap chaining but adds actual skill in managing your heat instead of just "fire and forgetting" the chain if you will. Now an all V logi is stable with just one incoming transfer anyway so this already helps the heat factor as the same Guardian pilot as above can currently heat just one Energy Transfer for just shy of 7 minutes. So they can alternate between the two to limit the heat generated. Obviously each can be repaired with paste when not active also, the mods can be refit off carrier or Nestor now also if they burn.

This would add more module interaction, opportunities for mistakes to be exploited and more decisions. Always better than "fire and forget" mechanics.

ahh i found your problem



energy nuets are not the counter to cap chains cap chains are the counter to nuets



the counter you are looking for is ECM and when a fleet comp is dependent on cap transfers one jam is enough to bring the entire fleet down



-1 not over powered no need for nerf

I'd suggest equally. Receiving a single cap transfer of size = to your ship size should be sustainable (providing you're not overheating everything else ofc). But sustained oversized or multiple incoming cap transfers should cause general heat buildup. This allows brief bursts of energy to be applied but not maintained indefinitely.

It also allows for the possibility of using cap transfers offensively...

EDIT: Making neutral logi cap chains inoperable in hi-sec would of course be a tragic casualty of this change.

You mean you think every fight starting out with 'everyone burn out the target's modules in a way that is completely impossible to tank' could ever not be broken?

Oh damn. Better scrap the idea then.

If cap transfers become capable of offensive abilities, make cap batteries act as a counter.
Make the cap transfers only cause heat on the target if the transfer puts the battery at over 100%. By stacking cap batteries you can make a fleet harder to overcharge, nuet and vampire.

That breaks my heart...

A well trained (SP and pilot skill) dedicated ECM boat can effectively jam up to three ships



but regardless of the effectiveness of ECM to counter a cap chain your "fix" only causes more issues

The cap stable Logiboats are sceptible to neuting. The cap chaining ones aren't.

Note: the well made points above are quite correct: cap transfers causing heat would be a Bad Thing™

This is a prime example of exagerating to the point of absurdity. It is asinine to think the counter to everything is ECM.

What's the counter to turrets? Depends on the turret. Rails, arty, and beams the counter is speed. Blasters, ACs, and pulses are countered by range.
Scrams are themselves a counter to MWD, but are countered by keeping range.
Tracking disruption? Get a missile boat or, again, keep range.
Using your logic, the counter to everything is range.

So, in that vein, everything has its counter. Sure, ECM can be used to counter all this, but it's not any more necessary to counter it than cap chains are OP. Cap chains are fairly fragile, and if you break one link of that chain, the whole thing comes apart.