Crime & Punishment

First, I'm a little thrown off by the idea of anecdotal data. But as you are from the center for advanced studies, I'm going to assume that term is legit.

The data isn't mine, it's in a study published by CCP in which they reviewed 80,000 accounts and determined that getting destroyed (presumably by nonconsensual pvp) in the first 15 days of playing makes a newbro substantially more likely to stick with the game.

The discussion here is 2 parts:
1) why have we been changing all the rules to prevent something that is both fun for us and profitable for CCP.
2) what should be done about it?

I personally think Veers was on the right path about that collaborative highsec thing.

There is absolutely no way the Marmites can pop each noob in his first 15 days. Resource and time limitations are a very real problem.

I think we all need to pull together to make this happen. If I may be so bold, I would dub this program "no noob left behind".

If CCP rules catch up to times on this important issue, I hope we can all pull together and make this a reality.

We have to do this for the children...

Which is why we need can flipping too. There is no way to do it with wars, the cost would be staggering.

I absolutely agree with you, there is no way the Marmites can do it alone!

No noob left behind! Let's lead the collaboration, Veers!

Wait, what? Why did you change your mind? I thought you wanted to collaborate?

What about the 80,000 person study...? It said we need to do this for the children.

Don't you like children, Veers?

The point is that the game is already designed to make it impossible to shoot at you in highsec without concord intervention UNLESS you voluntarily elect to join a player corp and not drop when wardecced. There is no general consequence free nonconsensual pvp by paying concord off.

You aren't telling the whole truth here... People will hide in their own trash 1-man corps regardless if marmites or any other group sends wardecs their way. Let's be honest here: a LOT of people want to be left alone in their own little bubble and play their game as safe and tax free as possible. That is fine with me (to a certain degree) but at some point the sandbox kicks in and is going to remind that risk adverse loner that he is playing eve with other people weather he wants to face it or not. Sure the guy playing alone is making money for CCP, but what is he doing socially to make this game grow for the better? Veers, you need a dose of reality.

Completely untrue. You should be more specific in your assessment of the situation there Veers. I believe the correct way to say it is Marmite is effective at making YOU drop corp and stick to npc/1 man corps. But...let's be fair here...any corp that decs you will cause you to drop corp. I have tested this theory on more than one occasion..either by me, an alt, or a friend. THIS is what the problem is. CCP has allowed the risk averse to to dodge the inevitable in a game that is based around inevitable space conflicts.

There are ways to survive a war with a foe that is larger or better than you....and I mean more than just dropping corp, hiding in station, not logging on, or doing your business with an alt for the duration. I shouldn't have to spell it out for you. If you do not know what these things are, that is a problem..and exactly why the risk averse continuously have issues with wars and ganking. Step up and learn the game.

TBH, until you have stepped into the shoes of a PvPer and actually done something, you really don't have a right to complain about it imo. It does not make someone a "hero" to try to be an advocate for or speak against something they know nothing about. In fact, it makes one look foolish. It's easy to point fingers and blame others..but the real blame lies on yourself. The question is, will you keep running and blaming others...or will you take responsibility for your own mistakes and do something about it. hmmm?

....and this isn't just directed at you...

Bingo! Why should anyone have a free exit out of a war when a group pays a minimum of 50m? I agree the defender should always have options, but folding your corp over is surrendering... Let's attach hefty fees to closing a corp during war.

/me Raises Hand

This is about the children tho tora. Fine fine. Either way if 'somebody' headed up this I would donate time and ammo towards it. I've killed many newbros then convoed replaced ship and given advise/guidance. It's quite rewarding I hope for both parties.

Well sir you have my albeit limited support. I'd volunteer but keeping all my alts in line is a full time job as is...