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Ore Compression Formula/Ratios - Do they exist?

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Mike Lonestarr
Never Ending Trouble
#1 - 2015-03-21 04:20:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Mike Lonestarr
As the title says, I m looking for Compression Formulas or Ratios for all the Oretypes.

I ve been searching for hours now, goggle, eve forums and so on. The second attempt I might add. Most data is old and useless. The Devblog "Reprocess all the things" is really bad at explaining the compression change. (Why they didnt include a formula is beyond me)

The provided Spreadsheet is unclear to me:
Source: http://cdn1.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/65852/1/Compressedore2.png

Lets look at Veldspar:

Volume: 257 - Volume of what? Compressed Veldspar? That would be 0.15m3... not 257.
Batch Size: 1 - I guess that means 1 unit.
Tritanium: 690500 - So, in units or m3?

Maybe I m dont see whats starring me in the face, or I m just doing a really really bad job at reading it, but this spreadsheet doesnt help at all.

The devblog also mentions a 38.1% increase for the Rorqual.... I m guessing they mean the industrial core of the rorqual. Have fun looking to find that formula... okey okey, I found something, but I m really lost where to apply those 38.1%. Are they applied, increased or replaced? I know it says increased, but I'm starting to have trust issues with this devblog.

EDIT: I m using a Compression Array, but I'm guessing it would be the same formula as the industrial core of the rorqual.

Now, befor I go out and do an elaborate Test on TQ and back calculate the ratios (Since TQ rounds numbers it wont even be precise) I wanted to ask my fellow pilots and industrialists for help.

TLDR: Looking for Ore Compression Forumla or Ratios for each ore type. This information should be easier to find.

Sorry for the rant, its frustrating to spend so mutch time for a simple calculation. I appricate the help.
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
#2 - 2015-03-21 10:35:01 UTC
I don't think CCP have made a resource showing all the various computations for the results you require and I don't think there is a third party one available either. Based on a pilots varying skillset, hardwiring type, system sec status, and structure usage there will obviously be wide selection of results available.

I suggest you do your own maths to work out the results and then store them in the media of your choice. There are unlikely to be any more changes to this in the foreseeable future so you continue to use that data produced. In addition if you have done the work yourself it will be correct. Some other third party sites have info that often isn't correct.

" They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. " Rick. " Find out what ? " Abraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. " Rick. Season four.   ' The Walking Dead. ' .
Ekaterina 'Ghetto' Thurn
Department 10
#3 - 2015-03-21 10:40:13 UTC
Regarding the 690500 Tritanium figure you quoted I believe that would be the maximum amount possible. So it would be based on using a level five Minmatar outpost in nullsec with maxed out skills and an RX-804 hardwiring.

" They're gonna feel pretty stupid when they find out. " Rick. " Find out what ? " Abraham. " They're screwing with the wrong people. " Rick. Season four.   ' The Walking Dead. ' .
Elena Thiesant
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2015-03-21 10:46:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Elena Thiesant
Did you look at the Crius patch notes? The 100% yield mineral quantites are listed there, so all you have to do is apply the refining % that you have based on skills, location and implants. That's what I used for my mineral/ore spreadsheet http://community.eveonline.com/news/patch-notes/patch-notes-for-crius

As for compression, it's 100:1 for all ores. 100 units uncompressed ore => 1 unit compressed ore. When you refine a unit of compressed ore, it's equivalent to refining 100 units (the batch size) of the uncompressed ore.
Zifrian
The Frog Pond
Ribbit.
#5 - 2015-03-21 13:46:02 UTC
Elena Thiesant wrote:
Did you look at the Crius patch notes? The 100% yield mineral quantites are listed there, so all you have to do is apply the refining % that you have based on skills, location and implants. That's what I used for my mineral/ore spreadsheet http://community.eveonline.com/news/patch-notes/patch-notes-for-crius

As for compression, it's 100:1 for all ores. 100 units uncompressed ore => 1 unit compressed ore. When you refine a unit of compressed ore, it's equivalent to refining 100 units (the batch size) of the uncompressed ore.

Yeah it's 100:1 for all ores. 1 to 1 for Ice.

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Selaria Unbertable
Bellator in Capsulam
#6 - 2015-03-21 15:46:02 UTC
Shortly before the Crius changes hit TQ, I made a spreadsheet, calculating the ratios for compression and refining. Exact numbers for each ore type vary due to mineral composition, it boils down to a ratio of 1:20 between compression and refining, meaning 1m³ of compressed ore of any type contains about 20m³ of minerals. This means that the "better" the ore, and the more rare minerals it contains, the higher the compression ratio. Veldspar has a compression ratio of 1:67 for example, while Mercoxit has a ratio of 1:40.000.

Hope this helps a bit...
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#7 - 2015-03-21 20:00:10 UTC
batch size is:

how many units do you need to have, to be able to refine this thing.

The devblog is, unfortunately, not the most up to date version of what happened. They don't go back and change the devblog, when plans change, because of talking to players.

Oh, and if you do want to test things, you can always use SiSi Smile makes working with large volumes easier (as the market is seeded)

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter
Stonkeep
Osmanli Empire
#8 - 2015-03-22 03:36:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Stonkeep
Compression formula is really simple;

100 Veldspar = 1 Compressed Veldspar = 415 trit.

All others have the same compression. Best thing to do is to use in-game item info "Show Info > Industry" and create a spreadsheet. Compression is really simplified, reprocessing on the other hand...
Eric Raeder
No Fee Too High
#9 - 2015-03-25 02:25:49 UTC
Selaria Unbertable wrote:
Shortly before the Crius changes hit TQ, I made a spreadsheet, calculating the ratios for compression and refining. Exact numbers for each ore type vary due to mineral composition, it boils down to a ratio of 1:20 between compression and refining, meaning 1m³ of compressed ore of any type contains about 20m³ of minerals. This means that the "better" the ore, and the more rare minerals it contains, the higher the compression ratio. Veldspar has a compression ratio of 1:67 for example, while Mercoxit has a ratio of 1:40.000.

Hope this helps a bit...


It does, you have pretty much summarized what I came to this thread looking for. Batches, skills, facilities, meh, just how much benefit is there to compression?

While I applaud CCP for making a more straightforward mechanic for compression than the old rather nonsensical business of shoving minerals into 425 railguns and the like, it doesn't make sense to me that we can only compress ore, not minerals. We still have this complexity of compression calculation hanging around, people having to figure out optimum mixes of ores to compress to get the minerals they want to make stuff. Why the heck can't we just make compressed minerals, which would make this process so much simpler?
Selaria Unbertable
Bellator in Capsulam
#10 - 2015-03-25 08:57:48 UTC
Eric Raeder wrote:
Selaria Unbertable wrote:
Shortly before the Crius changes hit TQ, I made a spreadsheet, calculating the ratios for compression and refining. Exact numbers for each ore type vary due to mineral composition, it boils down to a ratio of 1:20 between compression and refining, meaning 1m³ of compressed ore of any type contains about 20m³ of minerals. This means that the "better" the ore, and the more rare minerals it contains, the higher the compression ratio. Veldspar has a compression ratio of 1:67 for example, while Mercoxit has a ratio of 1:40.000.

Hope this helps a bit...


It does, you have pretty much summarized what I came to this thread looking for. Batches, skills, facilities, meh, just how much benefit is there to compression?

While I applaud CCP for making a more straightforward mechanic for compression than the old rather nonsensical business of shoving minerals into 425 railguns and the like, it doesn't make sense to me that we can only compress ore, not minerals. We still have this complexity of compression calculation hanging around, people having to figure out optimum mixes of ores to compress to get the minerals they want to make stuff. Why the heck can't we just make compressed minerals, which would make this process so much simpler?


Several explainations come to mind why CCP choose to use the compression mechanics for ore instead of minerals.
- Minerals are an end product, and like in real life, you can't increase the density of, say iron, much more. Ore on the other hand may be less dense than it seems, more porous, and by compressing you just squeeze that empty spaces together and reduce the wasted space containing nothing...
- Compressed ore was already in the database, no need to create new items, but instead adjust some values, like the amount required for compression.

It's still not optimal hassling with compressed ore, you still have to do the math like you had before, but the system is simpler imho, and more consistent than before. No need to find the best blueprint for your needs, just calculating which ores to buy.
If you need a calculator, try this one: http://eve-industry.org/highsec-compression/.

o/
Aerie Evingod
Midwest Miners LLC
#11 - 2015-03-25 15:08:40 UTC
The reason there is no uniform formula for ore compression is because each ore type has a different compression. As the required ore to compress is now a static 100, the resulting compressed ore must have a volume less than the mineral content of said ore or it would be best to refine and transport those minerals instead. Thus because of different ore volumes and mineral content all the ores compress differently.

The reason for compressed ore instead of compressed minerals is 6 of one, or half dozen of another. in the end it's just allowing for the efficient transport of minerals.
Selaria Unbertable
Bellator in Capsulam
#12 - 2015-03-25 15:50:56 UTC
Aerie Evingod wrote:
The reason there is no uniform formula for ore compression is because each ore type has a different compression. As the required ore to compress is now a static 100, the resulting compressed ore must have a volume less than the mineral content of said ore or it would be best to refine and transport those minerals instead. Thus because of different ore volumes and mineral content all the ores compress differently.

The reason for compressed ore instead of compressed minerals is 6 of one, or half dozen of another. in the end it's just allowing for the efficient transport of minerals.


The size of the compressed ore depends of the absolute amount of minerals it contains. The "higher" the ore, the less minerals it yields, the better the ratio. As I wrote before, the ratio is about 1:20 when it comes to refining.
Aerie Evingod
Midwest Miners LLC
#13 - 2015-03-25 16:06:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Aerie Evingod
Selaria Unbertable wrote:
Aerie Evingod wrote:
The reason there is no uniform formula for ore compression is because each ore type has a different compression. As the required ore to compress is now a static 100, the resulting compressed ore must have a volume less than the mineral content of said ore or it would be best to refine and transport those minerals instead. Thus because of different ore volumes and mineral content all the ores compress differently.

The reason for compressed ore instead of compressed minerals is 6 of one, or half dozen of another. in the end it's just allowing for the efficient transport of minerals.


The size of the compressed ore depends of the absolute amount of minerals it contains. The "higher" the ore, the less minerals it yields, the better the ratio. As I wrote before, the ratio is about 1:20 when it comes to refining.


The mineral compression may be around 1:20, but the ore compression is variable (edit: variable is ore type).
Selaria Unbertable
Bellator in Capsulam
#14 - 2015-03-25 16:07:39 UTC
Since I had this already lying around, might as well share it:
Ore chart - compression and refining ratios.
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#15 - 2015-03-26 18:43:26 UTC
These are not the charts you're looking for.

100 units of raw ore = 1 unit of compressed ore. That is the only ratio you need to know. The ratio of minerals in compressed ore is identical to that of uncompressed ore, just multiplied by 100.

If you need to know the amount of minerals per batch of ore, which unironically is also 100 per refining batch, then go here. Steve Ronuken's site is good for that.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY