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Removal of Local Chat
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Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#101 - 2015-03-24 23:16:34 UTC
March rabbit wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:
Mr Epeen wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:

Beats me why miners do not organize themselves and establish mining fleet expeditions with hired mercs for protection, links, boosts and all sort of stuff. Gankers can organize themselves with eaze but "good guys" can't.


Gankers don't care about mercs. They are going to die anyway.

The only way to protect the miners would be to gank the gankers before they gank the miners. That is not only unlikely, but prohibitively expensive for the people hiring them. It's less expensive to just replace your Retriever and mark the guys who ganked you red so you'll see them next time before they're on grid.

There are effective means of avoiding ganks, but it requires being less lazy and putting up with slightly less yields. Something that just isn't going to happen very often given the raging entitlement of most MMO players these days.

Mr Epeen Cool



No, I meant why they don't organize low/null sec mining fleet expeditions. In low all they need to do is hire some mercs to camp the gates. You can't stop gankers in high sec without getting concordokken but there's no such problem in low.

I guess the reason here is the same as why you don't see battleship roams around low-sec: each T2 mining barge adds 200+ Million ISK to killboard. If people detect fleet of such things you will be dropped and jump fatique won't matter here.
Even fleet of retrievers will get big attention.

And hiring mercs to camp gates? How much ISK you need to pay to such mercs? You really sure you can make comparable amount by mining in low-sec??? Shocked Add here risk that your mercs will be ganked too... This is low-sec.



Well yeah it's low sec, there are risks... there are also cynos and other mechanics that allow rapid deployment of ship and there's also the perspective of mercs doing what they do in hope of finding pvp content. As far as I know mercs are hired for a period of time, the bigger the mining fleet the faster you can mine and make profit and the lesser are the costs for hiring mercs. Perhaps those mining ops could be a merc initiative.

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
ImYourMom
Retribution Holdings Corp
Retribution.
#102 - 2015-03-24 23:22:07 UTC
remove gates as well then it will make sense to remove local
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#103 - 2015-03-24 23:29:08 UTC
ImYourMom wrote:
remove gates as well then it will make sense to remove local



I totally agree.

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
Fondon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#104 - 2015-03-25 01:51:28 UTC
ImYourMom wrote:
remove gates as well then it will make sense to remove local


No gates, no local, no afk cloaking... what would be next? no off-grid boosting?
ITTigerClawIK
Galactic Rangers
#105 - 2015-03-25 02:24:04 UTC
i think local should stay for empire space including empire low and null sec as the empires control communications but for lawless and uncontrolled space it should not be there unless the entity that controls that space has the required building/upgrade for it in there space and even then only for the sov holder. but thats my opinion :)
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#106 - 2015-03-25 03:54:27 UTC
Fondon wrote:
ImYourMom wrote:
remove gates as well then it will make sense to remove local


No gates, no local, no afk cloaking... what would be next? no off-grid boosting?



I would not mind that, however, off grid boosting is skill derived/conditioned and not a stand alone, environmental mechanic.

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
Scira Crimson
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#107 - 2015-03-25 08:18:18 UTC
Daerrol wrote:
Local chat should be removed and turned into Constellation chat. It would work exactly like local, but it only narrows it down to 3-5 systems instead of 1. This should happen in Highsec too.


This is actually a pretty good idea!

First I was against removing local (because it makes self defense against dedicated ganker 100% impossible as there is no viable itemizsation against dedicated gankers) but also I might have misunderstood it: It was said about "delayed chat", but if the chat is completly removed it would also give protection to nongankers(it would make the D-Scan extremly valueable to spot combat probes)
I think a complete removal or constallation chat (instead of some "delayedlocal") would be fine.
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#108 - 2015-03-25 08:36:56 UTC
Gimme Sake wrote:
March rabbit wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:



No, I meant why they don't organize low/null sec mining fleet expeditions. In low all they need to do is hire some mercs to camp the gates. You can't stop gankers in high sec without getting concordokken but there's no such problem in low.

I guess the reason here is the same as why you don't see battleship roams around low-sec: each T2 mining barge adds 200+ Million ISK to killboard. If people detect fleet of such things you will be dropped and jump fatique won't matter here.
Even fleet of retrievers will get big attention.

And hiring mercs to camp gates? How much ISK you need to pay to such mercs? You really sure you can make comparable amount by mining in low-sec??? Shocked Add here risk that your mercs will be ganked too... This is low-sec.



Well yeah it's low sec, there are risks... there are also cynos and other mechanics that allow rapid deployment of ship and there's also the perspective of mercs doing what they do in hope of finding pvp content. As far as I know mercs are hired for a period of time, the bigger the mining fleet the faster you can mine and make profit and the lesser are the costs for hiring mercs. Perhaps those mining ops could be a merc initiative.

you missed part about low profitability of mining. It kills all the idea - you won't be able to pay to mercs from mining

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Arronicus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#109 - 2015-03-25 08:37:09 UTC
Gimme Sake wrote:

it is one things I found totally out of place in a space game.


Humans have flown all over, building stargates connecting every non-wormhole solar system we can visit. That is, every system we visit, has huge chunks of technology connecting them to one another. Big, massive stargates, that can propel us at ridiculous speeds across the galaxy. And you think that a few simple communication networks that simply identify who is in the vicinity of that system, and allows communication between those parties is out of place?

Local chat, or rather, solar system wide communication networks are quite possibly one of THE most realistic things about eve.

Whether or not you like local chat, whether you are happy or disappointed to see its partial removal, and readdition with the appropriate sov structures, claiming that it is out of place in space is downright silly. What it represents, solar system wide communication and detection, is one of the few things that we can absolutely say, if EVE were truly real, would exist.
Arronicus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#110 - 2015-03-25 08:39:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Arronicus
Gimme Sake wrote:
March rabbit wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:
Mr Epeen wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:

Beats me why miners do not organize themselves and establish mining fleet expeditions with hired mercs for protection, links, boosts and all sort of stuff. Gankers can organize themselves with eaze but "good guys" can't.


Gankers don't care about mercs. They are going to die anyway.

The only way to protect the miners would be to gank the gankers before they gank the miners. That is not only unlikely, but prohibitively expensive for the people hiring them. It's less expensive to just replace your Retriever and mark the guys who ganked you red so you'll see them next time before they're on grid.

There are effective means of avoiding ganks, but it requires being less lazy and putting up with slightly less yields. Something that just isn't going to happen very often given the raging entitlement of most MMO players these days.

Mr Epeen Cool



No, I meant why they don't organize low/null sec mining fleet expeditions. In low all they need to do is hire some mercs to camp the gates. You can't stop gankers in high sec without getting concordokken but there's no such problem in low.

I guess the reason here is the same as why you don't see battleship roams around low-sec: each T2 mining barge adds 200+ Million ISK to killboard. If people detect fleet of such things you will be dropped and jump fatique won't matter here.
Even fleet of retrievers will get big attention.

And hiring mercs to camp gates? How much ISK you need to pay to such mercs? You really sure you can make comparable amount by mining in low-sec??? Shocked Add here risk that your mercs will be ganked too... This is low-sec.



Well yeah it's low sec, there are risks... there are also cynos and other mechanics that allow rapid deployment of ship and there's also the perspective of mercs doing what they do in hope of finding pvp content. As far as I know mercs are hired for a period of time, the bigger the mining fleet the faster you can mine and make profit and the lesser are the costs for hiring mercs. Perhaps those mining ops could be a merc initiative.


Mercs dont work for free, and considering that mining is already the lowest paying profession in Eve for a non-brand new character, you're just digging further into your already small income source to mine in an area that is an absolute waste of time. There is no benefit to mining in lowsec over nullsec, but the dangers are FAR higher, and the potential rewards smaller. The only place more dangerous to mine is wormhole space, and the evidence shows that because of that, noone mines there. JUst 0.4% of ore mined in 2014 came from W-space, and 1.4% from Lowsec.


As for nullsec mining expeditions, sure. You could. You could also drive your car into the ocean to go fishing, but I wouldn't recommend that either.
Varathius
Enlightened Industries
Goonswarm Federation
#111 - 2015-03-25 09:27:02 UTC
Gimme Sake wrote:

How many of you wait (with excitement) for such an announcement from CCP in a near future? I sure do, it is one things I found totally out of place in a space game.

Also, how many of you would loathe/fear not being able to see "the reds" in local chat?


won't happen. Removing local will obviously mean much higher losses, and since most people in eve have already trouble to make isk or afford to buy plex, I do not see how the above real scenario I mentioned will benefit CCP. I am also surprised why nobody mentioned this earlier.

People that want no local, minimize local window and enjoy the game without local/
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#112 - 2015-03-25 09:30:11 UTC
March rabbit wrote:

you missed part about low profitability of mining. It kills all the idea - you won't be able to pay to mercs from mining



What about merc organized mining options (for miners) then? It would function on similar principle with space rental in some sov regions. You'd also have a pro active force unlike in high sec.

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#113 - 2015-03-25 09:36:19 UTC
Arronicus wrote:


And hiring mercs to camp gates? How much ISK you need to pay to such mercs? You really sure you can make comparable amount by mining in low-sec??? Shocked Add here risk that your mercs will be ganked too... This is low-sec.



If the mercs are afraid of being ganked then they probably should change their profession. I'm pretty sure a lot of players looking for pvp content would oblige for guard duty and even establish a permanent operation base in some low sec systems.

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#114 - 2015-03-25 09:40:10 UTC
Varathius wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:

How many of you wait (with excitement) for such an announcement from CCP in a near future? I sure do, it is one things I found totally out of place in a space game.

Also, how many of you would loathe/fear not being able to see "the reds" in local chat?


won't happen. Removing local will obviously mean much higher losses, and since most people in eve have already trouble to make isk or afford to buy plex, I do not see how the above real scenario I mentioned will benefit CCP. I am also surprised why nobody mentioned this earlier.

People that want no local, minimize local window and enjoy the game without local/



Perhaps it would benefit if the alternative options would be customizable player content.

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#115 - 2015-03-25 09:40:42 UTC
Gimme Sake wrote:
Arronicus wrote:


And hiring mercs to camp gates? How much ISK you need to pay to such mercs? You really sure you can make comparable amount by mining in low-sec??? Shocked Add here risk that your mercs will be ganked too... This is low-sec.



If the mercs are afraid of being ganked then they probably should change their profession. I'm pretty sure a lot of players looking for pvp content would oblige for guard duty and even establish a permanent operation base in some low sec systems.


why bother mining in lowsec and paying for protection when you can do it in highsec without having to pay mercs? doesnt make financial sense

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#116 - 2015-03-25 09:57:01 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:
Arronicus wrote:


And hiring mercs to camp gates? How much ISK you need to pay to such mercs? You really sure you can make comparable amount by mining in low-sec??? Shocked Add here risk that your mercs will be ganked too... This is low-sec.



If the mercs are afraid of being ganked then they probably should change their profession. I'm pretty sure a lot of players looking for pvp content would oblige for guard duty and even establish a permanent operation base in some low sec systems.


why bother mining in lowsec and paying for protection when you can do it in highsec without having to pay mercs? doesnt make financial sense



So you're saying Code don't always win?

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
Demons Hell
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#117 - 2015-03-25 10:03:21 UTC
i really not understand ppl want help ccp to destroy the game..

if u dont want local go in a wh....is easy.
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#118 - 2015-03-25 10:05:49 UTC
Demons Hell wrote:
i really not understand ppl want help ccp to destroy the game..

if u dont want local go in a wh....is easy.



Why go to a wh if I can make a wh come to me? Eh?

You suggest the whole game is the local chat?

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato
Lan Wang
Princess Aiko Hold My Hand
Safety. Net
#119 - 2015-03-25 10:05:50 UTC
Gimme Sake wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:
Arronicus wrote:


And hiring mercs to camp gates? How much ISK you need to pay to such mercs? You really sure you can make comparable amount by mining in low-sec??? Shocked Add here risk that your mercs will be ganked too... This is low-sec.



If the mercs are afraid of being ganked then they probably should change their profession. I'm pretty sure a lot of players looking for pvp content would oblige for guard duty and even establish a permanent operation base in some low sec systems.


why bother mining in lowsec and paying for protection when you can do it in highsec without having to pay mercs? doesnt make financial sense



So you're saying Code don't always win?


what are they suppose to be winning?

Domination Nephilim - Angel Cartel

Calm down miner. As you pointed out, people think they can get away with stuff they would not in rl... Like for example illegal mining... - Ima Wreckyou*
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#120 - 2015-03-25 10:07:16 UTC
Lan Wang wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:
Lan Wang wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:
Arronicus wrote:


And hiring mercs to camp gates? How much ISK you need to pay to such mercs? You really sure you can make comparable amount by mining in low-sec??? Shocked Add here risk that your mercs will be ganked too... This is low-sec.



If the mercs are afraid of being ganked then they probably should change their profession. I'm pretty sure a lot of players looking for pvp content would oblige for guard duty and even establish a permanent operation base in some low sec systems.


why bother mining in lowsec and paying for protection when you can do it in highsec without having to pay mercs? doesnt make financial sense



So you're saying Code don't always win?


what are they suppose to be winning?



The always.

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato