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Raven Navy Issue

Author
Duke Onzo
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1 - 2015-03-22 18:17:15 UTC
I am recently going into lvl 4 mission sec, and im goign to be using a raven navy issue.

I currently have no idea how to fit it and i need some help

High Slots
- 8x cruise missile launcher

Med slot
- 1 adaptive invul
- 2x specific damage type shield hardner
-1 specific shield hardner
-1 x-l large shield booster
-1 shield boost amp
-1 micro jump drive

Low slots
- 1 damage control
- 4x ballistic control systems

Rigs
- i have no idea what to put on rigs


I was thinking about removing the micro jump drive but i noticed that sometimes i can land on 0 in the mission and that can be bad.

also im aware that i will be controlling my rep cycle which means i need to gain capacitor faster then i need to do 1 cycle of my shield booster.

Please i would appreciate any advice.

Please no trolling i really need help!
Kiddoomer
The Red Sequence
#2 - 2015-03-22 18:34:22 UTC
2 rigors (missile rigs) are a good start, the third one could be a specific shield resistance or a capacitor control circuit.

In the name of Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen : “Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.”

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Infinite Pew
#3 - 2015-03-22 18:41:20 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Soooo... you have a lot of tank but no damage application mods. I would suggest cutting some of the tank (you don't need too much if you are going to be engaging from range) and slapping on some Target Painters and a Cap Booster.

Something like this...

[Raven Navy Issue, PvE]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Damage Control II
Co-Processor II

Large Micro Jump Drive
X-Large Shield Booster II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
(NPC specific hardener)
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800
Target Painter II
Target Painter II

Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Cruise Missile

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst I
Large Core Defense Capacitor Safeguard I

Warden II x3 (OR Curator x3)
Hobgoblin II x5


NOTES:

- The Rigor rigs are there for better damage application against smaller targets.

- You will have to swap out the Sentry Drones depending on the type of NPC you face. Wardens will be effective against pretty much everything except Amarr, Blood Raiders, and Rogue Drones.

- Try not to send out the Light Drones against targets more than 15km from you. They will die very easily if the NPCs primary them.
For the most part, Light Drones will be your primary means of point defense against NPC ships that your missiles will have trouble hitting. So take VERY good care of them.

- If you are taking too much damage for your Shield Booster to soak up, use the MicroJumpdrive to get away.

- In terms of fitting, your biggest issue will be CPU. You can "downgrade" some of the modules (like the Target Painters and Cap Booster) to Meta versions.

- Your range may be an issue. While the missiles can hit out to ~200+ kms you can only target stuff out to ~93 kms. So you may have to move around a little bit after you MJD.
Chris Winter
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
#4 - 2015-03-22 19:30:04 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:

...
Large Warhead Flare Catalyst I
Large Warhead Flare Catalyst I
Large Core Defense Capacitor Safeguard I
...

- The Flare rigs are also there for better damage application against smaller targets.

Don't do that. Flares don't help against smaller targets, they help against faster targets. Also, a Rigor I is always better for application than a Flare I. The Rigor helps against targets smaller than your missile's explosion radius (which the Flare doesn't), but also helps MORE against targets faster than your missile's explosion velocity than a Flare does.

Rules of thumb:
- Never fit a Flare I if you have calibration left for a Rigor I.
- Never fit a Flare II if you have calibration left for a Rigor II.
- If you're running low on calibration due to already having fit Rigor IIs, a Flare II will be slightly better than a Rigor I.
Duke Onzo
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#5 - 2015-03-22 20:00:42 UTC
Honestly I am trying to avoid cap boosters, anyway the fit looks great I'll consider it
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Infinite Pew
#6 - 2015-03-22 20:17:56 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Lol Chris. I always get confused between Flares and Rigors. I made the changes in my post.

Also Duke... Cap boosters are a FAR more efficient way of doing things because it allows a ship to be fitted for max performance within a given situation.

Fitting a ship for "cap stability" often requires deep sacrifices in terms of performance.

Also... shield boosters are not known for being "cap efficient." Mechanically they are "burst tankers."
stoicfaux
#7 - 2015-03-22 20:22:46 UTC
Chris Winter wrote:

Don't do that. Flares don't help against smaller targets, they help against faster targets.

Argh. Rigors and Flares have nothing to do with speed. Here are the missile damage formulas.

The first formula compares Explosion Radius against target sig radius. Only Rigors affect this.

The 2nd formula multiplies Target Sig / Explosion Radius * Explosion Velocity / Target Velocity. Both Rigors and Flares affect this. Furthermore since everything is multiplied, we really have:
S/E * Ve/Vt * 1 / (1-rigor bonus) * (1+flare bonus)
Thus Rigors and Flares are applied to both sig and speed in the 2nd missile formula.

The 2nd formula normally eclipses the 1st formula, so you can almost always ignore the fact that Flares have no impact on the first missile formula. (However, an exception would be when you're shooting at a very slow or stationary target with oversized missiles.)

In the context of the 2nd formula, a 15% Flare provides a 1 + .15 = 1.15 multiplier while a 15% Rigor provides a 1 / (1-.15) = 1.176 multiplier.

Quote:
Rules of thumb:
- Never fit a Flare I if you have calibration left for a Rigor I.
- Never fit a Flare II if you have calibration left for a Rigor II.
- If you're running low on calibration due to already having fit Rigor IIs, a Flare II will be slightly better than a Rigor I.

Correct. Unless you're shooting stationary targets with oversized missiles, Rigor II > Flare II > Rigor I > Flare I because
* Rigor II provides a 1 / (1-.2) = 1.25 bonus,
* Flare II provides a 1 + .2 = 1.20 bonus,
* Rigor I provides a 1 / (1 - .15) = 1.176 bonus
* Flare I provides a 1 + .15 = 1.15 bonus.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.

lolcorpholder alt
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2015-03-22 20:27:14 UTC  |  Edited by: lolcorpholder alt
My Raven was equipped with the following:

HIGH
06 x Cruise Missile Launcher I
01 x SMALL TRACTOR BEAM 1
01 x SALVAGER I

MEDIUM
04 x LARGE SHIELD EXTENDERS
01 x 'HYPHNOS' ECM
01 x MEDIUM SHIELD BOOSTER

LOW
01 x EMERGENCY DAMAGE CONTROL
01 x ARMOR KINETIC HARDENER I
01 x ARMOR THREMIC HARDENER I
02 x WARP CORE STABILIZER I

DRONES
02 x WARRIOR I DRONES
03 x HAMMERHEAD I DRONES

UPGRADES
01 x ROCKET FUEL CACHE PARTINTION I
01 x BAY LOADING ACCELERATOR I
01 x HYDRAULIC BAY THRUSTER I
Duke Onzo
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#9 - 2015-03-22 20:28:05 UTC
I will be using a pith x x-l which gives me roughly estimate of 1k per cycle so I might not need the shield amp
Chris Winter
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
#10 - 2015-03-22 21:49:32 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:
Chris Winter wrote:

Don't do that. Flares don't help against smaller targets, they help against faster targets.

Argh. Rigors and Flares have nothing to do with speed. Here are the missile damage formulas.

The first formula compares Explosion Radius against target sig radius. Only Rigors affect this.

The 2nd formula multiplies Target Sig / Explosion Radius * Explosion Velocity / Target Velocity. Both Rigors and Flares affect this. Furthermore since everything is multiplied, we really have:
S/E * Ve/Vt * 1 / (1-rigor bonus) * (1+flare bonus)
Thus Rigors and Flares are applied to both sig and speed in the 2nd missile formula.

The 2nd formula normally eclipses the 1st formula, so you can almost always ignore the fact that Flares have no impact on the first missile formula. (However, an exception would be when you're shooting at a very slow or stationary target with oversized missiles.)

In the context of the 2nd formula, a 15% Flare provides a 1 + .15 = 1.15 multiplier while a 15% Rigor provides a 1 / (1-.15) = 1.176 multiplier.

I am well aware of the formulas.

A rigor helps as long as you don't already have perfect application. If, for example, you're shooting a stationary frigate with a cruise missile, the rigor helps you apply damage better. A flare does nothing in this case.

A flare only helps if your target is moving faster the "minimum velocity factor" for its sig radius, as mentioned in the missile damage formula page.

I maintain that my statement that "flare's don't help against smaller targets, they help against faster targets" is true. It's also a much simpler way of phrasing it for people who may not want to delve into the formulas.
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#11 - 2015-03-22 21:58:33 UTC
Duke Onzo wrote:
I am recently going into lvl 4 mission sec, and im goign to be using a raven navy issue.

I currently have no idea how to fit it and i need some help

High Slots
- 8x cruise missile launcher

Med slot
- 1 adaptive invul
- 2x specific damage type shield hardner
-1 specific shield hardner
-1 x-l large shield booster
-1 shield boost amp
-1 micro jump drive

Low slots
- 1 damage control
- 4x ballistic control systems

Rigs
- i have no idea what to put on rigs


I was thinking about removing the micro jump drive but i noticed that sometimes i can land on 0 in the mission and that can be bad.

also im aware that i will be controlling my rep cycle which means i need to gain capacitor faster then i need to do 1 cycle of my shield booster.

Please i would appreciate any advice.

Please no trolling i really need help!

I do 3x rigor rigs on my ravens.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2015-03-22 22:01:48 UTC
lolcorpholder alt wrote:
My Raven was equipped with the following:

HIGH
06 x Cruise Missile Launcher I
01 x SMALL TRACTOR BEAM 1
01 x SALVAGER I

MEDIUM
04 x LARGE SHIELD EXTENDERS
01 x 'HYPHNOS' ECM
01 x MEDIUM SHIELD BOOSTER

LOW
01 x EMERGENCY DAMAGE CONTROL
01 x ARMOR KINETIC HARDENER I
01 x ARMOR THREMIC HARDENER I
02 x WARP CORE STABILIZER I

DRONES
02 x WARRIOR I DRONES
03 x HAMMERHEAD I DRONES

UPGRADES
01 x ROCKET FUEL CACHE PARTINTION I
01 x BAY LOADING ACCELERATOR I
01 x HYDRAULIC BAY THRUSTER I

Trains keep on rolling.
Trolls keep on trolling.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2015-03-22 22:03:41 UTC
If you plan on looting and salvaging, consider using Mobile Tractor Unit (MTU) (about 5-6 mil) and a hand of salvage drones.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

Celthric Kanerian
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#14 - 2015-03-22 22:32:37 UTC
What is it with people and that DCU? It's completely overrated.
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#15 - 2015-03-22 22:37:16 UTC
This is my CNR fit. the 3 target painters are probably excessive, but I haven't played with the damage formula enough to really know (also I will add I haven't flown my cnr in long enough to really know) probably best to drop one for an extra hardener, or prop mod. And if you are just starting out a MJD is a good choice for prop mod as it can get you out of trouble. In general I suggest limited use of MJDs as in many cases they reduce performance. however in some cases a MJD makes things go much quicker. something you will either learn on your own or learn from others.

change the drones to fit the mission. I like the sentries as they can instantly swap between targets I'm hitting, and can be useful in finishing NPCS off that my missiles leave in low structure. plus they can kill most npc frigs on approach.

and don't forget the hardwires I fly with these in 5% variations. buy whatever you can afford, 3% implants aren't all that expensive.
CM-6
MP-7
GP-8
TN-9
RL-10

I usually carry t2 fury ammo for most targets, and some caldari navy ammo for the elite cruisers. some auto-targeting missiles can be nice too. some missions I will MJD and just use auto-targeting missiles

[Raven Navy Issue, Mine]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System
Dread Guristas Ballistic Control System
Signal Amplifier II

Caldari Navy X-Large Shield Booster
Heavy Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Republic Fleet Target Painter
Republic Fleet Target Painter

Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile
Cruise Missile Launcher II, Mjolnir Fury Cruise Missile

Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Large Warhead Rigor Catalyst II
Large Warhead Flare Catalyst II

Hobgoblin II x5
Garde II x3

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#16 - 2015-03-23 00:30:32 UTC
Celthric Kanerian wrote:
What is it with people and that DCU? It's completely overrated.


not really much else to put in the 5th lowslot, and makes you more unattractive to gank. that said I prefer the signal amp for +scan res +lock range +2 targets. a drone damage amp seems like a decent idea too. I'm open to arguments for other mods, but those seem like the 3 best to me.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2015-03-23 00:47:11 UTC
eccm could be worth something if you're doing guristas a lot.
Caleidascope
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2015-03-23 00:47:55 UTC
Celthric Kanerian wrote:
What is it with people and that DCU? It's completely overrated.

You should see people bitching and moaning when they find out that I have more than 3 dps mods in low slots.

Life is short and dinner time is chancy

Eat dessert first!

RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
#19 - 2015-03-23 02:24:23 UTC  |  Edited by: RavenPaine
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Celthric Kanerian wrote:
What is it with people and that DCU? It's completely overrated.


not really much else to put in the 5th lowslot, and makes you more unattractive to gank. that said I prefer the signal amp for +scan res +lock range +2 targets. a drone damage amp seems like a decent idea too. I'm open to arguments for other mods, but those seem like the 3 best to me.


I use 3 Ballistic Controls and 2 Power Diagnostics II in my lows.
The Power Diagnostics x2 give me:
10% more shield hit points
17% faster shield recharge rate
10% more capacitor
17% faster capacitor recharge rate
12% more power grid

No Stacking penalty on this mod and the difference in tank is huge.
Caldari Navy version would do even better.
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#20 - 2015-03-23 04:08:28 UTC
ECCM is in the makes sense category, but in general I don't seem to find jamming as a problem.
A PDS gives a bunch of bonuses, but they are all bonuses I'm not really interested in on a CNR.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

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