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All logistics are important not just the gaurdian...
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Captain Robby
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2015-03-18 07:09:50 UTC
I keep seeing countless people saying guardian's are the best all other logistics are crap I have now clarified that is not true at all and if anyone does believe this they are ignorant as hell truth be told all logistics are important tools depending on the operation just how a doctor works when dealing with a patient.

Lets take a look at the ships we have at disposal.

Augoror (Armour + Cap Transmitter)
Osprey (Shield + Cap Transmitter)
Exequror (Armour + Logistic Drone bonus)
Scythe (Shield + Logistic Drone bonus)

As you can tell there are 2 pairings one the ones with cap transmitters are designed for bigger gangs due to the need to support other logistic ships of the same repairing type thus not requiring the need for cap stability in turn using those slots to become more harder to kill by nature. The other two are made for small gangs that don't have too many people in them wile having the ability to use drones to support a target that is damage but not primary and becoming cap stable with a reasonable tank using those repair mods that can inject huge amounts of shield or armour into themselves because they lack supporting logistic ships to make the repair's ( ccp need to allow drones to repair the ship that they came from Sad ).

Now about the very under used logistic frigs do infect have a place in these fleets lets see what we have and what makes them different from one and another.

Inquisitor (Armour Repair) slot allocation High 3 Med 2 low 4
Bantam (Shield Repair) slot allocation High 3 Med 4 low 2
Navitas (Armour Repair) slot allocation High 3 Med 3 Low 3
Burst (Shield Repair) slot allocation High 3 Med 3 Low 3

These ships benefit from anchoring onto the cruiser sized one's but depending on if you need to be more cap stable over more tank is your choice but as you can see by the information provided it is not the ship that can be classified as the best but rather flying the correct one for the correct gang that matters.
Sean Parisi
Blackrise Vanguard
#2 - 2015-03-18 10:06:26 UTC
Agility on logistic frigates should be increased. They align at almost the same pace as a freighter.
Kalihira
Ultramar Independent Contracting
#3 - 2015-03-18 13:35:33 UTC
what exactly is ur point? Yes, all logi have their place in eve....
Stalence
Caldari Colonial Defense Ministry
Templis CALSF
#4 - 2015-03-18 14:24:31 UTC
Not really sure what your point is...

Also not really sure why you're offering a T1 cruiser and frigate logi as an alternative to a T2 Logistics cruiser. All levels of logistics has its place and I know we field it all depending on fleet composition.

I think the only observations about "lack of balance" are the following:

Guardians and Basilisks are used more often than their cap stable counter parts but I think that's just makes sense. Maximum remote reps is often better than the slightly less powerful cap stable logi cruisers. Not to say the cap stable ones don't have their place when/if you have an odd man out logi pilot or if your enemy uses a lot of ECM.

Secondly, I concur with Sean above. The agility of frigate logistics is abysmal. Logi frigate bros should be on par with other frigates imo.

Member of #tweetfleet @stalence // Templis CALSF // YouTube Channel
Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#5 - 2015-03-18 15:00:18 UTC
Guardians are generally considered "the best" logi cruiser not because of their inherent stats, but because of the prevailing armor doctrines that many large groups use. The logi cruisers are pretty well balanced relative to each other, it's what everyone else is flying that generally determines their popularity.

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Captain Robby
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2015-03-18 17:56:13 UTC
Because of prejudgement vs any suggestion to flying the other logis just the other day I asked information of the gallente logi and the response's was distasteful at best how the guardian is so much better even when I explained that I mostly fly in gangs with 20 people tops and no one really wants to logi other then me so I made this post to show that there are more then 1 type of logi and not everyone should fly a army of guardian's or its tech 1 verant.
Paranoid Loyd
#7 - 2015-03-18 18:07:33 UTC
Sounds like you need to find a group that is more compatible with your style.

Nothing you posted is wrong but it's not a convincing argument in any way, nor will it change the minds of those you fly with.

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Captain Robby
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2015-03-18 18:14:26 UTC
i haven't heard any negativity to what i fly as a logi ship in game at this current time but more on the fact i was looking for information on improving myself as a logi person with asking for tips tricks advice and tactical data but when i did ask these sort of things it usually would be as i said before distasteful to anything that is not a guardian or its tech 1 type not sure if there trolling or not but its annoying...
Plato Forko
123 Fake Street
#9 - 2015-03-18 23:43:25 UTC
depends what the DPS is flying. if everyone around you is in 200m+ ISK ships and you're in a 20m Augoror then yeah, probably not going to be appreciated as much as the guys bringing out the Guardians
Xequecal
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2015-03-21 11:23:06 UTC
Bronson Hughes wrote:
Guardians are generally considered "the best" logi cruiser not because of their inherent stats, but because of the prevailing armor doctrines that many large groups use. The logi cruisers are pretty well balanced relative to each other, it's what everyone else is flying that generally determines their popularity.


Guardians are the best because you can put an ECCM on them and remove the main counter.
Aeryn Maricadie
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2015-03-22 05:18:16 UTC
Xequecal wrote:
Bronson Hughes wrote:
Guardians are generally considered "the best" logi cruiser not because of their inherent stats, but because of the prevailing armor doctrines that many large groups use. The logi cruisers are pretty well balanced relative to each other, it's what everyone else is flying that generally determines their popularity.


Guardians are the best because you can put an ECCM on them and remove the main counter.


Even with ECCM they are still rather vulnerable, especially in longer engagements since it only takes one jam to mess up the logi chain and lose reps for a while.