These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Could Eve benifit from an experience system?

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Zevina
Atomic Core Industries and Science
#61 - 2011-12-23 15:57:59 UTC
Nope definetly not. The Eve Online skill system is already the best. I hate this stupid grinding in other games.
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#62 - 2011-12-23 16:16:04 UTC
How to farm gunnery skills with this idea: Start a mission, get it down to the last rat, then fire a single Dual Light Beam Laser I loaded with Radio S at the rat. Almost anything could tank the damage output of that gun, and it would never need to be reloaded. Just let it run for however many hours you need until your extra SP quota is filled.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Lexmana
#63 - 2011-12-23 16:26:20 UTC
Why is it that so many wants to remove everything that is unique from EVE and replace it with everything that is bad in other MMO (e.g. XP grind, MT, voluntary PvP etc.)? Lack of imagination?
Aargolos
Estrale Frontiers
#64 - 2011-12-23 16:31:29 UTC
You already gain experience while playing the game, by playing the game.
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#65 - 2011-12-23 16:32:37 UTC
Lexmana wrote:
Why is it that so many wants to remove everything that is unique from EVE and replace it with everything that is bad in other MMO (e.g. XP grind, MT, voluntary PvP etc.)? Lack of imagination?

They have a vision of how games should work, and want to shoehorn Eve into that vision. I can't even really fault them for it; every game we play, we think of ways we'd like it to be better. it's human nature to always want to improve the things we use.

I'm not satisfied with the state of current game mechanics, and much prefer that CCP and the community focus on making those work better before we start asking for more stuff.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Revii Lagoon
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#66 - 2011-12-23 16:36:54 UTC
Guess what would happen if any sort of system even remotely in comparison was put into place, There would be massive riots and mass quitting of EVE by people, just like what happened in Incarna.
Flakey Foont
#67 - 2011-12-23 16:51:01 UTC
Jimi Crackcorn wrote:
Nothing major but I was thinking it'd be really cool if when you were training a specific skill, you could get a little bit of extra SP each time you used whatever that skill was for. So like if you were training Drones and you used your drones to perform a task you'd get a little sp for it, but ONLY if that was the skill that was actively training.

Obviously it wouldn't be much but it'd be something to give the people that actually do play the game a little edge over those people that just log in, queue skills, and log off and it might even give those people a reason to actually play vs afking. Of course the current mechanics wouldn't change at all, just something to add on top of it.

Is this a cool idea or am I just dumb?



Not dumb but you might have googled and seen this has been beaten to death in the past.
gfldex
#68 - 2011-12-23 17:09:24 UTC
Jimi Crackcorn wrote:
So because it couldn't work on all skills, it shouldn't be available for any.. that makes sense I guess. Case closed! Sorry for being so sarcastic tonight but damn. I didn't think one thread could attract so much stupid. I completely respect valid arguments, like Disdaine, you can at least tell she's thinking, but this is just sad.


Nice trolling attempt. I will even tell you how you are trolling. You ignore _halve_of_my_argument_ and that is that you _require_ to bot to be competitive. As a result there would be botable skills and skills that are not botable. You punish players twice. Those who don't want to bot and those who want to skill in fields that wont benefit themselfs much, like CEOs.

Any time you retreat to a personal attack you admit defeat. tyvm

If you take all the sand out of the box, only the cat poo will remain.
Topaz Sky
#69 - 2011-12-23 17:13:17 UTC
I would uninstall immediately. Then I would laugh at everyone stuck with the bots and people like the OP.
Cheimos
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#70 - 2011-12-23 18:26:00 UTC
To OP:

You look anemic

Under your Bacon Helmet.

You’re doing it wrong.
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#71 - 2011-12-23 18:38:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaroslav Unwanted
Drew Solaert wrote:
200th time I've seen this said.

200th time I've said "I'd just afk all day in a Apoc shooting a roid to level Large Pulse Spec to 5 for the shiggles"


go for it it will take just about 157 years. You sure will do it.. CoolBig smile
as per proposed system. But as i said its pointless at that range.
Marduk Nibiru
Chaos Delivery Systems
#72 - 2011-12-23 18:44:54 UTC
As I understand it, the "training" you are doing is actually a forced upload of experience into the brain. In other words, it actually restructures your neural network, strengthening the pathways toward your new skill. Actual experience would be quickly overridden/surpassed in such a system.

So it just doesn't fit the mythology.

It's also one of those things that yeah, is annoying, but keeps EvE worth playing. You can take a week off from eve and as long as you continue your skill queue you won't log back in to find all your friends in some other tier fighting at a level you can't even hope to participate in.

For the kiddies who can spend all day paying a game, I'm sure that sucks. They want instant gratification. I admit, sometimes I'm annoyed as well....waiting 2 weeks for T2 larges...ugh... but if everything comes instantly, nothing is worth working for. Further, this is really an adult game and adults have jobs....some of them do anyway. Jobs, lives, kids (ick), and sometimes want to go to the bar to get their drunk on rather than while playing a game.

So no, in the end I don't like the idea. The benefit you get in training your weapons is getting better at the game. This is enough and it's unlike most other MMO's out there where the ONLY difference between win and loose is how many XP/RP/whatever P you have.

Hell, just the other day I had a 2004 toon sitting in station talking smack because he was scared of my buddy's BC...my buddy who'd logged out of disgust at the dude's cowardice. "You don't attack a BS in a BC without backup, you can't be that stupid!" <- when people like that are flying around in well "trained" characters you know full well the real difference in this game is intellect and real playing experience, not SP.

Working as intended and frankly speaking it's working well. This is one area of the game I would NOT change.
Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#73 - 2011-12-23 18:45:06 UTC
Jimi Crackcorn wrote:
I didn't think one thread could attract so much stupid.

When you start off with a stupid idea expect stupid responses.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.
Jimi Crackcorn
Directed Evolution Corp
#74 - 2011-12-23 19:06:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Jimi Crackcorn
I swear, half the people here didn't even read half the posts, or use half of their brain before posting. Almost all of your dumbass arguments were put to rest before you even posted them. The main reason I can see for not doing this is that half the eve playerbase is afraid of change, which is fine, that's all you have to say. But just once again for the idiots:

1. You wouldn't have to grind, whatsoever. The current skill system would still be in the game. This would happen passively as you played the game. No grinding required, and there's no reason you'd have to go out and grind because it wouldn't be that much of a difference.

2. To the people who for whatever reason keep talking about asteroids, read all the posts on the first page, k?

3. It wouldn't stop all you afkers from afking, you're still gonna get your sp. I'm just gonna have a little more(like and hour more!)
.

4. Botters are gonna bot no matter what, that's no excuse to keep something from the game. It's an excuse for CCP to fix the problem of botting.

I don't understand where people keep getting that'd it'd be a gamebreaking amount of SP. This is how the grinding would go, 3 hours for 5 minutes. That would not be worth changing your current playstyle at all. It's just something meant to add up overtime forr the players that play the game. There's no instant gratification, there's no grinding.

I can't believe I was actually hoping for good points against this. At this point just please, read more than the thread title before posting.
Marduk Nibiru
Chaos Delivery Systems
#75 - 2011-12-23 19:22:41 UTC
Jimi Crackcorn wrote:

3. It wouldn't stop all you afkers from afking, you're still gonna get your sp. I'm just gonna have a little more(like and hour more!)
.


The difference between a +4 and a +5 implant is about 80mil ISK or more. That's how much people are willing to shell out for an hour.
Jimi Crackcorn
Directed Evolution Corp
#76 - 2011-12-23 19:25:53 UTC
Marduk Nibiru wrote:
Jimi Crackcorn wrote:

3. It wouldn't stop all you afkers from afking, you're still gonna get your sp. I'm just gonna have a little more(like and hour more!)
.


The difference between a +4 and a +5 implant is about 80mil ISK or more. That's how much people are willing to shell out for an hour.



But you have to think about how much time that 80 million isk is actually worth, not the time that the implant shaves off. Basically you're trading 30 minutes worth of isk for an hour worth of training. Good trade IMO. This system would be trading 3 hours worth of time for 5 minutes worth.
Covert Kitty
SRS Industries
#77 - 2011-12-23 21:22:56 UTC
Quote:
Quote:
no, just no. Eve is great because its the only game that doesnt have a gaytarded leveling system.


Well that's a very well thought out and persuasive post you've got there. I know it convinced me!

Sounds pretty good to me.

Grinding something to make some number go up is a horrible mechanic. Eve's success and appeal is derived from its sandbox approach and its system of risk/reward/social consequence. Personally, I think we should ditch the time based system and replace it with a more sophisticated clone/implant system. Skills could be manufactured through some process, and people build their clones out of that, and on podding of course loose all of it. In this way specialized clones could be created, higher skilled clones naturally being more expensive. This also makes it easier to balance various ships, and eliminates the long term inflation of skills.
Horatius Caul
Kitzless
#78 - 2011-12-23 21:56:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Horatius Caul
Nova Fox wrote:
There are those who say put this on the crew, so when crew dies you lose thier experince they provided.

Hmmm... now that could actually work...

Crew could develop certain bonuses over time. This would probably not be skill advancement increases, but something that can stack with skills - akin to rigs. It'd probably mainly be module activation cycle bonuses, capacitor usage, etc.

Larger ships would have more "crew slots" allowing you to have bigger bonuses or more different ones - like rigs.

If the ship is destroyed, the crew is lost. (like rigs... just kidding, I'll stop now) Or they have a very low chance of dropping as loot or salvage. Perhaps a 5%-20% chance for each "crew unit" dropping "intact" with its accrued skill, and/or a chance to produce a blank "crew unit" from salvaging a wreck.

If the crew is inactive for a certain period of time, it begins to lose its bonus, dwindling down to a blank slate.

Crew units would be tradeable on a personnel market. This would flatten the playing field, allowing people not interested in grinding to acquire the elite crews as well.

Amarrad - Amarr language project
Marduk Nibiru
Chaos Delivery Systems
#79 - 2011-12-23 21:59:16 UTC
Jimi Crackcorn wrote:
Marduk Nibiru wrote:
Jimi Crackcorn wrote:

3. It wouldn't stop all you afkers from afking, you're still gonna get your sp. I'm just gonna have a little more(like and hour more!)
.


The difference between a +4 and a +5 implant is about 80mil ISK or more. That's how much people are willing to shell out for an hour.



But you have to think about how much time that 80 million isk is actually worth, not the time that the implant shaves off. Basically you're trading 30 minutes worth of isk for an hour worth of training. Good trade IMO. This system would be trading 3 hours worth of time for 5 minutes worth.


OK, lets assume for a moment you can make this in such a manner. You end up with one of two conditions:

1) It makes a noticeable difference whether you grind for SP or not and thus you'll be spending the whole game grinding for SP in the best of conditions (no bots).

2) Nobody in their right mind would bother and thus it's just a waste of effort on the dev's part (and designing and implementing an entire new mechanic is a LOT of work so it better be worth the ******* bother).

So lets assume it makes a noticeable difference. The idea is that you toss Large Projectile 5 on the heap and you can go shoot stuff with big guns for a while to make a few extra SP. I'm on approx 3 hours per day, the skill I'm training has something like 300k SP, it's going to take 19days. So if I spend every amount of EvE time I have to shoot things I get to finish in 18.something.

Now, I'm assuming we have to spend some certain amount of our time shooting stuff. I can't just go shoot a rat in a belt, sit there for 3 hours, and get the credit, right? I have to be actively firing guns, spending ammo, etc... So, since some amount of those 3 hours is spend finding targets, I actually have to play for 4-5 doing nothing but grind.

Now that's if I'm grinding rats or something. I go to a system with a lot of rats and anomalies, they spawn instantly, I can spend 3/4 of my time actually firing large projectiles at something and hit it. Either that or I'm spamming lvl 4's.

God help the PvPer. He's going to get maybe 1 SP for his grind. There's not many places where you can actually shoot at other players for 5 hours straight without having to hide and/or hunt. The only place you could perhaps do this is some place out in 0.0 where you could have an alt sitting in a drake and just pound it all day long.

So, I can spend 2-3 weeks doing this every damn day in order to gain what, 1 hour off of my training time or something? Not even that?

My question is thus, why the hell would anyone want this??? Honestly, this sounds like the worst damn thing ever! What the holy ******* **** are you thinking??!! You would HAVE to be a robot to do this.

So then, at the level you're talking it's a total waste. The devs shouldn't even consider wasting any amount of effort on this at all. Even switching one like of code from "i" to "++i" would be too much.

On the other hand, if you make it actually useful. Perhaps I save a day or two...now you have a problem. Now it becomes NECESSARY to do that grind I just described. EvE becomes a ******* NPC grind fest. Granted, I do that from time to time for ISK, but to have to do it every time I log in or lose momentum.... If CCP ever does this, I will quit and never come back this time. All the apologies in the world, all the "finding our direction again" crap would not bring me back. Seriously.

Ergo, this is the dumbest ******* idea I've ever heard. QED. Check mate and all that crap. **** this idea. In the butt....with a spinefish.
Vertisce Soritenshi
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#80 - 2011-12-23 22:05:02 UTC
EvE already has experience points in the game. They are called SP or Skill Points. Get out there and do some PvP and you will gain experience...

Bounties for all! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2279821#post2279821