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EVE vs Star Trek: Science & Politics

Author
Vulxanis Viceroy
Offworld Trading Company
Khimi Harar
#21 - 2015-03-08 22:26:59 UTC
Eija-Riitta Veitonen wrote:
Vulxanis Viceroy wrote:
Lapetan titans are most certainly some of the most powerful war machines ever conceived in a fictional universe lol but do you think that it would actually ever get to that point?

It's IAPETAN (capital i, not lowercase L).


Um, ok... well that doesn't really change my point lol Iapetans are still pretty powerful. Do you think they would ever be pulled out in an engagement? Keep in mind that every one of the empires has at least one, and are afraid of the other empire bringing theirs onto the field, similarly to nukes.

In Character: Only responds to "Lord Draconis"

Pronounced "Vulzanis"

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Eridanix
Absolute Order
Absolute Honor
#22 - 2015-03-14 08:25:35 UTC
Vulxanis Viceroy wrote:
Soren Tyrhanos wrote:
I don't know about teleportation..... but if you consider Dust 514 actual canon we do have something very similar in the Drop Uplink.

"The drop uplink is a slave transponder, a short-range tether that produces the precise spatial coordinates necessary to generate a localised wormhole, traversal of which allows the user to travel short distances instantly. Highly experimental, the process is excruciatingly painful and exposes organic tissue to excessive radiation, resulting in accelerated cellular decay and, ultimately, death."

Regardless of whether or not you do you'd certainly never expect the crew of the USS Enterprise to EVER use one of these.


Lol that is a very good point. I hadn't considered that. Do you think that if the two sides met they may try to exchange technologies? Dust mercs clone technology would probably certainly interest the war mongers of ST imo.

Amrthis wrote:
Well I'd like to tackle the who would win in a war.

I think this prize goes to eve. Ships even sub caps are bigger than anything the federation fields, not to eve mention our caps and supers, much less the apocaliptic effects of titan doomsday. Plus the federation doesn't have the ability to reinforce like we do, and every loss they would suffer would cost an experienced crew making a prolonged war look like vets vs noobs at the end.


I'm not disagreeing with you lol but what about if both entire universes had to react to this discovery? What sides would work together? What would not work? Would ST even have a chance? Would sides from both universes work together? EG, Sansha and Romulans??

Ibrahim Tash-Murkon wrote:
If the single goal on both sides was conquest the best strategy for the Federation would be to get a fleet of self-sufficient ships to cross the wormhole and attempt to warp to an uninhabited part of New Eden to establish an industrial base and a place from which to launch hit and run tactics on nearby systems. Considering the limited industrial capability of the Federation I think the strategy would ultimately fail as a result of attrition and the inability to keep such a location supplied (even if they could gather resources locally they're going to have to start an ambitious breeding program to replenish manpower). The best strategy for whatever New Eden force crosses the wormhole would be to establish local dominance, building up a large fleet for the subsequent invasion, and either slow boating gates to strategic systems (a place which would take such an impractically long time that any "invaders" would be the great-great-grand-somethings of the original crew) or hoping to seize enough Federation starships to warp cynos or other travel infrastructure to the aforementioned systems.

I think a successful Federation incursion into New Eden is, on the face, impossible. A successful incursion by New Eden forces seems more likely but might be slow though, with a little luck securing Federation warp-capable vessels, doable. It comes down to whether the Federation can overcome their industrial/technological disadvantage before New Eden can solve its travel problem.


I really like your analysis, but what about if another one of the races felt like fighting? EG, the Romulans or Klingons wanted to invade New Eden. Plus the Federation isn't known for its aggressive tactics, and the movie "Star Trek: Into Darkness" makes it clear that the Federation is not designed for war in any way shape or form aside from defensive. They are not focused on war at all if it can be helped.

However, many races in ST would probably relish the challenge imo.

Also I'm curious as to what people think the political ramifications would be if ST and EVE made contact. How would the Amarr react? The Caldari? The Gallente Federation discovers another Federation?? Would the Gallente and the Federation find common ground and try to make an alliance? What would the Minmatar think of the Klingons?

What about the Romulans? Would they try to use this as an attempt to make a move on the ST federation? Would the Klingons switch sides?


The Minmatars would think the Klingons are kind and polite people who really know "what is all about" but as former Slaves Minmatar would start a fast Operation on Containment and Psychological Warfare - even if they connect and communicate to eachother -, the Minmatar would not trust Klingons as they don't trust anyone anymore, but Gallente, as it's an Enlightened Good Nation.
Eridanix
Absolute Order
Absolute Honor
#23 - 2015-03-14 08:29:32 UTC
Eridanix wrote:
Vulxanis Viceroy wrote:
Soren Tyrhanos wrote:
I don't know about teleportation..... but if you consider Dust 514 actual canon we do have something very similar in the Drop Uplink.

"The drop uplink is a slave transponder, a short-range tether that produces the precise spatial coordinates necessary to generate a localised wormhole, traversal of which allows the user to travel short distances instantly. Highly experimental, the process is excruciatingly painful and exposes organic tissue to excessive radiation, resulting in accelerated cellular decay and, ultimately, death."

Regardless of whether or not you do you'd certainly never expect the crew of the USS Enterprise to EVER use one of these.


Lol that is a very good point. I hadn't considered that. Do you think that if the two sides met they may try to exchange technologies? Dust mercs clone technology would probably certainly interest the war mongers of ST imo.

Amrthis wrote:
Well I'd like to tackle the who would win in a war.

I think this prize goes to eve. Ships even sub caps are bigger than anything the federation fields, not to eve mention our caps and supers, much less the apocaliptic effects of titan doomsday. Plus the federation doesn't have the ability to reinforce like we do, and every loss they would suffer would cost an experienced crew making a prolonged war look like vets vs noobs at the end.


I'm not disagreeing with you lol but what about if both entire universes had to react to this discovery? What sides would work together? What would not work? Would ST even have a chance? Would sides from both universes work together? EG, Sansha and Romulans??

Ibrahim Tash-Murkon wrote:
If the single goal on both sides was conquest the best strategy for the Federation would be to get a fleet of self-sufficient ships to cross the wormhole and attempt to warp to an uninhabited part of New Eden to establish an industrial base and a place from which to launch hit and run tactics on nearby systems. Considering the limited industrial capability of the Federation I think the strategy would ultimately fail as a result of attrition and the inability to keep such a location supplied (even if they could gather resources locally they're going to have to start an ambitious breeding program to replenish manpower). The best strategy for whatever New Eden force crosses the wormhole would be to establish local dominance, building up a large fleet for the subsequent invasion, and either slow boating gates to strategic systems (a place which would take such an impractically long time that any "invaders" would be the great-great-grand-somethings of the original crew) or hoping to seize enough Federation starships to warp cynos or other travel infrastructure to the aforementioned systems.

I think a successful Federation incursion into New Eden is, on the face, impossible. A successful incursion by New Eden forces seems more likely but might be slow though, with a little luck securing Federation warp-capable vessels, doable. It comes down to whether the Federation can overcome their industrial/technological disadvantage before New Eden can solve its travel problem.


I really like your analysis, but what about if another one of the races felt like fighting? EG, the Romulans or Klingons wanted to invade New Eden. Plus the Federation isn't known for its aggressive tactics, and the movie "Star Trek: Into Darkness" makes it clear that the Federation is not designed for war in any way shape or form aside from defensive. They are not focused on war at all if it can be helped.

However, many races in ST would probably relish the challenge imo.

Also I'm curious as to what people think the political ramifications would be if ST and EVE made contact. How would the Amarr react? The Caldari? The Gallente Federation discovers another Federation?? Would the Gallente and the Federation find common ground and try to make an alliance? What would the Minmatar think of the Klingons?

What about the Romulans? Would they try to use this as an attempt to make a move on the ST federation? Would the Klingons switch sides?


The Minmatars would think the Klingons are kind and polite people who really know "what is all about" but as former Slaves Minmatar would start a fast Operation on Containment and Psychological Warfare - even if they connect and communicate to eachother -, the Minmatar would not trust Klingons as they don't trust anyone anymore, but Gallente, as it's an Enlightened Good Nation.


The Gallente Federation any Vessel and Information about the ST Federation, working on High Intel, and maybe they would stablish communications, but never and arrangement or Alliance, as the ST Federation could probably be seen as an external factor and a threat, which would be irrational to show to the other Empires, who in regard of it all, would avoid ST Federation or just hammer them down to death at sight.
Eridanix
Absolute Order
Absolute Honor
#24 - 2015-03-14 08:31:16 UTC
Eridanix wrote:
Vulxanis Viceroy wrote:
Soren Tyrhanos wrote:
I don't know about teleportation..... but if you consider Dust 514 actual canon we do have something very similar in the Drop Uplink.

"The drop uplink is a slave transponder, a short-range tether that produces the precise spatial coordinates necessary to generate a localised wormhole, traversal of which allows the user to travel short distances instantly. Highly experimental, the process is excruciatingly painful and exposes organic tissue to excessive radiation, resulting in accelerated cellular decay and, ultimately, death."

Regardless of whether or not you do you'd certainly never expect the crew of the USS Enterprise to EVER use one of these.


Lol that is a very good point. I hadn't considered that. Do you think that if the two sides met they may try to exchange technologies? Dust mercs clone technology would probably certainly interest the war mongers of ST imo.

Amrthis wrote:
Well I'd like to tackle the who would win in a war.

I think this prize goes to eve. Ships even sub caps are bigger than anything the federation fields, not to eve mention our caps and supers, much less the apocaliptic effects of titan doomsday. Plus the federation doesn't have the ability to reinforce like we do, and every loss they would suffer would cost an experienced crew making a prolonged war look like vets vs noobs at the end.


I'm not disagreeing with you lol but what about if both entire universes had to react to this discovery? What sides would work together? What would not work? Would ST even have a chance? Would sides from both universes work together? EG, Sansha and Romulans??

Ibrahim Tash-Murkon wrote:
If the single goal on both sides was conquest the best strategy for the Federation would be to get a fleet of self-sufficient ships to cross the wormhole and attempt to warp to an uninhabited part of New Eden to establish an industrial base and a place from which to launch hit and run tactics on nearby systems. Considering the limited industrial capability of the Federation I think the strategy would ultimately fail as a result of attrition and the inability to keep such a location supplied (even if they could gather resources locally they're going to have to start an ambitious breeding program to replenish manpower). The best strategy for whatever New Eden force crosses the wormhole would be to establish local dominance, building up a large fleet for the subsequent invasion, and either slow boating gates to strategic systems (a place which would take such an impractically long time that any "invaders" would be the great-great-grand-somethings of the original crew) or hoping to seize enough Federation starships to warp cynos or other travel infrastructure to the aforementioned systems.

I think a successful Federation incursion into New Eden is, on the face, impossible. A successful incursion by New Eden forces seems more likely but might be slow though, with a little luck securing Federation warp-capable vessels, doable. It comes down to whether the Federation can overcome their industrial/technological disadvantage before New Eden can solve its travel problem.


I really like your analysis, but what about if another one of the races felt like fighting? EG, the Romulans or Klingons wanted to invade New Eden. Plus the Federation isn't known for its aggressive tactics, and the movie "Star Trek: Into Darkness" makes it clear that the Federation is not designed for war in any way shape or form aside from defensive. They are not focused on war at all if it can be helped.

However, many races in ST would probably relish the challenge imo.

Also I'm curious as to what people think the political ramifications would be if ST and EVE made contact. How would the Amarr react? The Caldari? The Gallente Federation discovers another Federation?? Would the Gallente and the Federation find common ground and try to make an alliance? What would the Minmatar think of the Klingons?

What about the Romulans? Would they try to use this as an attempt to make a move on the ST federation? Would the Klingons switch sides?


The Minmatars would think the Klingons are kind and polite people who really know "what is all about" but as former Slaves Minmatar would start a fast Operation on Containment and Psychological Warfare - even if they connect and communicate to eachother -, the Minmatar would not trust Klingons as they don't trust anyone anymore, but Gallente, as it's an Enlightened Good Nation.


The Gallente Federation would research and achieve to categorize any Vessel and Information about the ST Federation, working on High Intel, and maybe they would stablish communications, but never and arrangement or Alliance, as the ST Federation could probably be seen as an external factor and a threat, which would be irrational to show to the other Empires, who in regard of it all, would avoid ST Federation or just hammer them down to death at sight.
Eija-Riitta Veitonen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#25 - 2015-03-14 20:34:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Eija-Riitta Veitonen
Vulxanis Viceroy wrote:
Eija-Riitta Veitonen wrote:
Vulxanis Viceroy wrote:
Lapetan titans are most certainly some of the most powerful war machines ever conceived in a fictional universe lol but do you think that it would actually ever get to that point?

It's IAPETAN (capital i, not lowercase L).


Um, ok... well that doesn't really change my point lol Iapetans are still pretty powerful. Do you think they would ever be pulled out in an engagement? Keep in mind that every one of the empires has at least one, and are afraid of the other empire bringing theirs onto the field, similarly to nukes.

According to CCP Falcon "During Operation Highlander, the Federation Navy had its entire capital group of Soltueur-class titans on standby as a last resort to provide fire support to the fleet that challenged CN Shiigeru in orbit of Caldari Prime.". I would say they'd be willing to use it against external threat, were it deemed necessary.
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