Player Features and Ideas Discussion

I figured I'd put this out there, but part of the extreme bordom of EvE is being stuck in one place.
The skill that changed jump clone timers was a nice touch, but this brings the point. What
is the point of long jump clone timers in the first place. What does it acomplish.
WIth the changes in Pheobe, power projection across the galaxy with capital ships has been
significantly reduced. Additionally, a player can no longer pod themselves and wake up in a new
area instantly. I don't why CCP thought this needed to be changed. Yes a player could get around jump
fatigue by podding to a new location close to the capital ship for use; however, the capital ship would already need
to be in position.

All in all the phoebe changes were a signifcant nerf to capsuleer mobility. This was never really a problem outside of
capital abuse. I don't really know why CCP does a lot of things; however, I believe that a small and easy to make the game
more accessible is to reduce jump clone timers. When someone logs on to play EvE they may want to play for a day.
However, if they want to do multiple things in null sec with multiple clones, they literally have to wait almost another day.
In its current iteration, EvE is very attrition based. For some reason or another trying to "acomplish a task" is hard because of a combination of "potentially flawed" in game mechanics and an infinite supply of bloodthirsty pilots.

I believe this is why many PvP environments are stagnant. People don't want to take risk not only from a Isk lost standpoint
but also from a time lost standpoint. If I want to PvP in my t1 cruiser knowing I will probably loose it I am more willing to take
that risk or even throw away multiple cruisers if I know in a couple of hours (4 or 5) I can pod back to my main clone.
However, if I know it will be a full day before I can even get back to my main, (learning, travel, capital pilot or both) clone, I
really don't wanna undock at all.

I think that CCP fails to understand that there game has been optimized to the core elements. So much so that the people who have optimized it (Goons and PL) are bored to death. They want someone to fight but know one wants to fight them because it is such a significant task on not only Isk but real game time to do so. People WANT to fight. There are so many small scale low sec PvP groups; however, in current game mechanics it is a long and daunting task to burn around looking for someone only to be killed while blind-sighted.

I argue that reducing clone Jump Fatigue does not 100% solve this problem; however, it allows people in EvE to PvP
without being pigeonholed into a situtation so compromising that a full day of "play time" is lost.

Example one: You are a good bro you go out solo in a small gang looking for a fight. You (probably will) die like a bro might get some respect and get podded.

Your options are to BURN all the way back to a PvP zone from high sec or an area where you are taking care of other things to the PvP zone and fight with a new clone.

Or with a 5 hour timer, you can jump there spending less daunting time burning and more time PvPing.

Finally, I deal with the obvious argument " YOu can just set your home clone or jump clone to the PvP zone"
I think in EvE we see that players are divided into industrialists and PvPers as a label.
I argue that this is less because of a decision and more about accessiblity.
Yes you can have 10 jump clones; however, you have to either set them up properly or
have 8.0 standings with multiple NPC corps in order to be to travel from 1 job : industry
to another job PvP. You could pvp where your industry is but that is not always avaible.
Particularly because it would be stupid to set up PVP next to a hotzone unless you are in a null block.
If you are not in a null block, the logistics of traversing to PVP areas is daunting and setting up multiple clones
(each requireing a day wait) (20hrs whatever) is also daunting. Clone jumping does not restrict game play; it just
exacerbates a game of already daunting grind.

My last point is to build on my previous point that industrialists dont want to PvP. I am an industrialist. Primarily to try
to support my PvP. However, managing both simultaneously is quite difficult.
When I log on to PvP I want to PvP, but I don't want to be trapped away from my industry clones for a long period of time.
Nor do I want to be stuck in some far away PvP zone for an extended period. I know I can get an alt to do both but
I don't want to pay for both. Anyway take it or leave it.

It makes sense in a twisted way. Unfortunately, it's also about 6 months too late to be part of a meaningful conversation.

Rapid long distance JC switching is a significant method of force projection in the current EVE.

CCP specifically said that they were not going to lower the JC timer because they wanted to keep people from jumping from place to place several times a day in order to stamp out hotspots.

And I agree with that.
-1

P.S: If you base in your PvP area, then you don't have much to travel after dying.

Ugg this is ********.
Force projection is a word.
The problem wasn't force projection, it was projection with
huge fleets of slowcats / wreckingball

If you have a lot of pilots you can already travel through wormholes and Thera to get places fast with a lot of guys.
YOu aren't going to jump your whole alliance to one area and then change to another area fast enough for jump clones
to be significant. No deployment is less than a day.

The bottom line, the "force projection argument is COMPLETELY IRRLIVANT"
Because no alliance is going to TAKE THE TIME TO PROJECT THE FORCE IN MASS IN WAY OF JUMP CLONES FOR LESS
than a day.

The ONLY thing you MAY have a semi-reasonable argument for is a shorter (like 4-5 hour) timer on switching clones for different implants in the same station.

This is a game where you have to plan ahead to get ahead, and the decisions you make have lasting consequences... if you dont like that go back to WoW

PS force projection of massive fleets is exactly how alliances would use a short JC timer. People in large alliances would simply be required to save their JCs or be kicked from the alliance.

I believe that poor organisation, time management and apathy are insufficient as justifications for such a change while the increased ability to project force such a change would herald is certainly a reasonable objection to it.

Not supported.

^^ This pretty much. Power projection just recently was scaled back a bit for a very good reason. Making changes to further power projection is just shooting yourself in the foot.

While not a bad idea, I still would insist on the elimination of ranged clone jumps completely.

I cannot find any reason why we should be allowed to teleport anywhere, largely because it is directly avoiding the risk of undocking from where you yourself decided to dock, but also because it makes travel trivial and allows force projection as has been stated as well.


"Hearthstone" teleportation mechanics belong in theme park games where the go to motto is instant gratification, not sandboxes where consequences for one's actions should be the bottom line to create value for the game world.

May I butt in with a suggestion of my own?

Make jump clone timers similar to jump fatigue timers. Except no complicated primary and secondary cool-offs. How I imagined it would go like this....

Because there's something in the game code currently prohibiting same-station clones, let's not mess with that if we don't have to. Instead...jumping clones within the same solar system = no cooldown. Every one jump away that jump clone is, however, results in a two-hour increase in jumping fatigue, up to the current 24 hour mark. Jump to a clone 3 jumps away, BAM! 6 hours before you can jump back.

This gives players some flexibility in how they handle their jump clones, while retaining the timer to prevent abuse.

Edit: apparently someone already stated a similar idea, but I won't delete this post because I did put in a solid number (2 hour fatigue per number of jumps between jump locations) to discuss the merits of said idea.

I'm ok with 12 hours clone jump timer, but not 5 hours... Thats just too short. It's also ok to do the reduction by skills.
I'm an excessive clone jump user since I do jump from Provi to High sec very often and I have multiple clones in different parts of high sec and 0.0 too. A 5 hour timer reduction would be a great great great benefit for me then. But I see a lot of game breaking potential in that. One of those would be making eve appear very small.

What I'm ok with though is an emergency clone jump. This would enable you to clone jump even though the clone jump timer is still running. The downside would be that you lose SP. Preferably the SP of the "Emergency clone jump" skill.