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CCP Changes

First post
Author
Styphon the Black
Forced Euthanasia
#21 - 2015-03-02 21:55:05 UTC
Phig Neutron wrote:
ergherhdfgh wrote:
So now let's say if Goons come up with a new ship doctrine and one specific ship get used a lot more all of the sudden just because it's a required ship by some huge alliance that accounts for large amounts of PvP and that ship sees a lot more action as a result, that ship now will get nerfed just based on the fact that a lot of people are flying it. It does not matter if the ship is over powered or dead even perfectly balanced.


Are you honestly trying to argue that Ishtars, Tengus, or offgrid carriers only seem to be overpowered because Goons have them as a doctrine or something? Whining about a nerf to your favorite ship, because it's your favorite ship, is not a good preface to a couple posts down where you argue that CCP developers are myopic while you personally take a holistic global view of game balance.


I actually have no problem with Ishtars, Tengus etc... I don't even fly them. So it isn't in my interest to keep things better for those pilots.

I do have a problem with changing a ship, mechanic or piece of equipment so much so that it makes using it a dumb choice. There is always going to be something that is considered "overpowered" in comparision with the current meta of the day. I just don't like it when players spend lots of time and effort training to have that time and investment made almost of no value by a Dev update.

Btw - Medium Rails guns are used on a lot more than just the few ships that are OP and making their damage stats seem out of norms. It is more a problem with "Tengu, Eagle and Vulture" than it is with the railgun itself being OP.
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#22 - 2015-03-02 21:59:26 UTC
I smell the scent of an ISD.
I hear the sound of keys.

Lock is imminent.



OP.

Stop QQ-ing. If you don't like the game, stop playing, you won't be missed by anybody.

Or shrug it off and play...and stop your 12 year old whiny tantrum.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

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ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#23 - 2015-03-03 04:03:03 UTC
Phig Neutron wrote:


Are you honestly trying to argue that Ishtars, Tengus, or offgrid carriers only seem to be overpowered because Goons have them as a doctrine or something? Whining about a nerf to your favorite ship, because it's your favorite ship, is not a good preface to a couple posts down where you argue that CCP developers are myopic while you personally take a holistic global view of game balance.

No I was not trying to say that.

If you look at the Dev post the main piece of data that they are using to determine what needs to be nerfed is how much damage that ship or weapon system does in PvP as compared to everything else. So if one ship looked very pretty and everyone flew that ship because it looked pretty CCP would see that ship doing the most damage because everyone is flying it. So according to CCP that ship would need to be nerfed to a point where it was not Flavor of the month anymore. So even if the ship is not over popwered it will still get nerfed just because it gets used "too much".

As far as whinning about my favorite ship getting nerfed none of my favorite ships have been touched so that is not at all the case.As a matter of fact one of my favorite ships just got a slight buff in the last round of balancing and I bitched about that as well. It's the balancing that I don't like. I watched this attempt to create a "balanced" game destroy WoW and I'm watching it destroy Eve. I've said that from when they first started discussing the tiericide and I'll say it today.

As far as me accusing the devs of being myopic I don't believe that is what I did. I said that they were good at making the game and players were good at playing the game. I argued that the people that played the game were in a better position to speak about balance than the ones making the game and I think that if you compare blogs from elite gamers and the devs of those games when discussing upcoming changes that more often the elite gamers are more correct than the devs.

As far as my holistic global view of game balance what other kind is there?

As far as my take on the changes to ishtars, tengus and off grid fighter assists, I don't PvP and I don't fly ishtars much, never been in a tengu and never used a carrier for anything other than moving ships around. I did comment on the changes in the appropriate forum thread however and when I did I commented on CCPs own comments. They by their own admission are nerfing things that are already well balanced strictly because too many people are flying them. I also found it funny that they had a problem with rails being used the most when 2 races use hybrids when projectiles and lazors are only used by one race so based on just that alone hybrids should be used twice as much anyway.

Want to talk? Join Cara's channel in game: House Forelli

Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#24 - 2015-03-03 04:26:33 UTC
Kneejerk responses to player behavior.
Orlacc
#25 - 2015-03-03 04:29:45 UTC
Styphon the Black wrote:
Phig Neutron wrote:
[quote=ergherhdfgh]while you personally take a holistic global view of game balance.

I actually have no problem with Ishtars, Tengus etc... I don't even fly them.



So to distill, it's all about you. Quaint.

"Measure Twice, Cut Once."

ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#26 - 2015-03-03 04:31:49 UTC
Like the OP I don't have a problem with a ship performing better than other ships at a given task. If I want to do that task I'll just skill up for that ship. This is not WoW I'm not locked into some class or some race or something like that. I have no issues adapting to the game.

Like the OP I take issue with me training up for something because everyone says it's good for what ever I'm trying to do just to have that ship or module or what ever get nerfed right as I'm about to jump into one. I'll adapt to the game that's fine. But when I remap and move my training around to get skilled up for a specific ship and then have that ship nerfed wasting my past few months training and the whole point of my current remap that pisses me off and it has happened to me more than once.

What I do take issue with on my own, outside the OPs comments, is that in this game where anyone can fly anything how can anyone claim anything is OP. If that ship is so awesome that you can't beat it in anything else then fly that ship. There is nothing stopping you from training up for it. Too often in other games I've seen people come to the forums an whine that everyone is OP and their class is underpowered. Mind you I don't PvP but when I see hunters complaining that priests are overpowered and priests complaining that hunters are overpowered I just feel the need to ask those people "did you ever consider that maybe you aren't as good at this game as you think you are and that you are loosing to better players not better characters?".

In this game where anyone can fly anything it seems like an even more appropriate question to ask "If the Flavor Of The Month ship is so OP then why not just fly one?". My guess is that those players are afraid that if they do fly the flavor of the month and still can't win that they'd have to admit that they just aren't that good because they'd have nothing else to blame it on. So instead of putting themselves to the test in that way they'd rather just complain that it's the game.

Eve isn't a game about fair fights anyway which makes the concept of ship balance even more of a joke. I can see people complaining about balance in a ranked 3 v 3 queueable arena match but in eve those tears make no sense.

Want to talk? Join Cara's channel in game: House Forelli

ergherhdfgh
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#27 - 2015-03-03 04:34:06 UTC
Orlacc wrote:


So to distill, it's all about you. Quaint.

Are you suggesting that he should play this game for someone else's enjoyment?

Want to talk? Join Cara's channel in game: House Forelli

Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#28 - 2015-03-03 04:41:23 UTC
Essentially they won't stop until every ship performs identically to a T1 cruiser or frigate.
Egdald Eriker
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#29 - 2015-03-03 04:46:01 UTC
Because it's easier to fix 2 things than it is to fix 80 things.
And because constantly buffing everything would result in PvE being better, meaning more isk into the economy.
And because then you'd need to buff the health of everything, so that logistics doesn't become useless because rookie ships could alpha damnations.
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#30 - 2015-03-03 05:44:50 UTC
Quote:

Forum rules

5. Trolling is prohibited.

Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive, and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote.


Thread closed.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Senior Lead

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

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