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battleship pass

Author
Catherine Laartii
Doomheim
#21 - 2015-02-26 21:17:43 UTC
Odethia wrote:
Rather than pursuing this ridiculous power creep, lets just nerf the OP T2/T3 and Pirate cruisers and Tactical destroyers.

Battleships need love BECAUSE of how OP small gang has become. The problem lies more squarely with t2 cruisers and logi than with pirate cruisers and tac dessies. Hacs like the ishtar need the nerf hammer hard.
Celthric Kanerian
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#22 - 2015-02-26 22:32:14 UTC
Catherine Laartii wrote:


  • Dropping a mid on the Abaddon for an 8th low along with giving it a solid 25% boost in cap regen and rounding the cap amount out to 9500 (with max skills) sounds excellent; it excels as a line battleship, and augmenting that role would be perfect for it. 30km extra targeting range seems like a nice addition, as well as helping further offset the loss of the 4th mid.
  • .


    This idea alone made me wonder if you were actually serious or simply trolling.

    I read it like this: First we get a doughnut, then we get into a car and grab soda and bacon and ice cream then to make it even more fun we throw toilet paper at the neighbours house but that's not the best thing while doing it we would listen to really loud music and wake up all the neighbours.

    Idea after idea after idea... Makes you sound childish and as if you didn't have a genuine idea but simply came up with bit by bit while writing.
    FireFrenzy
    Cynosural Samurai
    #23 - 2015-02-26 23:01:37 UTC
    I dont think we should be fiddling with the tempest's slot layout... The double utility highs and 5 mids are pretty awesome in my opinion.

    Have you checked Baboli's "making battleships worth the warp" thread? It's got some really indepth math and some VERY reasonable suggestions..
    Zan Shiro
    Doomheim
    #24 - 2015-02-26 23:20:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Zan Shiro
    Odethia wrote:
    Rather than pursuing this ridiculous power creep, lets just nerf the OP T2/T3 and Pirate cruisers and Tactical destroyers.



    Power creep is sadly a viable option here potentially. James' rokh fixes above for example...as a rokh pilot I like them. Not on pos bash or meat grind 400 on 400 fleet ops, I get few reasons to pick rokh over Naga.


    Nerf t3.....which ones. CCP tried picking one, hml tengu. Well HML was a split drake/tengu HML setup nerf. People went to HAM or said lets give hybrids a go on tengu and they grew in popularity. Now depending on who you ask...hybrid tengu is op. Can't really nerf hybrid tengu, that just came out of the ignored pile its been in for years.


    T2 cruiser was buffed to be viable again, it was out of favor for a while. Pirate was buffed after t2 cruiser as they were becoming non-viable. Basically we had nerfed cruisers that limited their usage. Buffs fixed that, is rolling back the clock an option here really?

    T3 dessies are not even fully implemented and need time to see if they are op or if players just need to learn to play the game with them in it. Here we get the case of players who are not open to change versus those who embrace the new stuff, change their doctrine and roll with it. The really good ones who follow the latter path at some point also learn to counter them as well as they learn to use them. Can make balance hard here as some of the problems may lie on the simple fact some players are in the whole I have flown this way for years and I don't want to change group. that is not a balance issue, that is a player/crew preference one.
    baltec1
    Bat Country
    Pandemic Horde
    #25 - 2015-02-27 01:00:54 UTC
    Zan Shiro wrote:


    Nerf t3.....which ones.


    All of them.

    Zan Shiro wrote:

    T2 cruiser was buffed to be viable again, it was out of favor for a while. Pirate was buffed after t2 cruiser as they were becoming non-viable. Basically we had nerfed cruisers that limited their usage. Buffs fixed that, is rolling back the clock an option here really?


    We are not talking huge bufs here, a great many stayed as they are. Lets not forget that Battleships also saw buffs.

    Zan Shiro wrote:

    T3 dessies


    Are hilariously overpowered.
    Catherine Laartii
    Doomheim
    #26 - 2015-02-27 18:01:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Catherine Laartii
    Celthric Kanerian wrote:
    Catherine Laartii wrote:


  • Dropping a mid on the Abaddon for an 8th low along with giving it a solid 25% boost in cap regen and rounding the cap amount out to 9500 (with max skills) sounds excellent; it excels as a line battleship, and augmenting that role would be perfect for it. 30km extra targeting range seems like a nice addition, as well as helping further offset the loss of the 4th mid.
  • .


    This idea alone made me wonder if you were actually serious or simply trolling.

    I read it like this: First we get a doughnut, then we get into a car and grab soda and bacon and ice cream then to make it even more fun we throw toilet paper at the neighbours house but that's not the best thing while doing it we would listen to really loud music and wake up all the neighbours.

    Idea after idea after idea... Makes you sound childish and as if you didn't have a genuine idea but simply came up with bit by bit while writing.

    The track I usually take with these kinds of things is to highlight an issue that DOES need discussion by mixing decent ideas for balance with some rediculous "I wish" ideas that I like anyway to cause enough consteration by folks such as yourself to get the attention needed for a serious discussion.

    Since I don't have a habit of burying my head in the sand about balance ideas, usually the bad bits get toned down and smoothed out as time goes on. On the Abaddon, the cap's a bit high, but not too much more than the Hyperion, which gets a solid 9k cap with top skills. I thought it was prudent to have the best battleship cap since the abby tends to use beams a little more heavily than the apoc. And dear lord to they gobble up the cap.

    Also...I really like the abby. A lot. I don't like how they didn't do anything for its cap during the balance pass.
    Tusker Crazinski
    Native Freshfood
    Minmatar Republic
    #27 - 2015-02-27 18:40:40 UTC
    god I want that tempest so bad.
    Catherine Laartii
    Doomheim
    #28 - 2015-02-27 19:18:46 UTC
    Tusker Crazinski wrote:
    god I want that tempest so bad.

    BIG BULLETS + BIG TRACKING = BIG BOOMS PiratePiratePirate
    Herzog Wolfhammer
    Sigma Special Tactics Group
    #29 - 2015-02-27 19:33:28 UTC
    Standard Battleships (T1) outside of highsec are in an odd place somewhere between useless and forgotten.

    Bring back DEEEEP Space!

    Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
    Doomheim
    #30 - 2015-02-27 19:34:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
    CCP: "Battleships are fine, no changes, f#%@ you.."

    Classic case of CCP not listening and CSM being asleep at the switch, again. Let me get this right, "battleships are being 'used' so based on them being used no change is needed..."

    WTF?

    They SUCK to use. Also, if they weren't AIDS to fly through gates and roam in, people might use them more or hey..actually enjoy flying them.

    Call me crazy, but when CCP is staring down the barrel of competitors with more twitch-based flight models like E:D and SC, shouldn't they do everything they can to make all the front-line ships pass the simple smell-test of "FUN to fly?"

    Sorry CCP, but your usage metrics don't include fun-factor, or conversely the groans at using said BC's and BS's because of AIDS warp speeds.

    F
    Catherine Laartii
    Doomheim
    #31 - 2015-02-27 19:34:47 UTC
    Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
    Standard Battleships (T1) outside of highsec are in an odd place somewhere between useless and forgotten.

    I will continue to echo the sentiment that the balance pass for battleships was half-assed and refused to address this problem.
    Catherine Laartii
    Doomheim
    #32 - 2015-02-27 19:36:06 UTC
    Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
    CCP: "Battleships are fine, no changes, f#%@ you.."

    Classic case of CCP not listening and CSM being asleep at the switch, again. Let me get this right, "battleships are being 'used' so based on them being used no change is needed..."

    WTF?

    They SUCK to use. Also, if they weren't AIDS to fly through gates and roam in, people might use them more or hey..actually enjoy flying them.

    Call me crazy, but when CCP is staring down the barrel of competitors with more twitch-based flight models like E:D and SC, shouldn't they do everything they can to make all the front-line ships pass the simple smell-test of "FUN to fly?"

    Sorry CCP, but your usage metrics don't include fun-factor, or conversely the groans at using said BC's and BS's.

    F



    Hence all of these excepting the Abby are focused on improving strength vs smaller ships. The tracking bonus on the tempest alone should allow it to do some very nasty things to cruisers. Twisted
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