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[Scylla] Strategic Cruiser Defensive Subsystems

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Charlie Jacobson
#61 - 2015-02-26 19:56:04 UTC
Maybe remove the skill point loss on death while we're nerfing T3s to the ground. :)

I support James 315 and the New Order of Highsec
Katrina Oniseki
Oniseki-Raata Internal Watch
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#62 - 2015-02-26 19:57:46 UTC
I am disappointed to see CCP making band-aid changes at seemingly random moments when a full balance pass could have been made on T3's already by now. There have been plenty opportunities to work out and finalize a balance pass, but they have not been made yet.

Katrina Oniseki
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#63 - 2015-02-26 19:58:11 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
lol @ fixing t3s = 'nerfing wspace playstyle'

why are you guys are actually happy only ever flying the same 5 ships all the time


Wasn't that the end goal of T3, making it so you could live in a WH becuase your ship was supposed to be at least "OK" at most roles so you didn't have to bring many different one?
Zomgnomnom
Contra Ratio
GameTheory
#64 - 2015-02-26 20:01:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Zomgnomnom
Frostys Virpio wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
lol @ fixing t3s = 'nerfing wspace playstyle'

why are you guys are actually happy only ever flying the same 5 ships all the time


Wasn't that the end goal of T3, making it so you could live in a WH becuase your ship was supposed to be at least "OK" at most roles so you didn't have to bring many different one?



Yes. He isn't really considering the logistical and storage issues with wormholes. The problem is that the thing that makes a passive fit Tengu able to be useful in a C3/4 makes them stupid Tanky in Nullsec fleet fights. This is likely why while nerfing the buffer they increased the passive recharge, to keep them useful to you WH folks :)
Chris Winter
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#65 - 2015-02-26 20:05:59 UTC
Wait...the armor T3s can already get (significantly) more EHP than the Tengu, and yet you're nerfing the Tengu's tank more than the armor ones? How on earth is that reasonable?
Catherine Laartii
Doomheim
#66 - 2015-02-26 20:14:22 UTC
Fozzie, I'm gonna say it now, so you can get it early in the balance phase:

IT'S THE RESISTS.

7.5% bonus is all well and good, but you NEED to bring the resists, at least on everything but the adaptive sub, down to Interdictor level. Lower resists is what reduces the absurd million-plus ehp you can pull on ships like the Proteus. Keeping high resists on subs like the Adaptive augmenter encourages cooperative gameplay like spider-tanking, while ensuring that local active and passive tanks don't become too powerful.
LUMINOUS SPIRIT
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#67 - 2015-02-26 20:14:58 UTC
Passive regen is interesting.

Not sure if +15% is that much though, I would hope for a bigger boost.
Grookshank
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#68 - 2015-02-26 20:16:22 UTC
Ok, T3 hp and - at least for the hp subs - signature nerf.

Can you please accompany this with a nerf to bombers please, since you make the last subcap, that was not already dying to bombers like flies, weaker to bomb damage?
Deacon Abox
Black Eagle5
#69 - 2015-02-26 20:23:46 UTC
The Twitch player is quite bad, freezes and drops. Don't know what you said Sad

CCP, there are off buttons for ship explosions, missile effects, turret effects, etc. "Immersion" does not seem to be harmed by those. So, [u]please[/u] give us a persisting off button for the jump gate and autoscan visuals.

Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#70 - 2015-02-26 20:36:01 UTC
Catherine Laartii wrote:
7.5% bonus is all well and good, but you NEED to bring the resists, at least on everything but the adaptive sub, down to Interdictor level. Lower resists is what reduces the absurd million-plus ehp you can pull on ships like the Proteus. Keeping high resists on subs like the Adaptive augmenter encourages cooperative gameplay like spider-tanking, while ensuring that local active and passive tanks don't become too powerful.

This is actually not a bad idea, but I'd be more inclined to adjust the non-adaptive subs to Recon Cruiser levels.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Komodo Askold
Strategic Exploration and Development Corp
Silent Company
#71 - 2015-02-26 20:36:55 UTC
Looks like a promising first approach to Strategic Cruiser rebalance. Time will say if further tweaking is needed in Defensive Subsystems. Looking forward to more, as a wormholer :)
Lyron-Baktos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#72 - 2015-02-26 20:39:28 UTC
Give T3's bonuses if flown in WH space but none in kspace. That will keep them great in the small gang pvp of wh space but not the blobby fights off null
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#73 - 2015-02-26 20:42:40 UTC
These changes seem soft handed, why should a cruiser start with 3650, then get 25% buff from skills then another 37.5% from subsystem skills?

Proteus is looking at 6273 HP with level 5 skills, and that is before modules and resists. That needs to be toned down IMO

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
japoke105 Olacar
Project.Nova
The Initiative.
#74 - 2015-02-26 20:51:55 UTC
For the Love of god nerf the freaking Ishtar, like last patch
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#75 - 2015-02-26 20:53:19 UTC
Charlie Jacobson wrote:
Maybe remove the skill point loss on death while we're nerfing T3s to the ground. :)


Yes, please make the only ship that makes me retrain a skill over again easier to kill.
Rowells
Blackwater USA Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#76 - 2015-02-26 20:53:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Rowells
Could we possibly consider giving the Loki a shield boosting bonus for one of its subs? One of the lesser used subs getting a halfway decent bonus or replacing the bonus for a very good boosts to shield boosters.

Seems odd that the cal dark have active bonus considering the pattern of most Calderon ships is in resists or shield amount.
The Ironfist
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#77 - 2015-02-26 21:10:29 UTC
Hello CCP Fozzie,

Finally something on the T3 front which is great. Now I'd like to ask if you can find it within you to finally do something about the Legion and Loki PowerGrid issues on pretty much all their ENGINEERING subsystems. You might be wondering why I'm bringing this up well. Tengu and Proteus can fit the biggest medium longrange guns in the game 425MM RAILS and still fit for all tank and fit a MWD without the need of any fitting mods/riggs/implants yet the Loki and Legion can not they are forced to go with either fitting Rig/mod or implant which seems kind of strange to me. As you have to sacrifice either DPS or TANK on these two yet the other two can have the best of both worlds.

I'd love to hear your thoughts on that. Thanks for your time.
Typo Interobang
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#78 - 2015-02-26 21:26:05 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
the proper full nerf had better be soon and it had better be actually proper, unlike this.



Or what? Perhaps a strongly worded forum post? Fozzie said more changes were in the pipeline.

CCP Fozzie wrote:
As many of you know, Strategic Cruisers are extremely powerful ships that see common use across EVE. We have said for a long time that we want to do a comprehensive balance pass on them, buffing some aspects of these ships and nerfing some other aspects. That larger set of changes is still in the works, but in the meantime we are making a targeted set of changes to the Defensive Subsystems on the four T3 Cruisers.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#79 - 2015-02-26 21:44:04 UTC
Theses ships will still be walking away with battleship like buffers. You need to hit them harder.
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#80 - 2015-02-26 22:08:33 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Theses ships will still be walking away with battleship like buffers. You need to hit them harder.

I agree, the buffer subs need to be reduced to 5% per level and IMO the base HP needs to be brought down to cruiser levels not "somewhere in between cruisers and battlecruiser" areas

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.