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3rd Party Associates for my business [Survey]
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flakeys
Doomheim
#21 - 2015-02-21 21:38:01 UTC
Angelica Everstar wrote:


Which is why it's double sad to see people like you lot leaving,


I can understand it though , after so many years ones gotta reach a point where one says : '' Goodnight elisabeth'' Blink .

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
Darknesss
Doomheim
#22 - 2015-02-22 08:22:00 UTC
Angelica Everstar wrote:
To repeat a fool :

Angelica Everstar wrote:
I too once wanted to be a 3rd party.
For the girls, fame and money.

But that was many years ago, I have gotten a lot wiser since.

Nowadays I have settled for doing some small bonds, once in a while.
And having great respect for those that have earned that level of trust, and is willing to put in all that work.


There are 3 people in EVE that I fully trust, that I have never flown with.

Chribba,
Darknesss &
Grendell.


You three have earned a rare level of trust, in a game where trust is the hardest thing to earn. You have my outmost respect.
I sadly also fully understand that people start getting other commitments and that the game has changed. And I have "only" been playing for 7 years now.

Which is why it's double sad to see people like you lot leaving, and the void you will leave.
Also why I find Darkness' idea very interesting, and something I'll be keeping an eye on.
I wish it whole hearted, all the best, for everybody's sake.


All the best
~Angel~


Thanks Angel, really kind words :)
Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd
Nulli Secunda
#23 - 2015-02-22 10:15:51 UTC
I took part in your survey and choose the "I would only trust you" option after considering "it's a terrible idea". "Terrible" is such a strong word and although I don't believe it's a good idea I think it's cool that you care enough to make all these considerations.

But as Vaerah already said, you can't inherit trust, you have to earn it.

Imho, there's more to being a good 3rd party than just having the ISK to refund someone who was scammed... no matter if it's your own ISK or that of a trusted person backing you. It's not only manners and behavior, not skillpoints or number of alts. The most deciding factor is probably experience. You have that experience. You earned it along with the trust that came with one successful deal after another.

I believe you can compare it with the experience needed to excel in other professions in EVE, be it being a trader or an elite PVPer. You can help people get started, act as a teacher or mentor. But to be successful these people need to make their own experiences, need to learn from their own mistakes. And in the end only those people will come up on top, who had the talent, the will and the neccessary share of luck.

I would suggest to let nature take its course here. There is need for 3rd parties. Probably more than ever, because more people now have the skills and the ISK. And if people can't get one of the current most trusted persons in EVE to act as a thrid party for them, they will look elsewhere. Sure, they might run into a scammer. But it also gives emerging 3rd parties a chance to establish themselves and earn the trust you, Darknesss, and a few others already have. Fedaykin055, who is a corpbro of mine btw, is such an emerging 3rd party. He already handled many supercap deals within the alliance and started offering his services to the public half a year ago (I hope you don't mind if I do a little advertising for him, his 3rd party thread can be found here: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=359712&find=unread).

I believe people like Fedaykin055 and others who started offering 3rd party services within their corps, alliances or coaltions and thus started earning experience and trust before coming to the public deserve their chance. And I believe that these people will be better 3rd parties than any wunderkind you pull out of the hat. Not because I don't have confidence that you are a good teacher or mentor, but because I believe practice beats theory.

Write a guide on being a 3rd party (although Grendell already did that, so you could focus on specifcs about doing supercap trades, for example) or offer advice and insight to people who (respectfully Blink) ask for it. I believe you could accomplish much that way.

As a sidenote, when I started, I dreamed about being as trusted as Chribba and being as spacefamous because of it and making ISK by being a respected 3rd party (probably like many others who started this game and heard about Chribba). But since then I learned a lot. And while I still wouldn't mind if people would trust me like that, I understand much better what it takes to get there. And I don't think my RL obligations will make it possible to spend enough time to be a good third party in the foreseeable future (and I wouldn't strive for anything less than being good).

Anyway, I wish you good luck with your endeavor and I hope that we won't completely lose you as a 3rd party and more importantly as a contributor to the game.
Darknesss
Doomheim
#24 - 2015-02-22 10:36:31 UTC
Hi Myriad, thank you for taking the survey and for your detailed response. I'm glad people are giving me such insightful and thought out feedback.

I think there are two levels of trust for this sort of suggestion. Firstly there is the trust that I am so lucky and grateful to have earned over many years in the eve community, and secondly there is the the trust that I place in people that I have known for many years, worked with, flown with, joked with who I know are intelligent and are just as trustworthy as me. People that I would trust my ISK and more importantly my reputation with. There are some people in this game who I have known for nearly a decade. There isn't a shortage of trust worthy people out there in my opinion, but I can only vouch for those I know and I am willing to take the chance, put my ISK behind them if need be and work with them. The most important thing to me is that the customer doesn't lose out, so for the customer there is no risk here, it's all mine.

With regards to experience, yes I have completed an enormous number of trades, but the experience used each and every time is nothing more than a good knowledge of the game and common sense. These things can be taught, very easily, to someone who has that good general game knowledge and experience.

My lines of thought are this:
Have a website listing my selected partner(s)
Have a function that they can show when they are available
Have a function where someone can request a specific time slot - open to all partners for them to accept
Have an option to select only me, on the understanding that my availability is limited and this could take time

I am not planning to quit as a 3rd party, but I think a model of this sort could work. I feel like I have always been a good judge of character and I want to stress absolutely, my selection of partners would be very carefully thought out.



Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd
Nulli Secunda
#25 - 2015-02-22 11:32:10 UTC
Darknesss wrote:
My lines of thought are this:
Have a website listing my selected partner(s)
Have a function that they can show when they are available
Have a function where someone can request a specific time slot - open to all partners for them to accept
Have an option to select only me, on the understanding that my availability is limited and this could take time

I see.
Well, this doesn't read as if you would pass the mantle on to someone else.
Instead it reads as if you were considering to massively expand your 3rd party business... with selected persons to act as your serfs lackeys sidekicks to act to your every whim to act in your behalf with you being the tyrannical dictator forcing crocodile tears from your subjects the benevolent overseer guiding your padawans on the path of virtue. Big smile
Darknesss
Doomheim
#26 - 2015-02-22 12:33:14 UTC
Myriad Blaze wrote:
Darknesss wrote:
My lines of thought are this:
Have a website listing my selected partner(s)
Have a function that they can show when they are available
Have a function where someone can request a specific time slot - open to all partners for them to accept
Have an option to select only me, on the understanding that my availability is limited and this could take time

I see.
Well, this doesn't read as if you would pass the mantle on to someone else.
Instead it reads as if you were considering to massively expand your 3rd party business... with selected persons to act as your serfs lackeys sidekicks to act to your every whim to act in your behalf with you being the tyrannical dictator forcing crocodile tears from your subjects the benevolent overseer guiding your padawans on the path of virtue. Big smile


I never said it was about passing the mantle on to someone else, this is about making 3rd parties more available and allowing me more time to do things other than 3rd party, preventing burn out. Of course, it is an expansion and it still is a business but the people I work with will be friends and they will keep the lions share of money made. I would still make money though!
Angelica Everstar
#27 - 2015-02-23 11:42:14 UTC
Guess I misunderstood a little :)

Then I might be interested in becoming a "bonds 3rd party collateral holder", depending on terms and condistion Blink

§ Current Bond AE09 1 Trillion / Acc. 4,5t ISK

ƒ Want to become a better trader ?

¢ Pls help support EVEs charities!

@EveEntrepreneur
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