Crime & Punishment

If I want fair fights, I'll start up Call of Duty or Dota 2, and have them. EVE is a game where I'm able to utilize strategy and tactics in order to wage asymmetric warfare in order to actually profit from the deaths of my enemies.

Very few games offer this, by the way. It's just EVE, one or two more minor MMOs, and the survival genre. So when you start talking about how people are going to leave if the fights aren't fair, well, you (and they) are kind of ignoring the entire premise of the game. It becomes a Catch 22, really: I can either do what I do and "kill" the game, or play this game like any other game out there, which I can already do without EVE.

Where's the skill or strategy in parking your fleet and neutral logi in a hub and sitting outside in a fast locking alpha fit all day? It's tetris. You cull the ranks of the new and the careless. Pong maybe, that's an insult to tetris.

Where's the skill or strategy in mining afk, or hauling on autopilot?

You can't cry about "skill" and "strategy" while defending the people who literally don't play the game.

And so do you. But the facts say otherwise.



I just did, the last thread Feyd made was https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=311139 to which he doesnt complain about increased mining barge EHP. So clearly you are wrong, sir.

Also, I never said that no ganker has ever complained about anything. Please dont lie or make up things.



Clearly, they did. This is absurd. Youre completely ignoring all the wars between the larger coalitions that have formed in response to taking down N3, CFC, etc. So clearly, you are wrong. They do put the effort, and far more, than the people being awoxed, thats for sure.



Seeing as how most PVP groups are small, the problem isnt that its suicide, its that there arent enough recruits for the corps in the first place. And the proof of this is in the fact that even the majority of PVP corps in highsec, are small.

But you havent addressed the problem I pointed out with your argument, which is the fact that larger groups have more benefits. Its a balance of risk and reward. What exactly is the problem with this?


No, thats stupid. Just because the new player doesnt know any better, doesnt mean that the CEO who recruits him must also be a dunce who doesnt know any better. Otherwise, we wouldnt have corps that help new players out, like EVE univeristy, RVB, Stay Frosty and Brave Newbies, all of which are glad to recruit new players who dont know any better, but are not headed by utter clueless CEOs.

*Snip* Please refrain from personal attacks. ISD Ezwal.

Sure, and do you know why? Because the risk is higher, and the payout is lower. When youre in Lowsec, literally everyone in the system other than you, is against you. You rarely ever see a ship worth more than 100-200 million. You rarely ever see a hauler. You rarely ever see a ship that you can actually make profit off of, because most ships flown in places like Faction Warfare, are necessarily made cheap so that they can be easily replaced.

In highsec, the dynamic is different. people think its safer, so they are more willing to fit their ships with much, much more expensive loot. The kind of loot that equals even 5 kills worth of faction loot drop in lowsec. Not to mention, the entire system isnt out to get you, or hostile to you.



How so? A kill is a kill, and you never know whether a Tech 1 mission boat is carrying faction loot or not. Again, Hisec is safer, which makes people more willing to put expensive stuff on their ships. Nothing hypocritical about that. No one is saying that everyone in hisec makes trillions of isk hand over fist, and fit their T1 ships with blingy faction modules. But there are certainly far easier kills, with which a larger proportion of players have far more expensive modules on their ships.

What facts? Present the evidence of your facts. I'll believe CCP's exit research on which they based their decision over the ramblings of a C&P regular any day.

Actually it was here whcih was made after the one you posted and goes into complaining about a vast number of changes. And lol at the backtracking. You were insinuating that gankers and the like don't cry like the carebears do, thus making hem somehow superior. The truth is that both sides whine and ***** as much as each other.

I'm not ignoring any of that, I'm just noting how people sat in highsec crying to no end about the blue doughnut. Get into a ship and do something about it. but no, they were too lazy and so they cried until CCP agreed to change the game. If all the people that complained about sov actually got into an alliance and went after the null groups, they'd do well, but that would be effort.

May PvP groups are in the hundreds. You're lucky to find serious industry groups above 10 that aren't alt padded.

And no, there's absolutely no benefit to running a large industry group and multiple downsides. That's why there aren't any. It's just as efficient to run it as separate corps altogether. It's a joke that the mechanics has landed in such a way that it removes the ability to operate a corp like that. Honestly, if you can't see that then you never will.

No, it's reality. If a corp CEO recruited a member into a non-PvP highsec corp that had no history whatsoever, he's asking to be awoxed and so is terrible at EVE. And yes, some PvP corps designed around recrutiing noobs don't care about their members being awoxed, but it's hardly a good experience for a noob to say "Welcome! Here's the 4 corps you can join.".

I believe it's a good change, many others do too. an it's unlikely to get changed back no matter how loud the whines. So *shrug*

...CCP gave the option to enable or disable the option. If you aren't happy, then blame your CEO for having it set to no friendly-fire...



Funny thing, is once in awhile they do leave high-sec... and then run away as soon anyone shows up in low/null sec

Because 20vs4 isn't in their odds enough

I already did, when I responded to your comment about how you thought removing Awox would(hopefully) increase corp recruitment, where I pointed out two specific reasons as to how, from neither the corps position, nor the players position, that Awox hadnt prevented people from joining corps in the first place, or recruting players in the first place.

And again, I ask you, do you really think that people like Veers, for example, will start recruiting or join an



Never said that. Please stop lying. Let me quote myself where I specifically stated that they complained:
“First off, the suggestion is within the complaints of how they want to stop the nerf from happening in the first place. “

Yes, thats right, I specifically stated that they do complain. Please stop “insinuating” things, you are clearly very bad at it.

And lol@ how you accuse me of backtracking, when you claimed that Gankers want hisec to be lowsec, and yet not a single ganker that I know of has ever claimed they want concord not to respond anymore, or remove concord entirely, which was pointed out to you, and yet you seem to have completely forgotten about it.



Where have you been the past year or so? Havent you heard of the many nullsec battles going on between the various coalitions? S2N vs CFC? Battlement coalition VS CFC? HERO vs those russians? Havent you ever heard of PFR? I rarely ever keep up with Nullsec news, and yet even I have a vague recollection of these events.

And in case youre wondering, no, a lot of it, like the Battlement Coalition vs CFC, was before the Jump changes.

Thats a lot more effort than the average crying freighter pilot, put into protecting his assets, dont you think?



Youve mentioned this twice, but I dont see how an Indy being an alt, is problematic to my argument. Why do you keep bringing this up, as if it were somehow a problem?

But okay, so the ability to set up and use POSes to its fullest between members whenever you want instead of having to contract or have multiple POS stations up, things that like arent at all benefits? Being able to coordinate and hand out ships in your corp hangars, things like that have no benefit? I think you should share this secret to all those indy corps trying to recruit players.



Without an API? Yes, I agree, hes a terrible CEO. But thankfully, theres this thing called an API, you know, that lets you check if a player that joins your corp, has and/or is skilling up for combat skills, or industry skills. And did you know that you can actually check if someone who is claiming to want to be a miner, is actually skilling up mining skills? Amazing, huh? I know this API thing is new, but you should really check it out.

Also, theres more than 4 corps, far more, but even if there werent, how is that hardly a good experience for the noob? Are you saying that corps like Eve University provide bad experiences to new players? I dont understand your logic here.

If awoxxing, wardeccs, and theft were removed, I would absolutely join a player corp. I sit in a 1 man corp not out of some deep belief in their structure, but as a response to fundamentally broken and dysfunctional game mechanics, hopefully soon to be fixed.

The change would be relatively minimal...anyone with even mediocre competence can already make isk relatively risk free just about anywhere. The only folks currently getting beat up are new/casual players.