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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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NULLSEC - playercontrolled space and agent-missions

Author
Grytok
KL0NKRIEGER
#1 - 2015-02-17 13:23:01 UTC
Hi there.

A very old idea, but I like to bring it up once more and mix it up with the current state of NULLSEC.

The biggest problem with playercontrolled NULLSEC imho is the amount of players you can squeeze into a given space, and make it worth their time to stay there.

Currently we have upgradable iHubs that can provide enough content for some mere 10 players in a system. Squeeze in more than 10 players and flying LvL4s in HighSec is more profitable per player.
Systems without iHubs are even worse, as the amount of anomalies and sites is much lower there. These systems become crowded when there's more than two players farming ISK.

NULLSEC should be more profitable than high-sec and with the rather low amount of people you can squeeze into the systems, it's only profitable for a very few people.

So my proposal once more for playercontrolled NULLSEC is to have the ability to install agents in your outposts that give out missions just like they do in NPC-stations throughout New Eden.

With agents giving out LvL 4 and 5 missions, you can squeeze alot more players into a NULLSEC system, and it would open up vast chunks of NULLSEC for new players to move to.

The agents wouldn't have any LP-stores as they don't belong to NPC-corps/factions, but this could be compensated with higher monetary rewards. And to make running these missions in NULLSEC more profitable than in HighSec, I'd suggest giving the mission-NPCs higher bounties.

An alliance currently in need of multiple regions to feed their members could do the same with a couple of constellations this way.
NearNihil
Jump Drive Appreciation Society
#2 - 2015-02-17 13:40:03 UTC
I don't see how this "would open up vast chunks of NULLSEC for new players to move to.". Rather, I'd see alliances fortify one or two dead-end constellations to run missions in there 24/7, further making null a barren waste with only a few oases per region.

Also, on the one hand it's easier to become a target - since you generally have to jump a few times to get to your destination and thus can be caught on a gate - but on the other it's harder since you have to be scanned down first. Overall though, fortifying the constellation and changing the guard every so often leads to a safer and less enjoyable nullsec. Might as well start allowing alliances to hire CONCORD to patrol their sov spacelanes at that point.

A different solution I'm fond of is one where there's anomalies "above" Sanctums that require the system's cynosural jammer to be offline and have to be run in groups, sort of like higher-class wormhole anomalies in difficulty, but provide superior rewards (somewhere between Sanctum payouts and level 5 mission rewards, thought they cannot be capital escalated like wormhole sites) to its participants as well. You get to do stuff in groups (or with alts if you're boring), everyone gets paid more and it's also both easier to become a targat (no cynojammer means hotdrop opportunities, people will know to look for these things) and harder to become one (you're in a group of well-tanked ships, need some serious firepower to take it out).
Gremoxx
Wing Commanders
#3 - 2015-02-17 13:49:01 UTC
Do you just logg on to make isk ?
Do you only rat in -1.0, tru sec system ?
Do you only rat Sanctums and Havens ?
Do you not salvage your wrecks ?
Do you not run DED sites ?

Empty space in 0.0 is not because there are no agents,
- ppl dont want to rat in systems below -0.5
- ppl don´t want to mine
- ppl don´t want to PVP
- and a large number of ppl dont want to live in 0.0

In many systems in EVE you will have in excess of 30 ppl per system doing various ISK making activities, but if you only want to kill Rats and only want to do Sanctums and Havens.. yes 10 ppl per system is about right.

But Yea, having Agents in 0.0 would be nice.
Grytok
KL0NKRIEGER
#4 - 2015-02-17 13:51:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Grytok
@ NearNihil

Introducing harder content ment for groups is not helping at all. NULLSEC needs more solo-content per system, so that more players can actually make money in NULLSEC.

It devalues the space itself, making it less attractive to conquer more space than you actually need, and it makes it unnecessary to have allways growing powerblocs to defend your big chunk of space.

Less space needed to make money and therefore less space to defend is what this game needs. And if less space is needed, then space opens up automatically for new players, as the current entities don't actually want to deal with unnecessary space.

@ Gremoxx

Currently the most of NULLSEC players make their money by running missions in HighSec on an alt and only log onto their PvP-char in NULLSEC if there's an OP.
The reason for this is, that the single member of an alliance currently doesn't have enough space available in NULLSEC for himself to make enough money funding the equipment needed.

Sure you can make more money in NULLSEC, but only if you're one of the few priviliged.
Gremoxx
Wing Commanders
#5 - 2015-02-17 14:43:44 UTC
In my time I have Ratted from Providence, Fountain, Great Wilderlands, Querious, Delve..

As I said in my earlier post:

Quote:
Do you just logg on to make isk ?
Do you only rat in -1.0, tru sec system ?
Do you only rat Sanctums and Havens ?
Do you not salvage your wrecks ?
Do you not run DED sites ?


If you say "Yes" to all of these, no amount of space or upgrades will satisfy you.

Quote:
Sure you can make more money in NULLSEC, but only if you're one of the few priviliged.


You don´t have to be privileged to rat or make isk in Providence, but still we make enough ISK to keep the war machine going and solo pvp´ers satisfied. And here you have hostile in the region 24/7, roaming gangs, hot-drops, solo -PvP´ers... and still ppl make ISK. High-sec offers Agents and "safe" space, in Null you have more risks and higher rewards.

Its mind-set not space or Agents that makes the ISK :)
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
Brave Collective
#6 - 2015-02-17 14:46:42 UTC
Grytok wrote:
Hi there.

A very old idea, but I like to bring it up once more and mix it up with the current state of NULLSEC.

The biggest problem with playercontrolled NULLSEC imho is the amount of players you can squeeze into a given space, and make it worth their time to stay there....


...aaand I stopped reading right here!

There seems to be some sort of misconception about nullsec live. That sov thing that was brought into EVE was not to group people together to make them 'spacerich'.

It is there to call some letters and numbers in the top left corner 'home'.

What you don't seem to know is that this did require work to pull of. Maybe you just became a member of an alliance where everything is already in place and there is not much to do to keep and uphold it.

I don't know how your alliance works but those that I know give you gear and toys to take out and be blown up with. There is no need for isk in your wallet.

If you don't see the value in that, that problem will not be solved with agents.

And if you realize that that sov thing is too much work, there is always NPC nullsec with plenty of agents to talk to.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever

Antillie Sa'Kan
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2015-02-17 15:42:14 UTC
Grytok wrote:
@ NearNihil

Introducing harder content ment for groups is not helping at all. NULLSEC needs more solo-content per system, so that more players can actually make money in NULLSEC.

It devalues the space itself, making it less attractive to conquer more space than you actually need, and it makes it unnecessary to have allways growing powerblocs to defend your big chunk of space.

Less space needed to make money and therefore less space to defend is what this game needs. And if less space is needed, then space opens up automatically for new players, as the current entities don't actually want to deal with unnecessary space.

@ Gremoxx

Currently the most of NULLSEC players make their money by running missions in HighSec on an alt and only log onto their PvP-char in NULLSEC if there's an OP.
The reason for this is, that the single member of an alliance currently doesn't have enough space available in NULLSEC for himself to make enough money funding the equipment needed.

Sure you can make more money in NULLSEC, but only if you're one of the few priviliged.

I don't always write out NULLSEC, but when I do, I do it with CAPITALS.
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#8 - 2015-02-17 17:12:53 UTC
Grytok wrote:
Sure you can make more money in NULLSEC, but only if you're one of the few priviliged.

Hm. I'm currently into belt chaining. It does not make as much money as grinding Anoms, but I can do it in any system with a sufficient number of belts or an area with systems close to each other with many belts. Requires work, but I have that space all for myself. I also fly around a lot and do Data/Relic sites and in the process, I see a lot of my Null sec's space and find systems where random anom spawns have piled up, like that one system with 5 Sanctums and 10 Havens in it, or the other system with 2 Sanctums and 3 Havens and so on. There's so much empty space and the key is to create variety for yourself. You should not mope around that you don't have a spot in the prime ratting systems, you should instead fly around and experience your space. If you have regions worth of space, there are neglected areas, areas no one wants to be in, ares where things pile up from other systems. Prime ratting systems are also the first targets for people looking for PVP so there's usually neuts around that prevent you from actually ratting. You do not have that most of the time in less desirable systems.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.

Jenshae Chiroptera
#9 - 2015-02-17 17:34:03 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Samantha Achasse wrote:
dont know if this is relevant,
but I think alliances should have a LP store system like the big NPC corps.
you can trade in the npc corps lp at a 3-1 (changeable) rate.
That could be really interesting. The alliance leader or who ever has LP roles can set up an LP store (in their SOV controlled stations) with doctrine ships, gear, etc in it.
The more people your alliance has set red that you kill, the more LP you gather.
War targets should be at a fixed rate to that, say ((reds = # LP) x 1.5)

This would help subsidise your most active PvPers and ensure that active members are getting the gear supplied rather than neutrals and reds buying up the stuff and raising the prices or hauling it back out of null sec.


... and this.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.

Syn Shi
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#10 - 2015-02-17 18:16:03 UTC
Grytok wrote:
Hi there.

A very old idea, but I like to bring it up once more and mix it up with the current state of NULLSEC.

The biggest problem with playercontrolled NULLSEC imho is the amount of players you can squeeze into a given space, and make it worth their time to stay there.

Currently we have upgradable iHubs that can provide enough content for some mere 10 players in a system. Squeeze in more than 10 players and flying LvL4s in HighSec is more profitable per player.
Systems without iHubs are even worse, as the amount of anomalies and sites is much lower there. These systems become crowded when there's more than two players farming ISK.

NULLSEC should be more profitable than high-sec and with the rather low amount of people you can squeeze into the systems, it's only profitable for a very few people.

So my proposal once more for playercontrolled NULLSEC is to have the ability to install agents in your outposts that give out missions just like they do in NPC-stations throughout New Eden.

With agents giving out LvL 4 and 5 missions, you can squeeze alot more players into a NULLSEC system, and it would open up vast chunks of NULLSEC for new players to move to.

The agents wouldn't have any LP-stores as they don't belong to NPC-corps/factions, but this could be compensated with higher monetary rewards. And to make running these missions in NULLSEC more profitable than in HighSec, I'd suggest giving the mission-NPCs higher bounties.

An alliance currently in need of multiple regions to feed their members could do the same with a couple of constellations this way.



I keep reading post after post about hi-sec players need to leave hi-sec and take a bigger risk.

How about you leave the safety of your coalition blob and go into other parts of null. There is also low-sec and w-space.

You have options, grow some balls and exercise choice.

Risk/reward.....yada yada