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CONCORD need to start fining gankers

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Kestrix
The Whispering
#1 - 2015-02-16 21:27:17 UTC
At the moment in eve gankers are destroying ships with ease, putting a tank onto a ship raises the bar in terms of difficulty but does not save the ship from destruction.

Gankers when they attack a ship lose relatively little and nothing they not already factored into the equation. The victim however potentially (dependent on what they fly) can lose anything up to a jump freighter including it's cargo.

CONCORD therefore is not a deterrent anymore and needs a buff. When a ganker/gankers destroy a ship in hi-sec CONCORD should fine them the average market value of the ship hull of the ship they destroyed. If the ganker does not have enough funds to cover the fine they drop into negative equity.

Gankers will then have to study their target very carefully to ascertain if the ships cargo will cover the loss of the fine and still give them a profit.

We need to take ganking away from being a recreational hobby with little or no consequences.
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#2 - 2015-02-16 21:35:23 UTC
Relevant.





Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Hrothgar Nilsson
#3 - 2015-02-16 21:44:28 UTC
Kestrix wrote:
We need to take ganking away from being a recreational hobby with little or no consequences.

Why haven't you created consequences for them?

I've... seen things you people wouldn't believe...

Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion...
Black Pedro
Mine.
#4 - 2015-02-16 21:47:32 UTC
Kestrix wrote:
At the moment in eve gankers are destroying ships with ease, putting a tank onto a ship raises the bar in terms of difficulty but does not save the ship from destruction.

Gankers when they attack a ship lose relatively little and nothing they not already factored into the equation. The victim however potentially (dependent on what they fly) can lose anything up to a jump freighter including it's cargo.

CONCORD therefore is not a deterrent anymore and needs a buff. When a ganker/gankers destroy a ship in hi-sec CONCORD should fine them the average market value of the ship hull of the ship they destroyed. If the ganker does not have enough funds to cover the fine they drop into negative equity.

Gankers will then have to study their target very carefully to ascertain if the ships cargo will cover the loss of the fine and still give them a profit.

We need to take ganking away from being a recreational hobby with little or no consequences.


Really, another of these threads?

Ganking is in the game on purpose. Why should CCP raise the bar on an activity that they put in the game for good reasons and has already been repeatedly nerfed? Highsec criminals are an intended part of the game design.

If you want to make proposals that make the game easier for you, and increase your safety with no additional effort on your part, I suggest you go with the EHP buff for your ships which has the same effect of making ganking costlier, but without the downsides of the kludgey and unenforceable negative wallet.

But what you really should do is look into one of the plethora of in-game tools that CCP has given you to protect your space assets like the game designers have intended.

The 8 Golden Rules of Eve

Why Do They Gank?
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#5 - 2015-02-16 21:48:43 UTC
Kestrix, what happened to you or your alt? Lost an afk freighter?

Why should ganker care of wallet level while he just simply alt contracting ships for himself for gank purposes?

he could be - 10.0 and negative isk balance for ages but still ganking your afk freighter.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
Antillie Sa'Kan
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2015-02-16 21:51:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Antillie Sa'Kan
They already do, they fine them their ships.

Don't auto pilot, don't cargo fit your ship, don't cram lots of ISK into a freighter or hauler, don't undock what you can't afford to loose, don't be stupid, do scout, do web your freighter, do bring friends in logi/ECM ships, do re-position Concord defensively, do use a courier service, do leave hisec now and then.
Paranoid Loyd
#7 - 2015-02-16 22:18:16 UTC
Mmm, Tasty

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#8 - 2015-02-16 22:21:05 UTC
So what stops them from just keeping their money on an alt?

Or is this one of those threads where you stack up fifty brand new mechanics to support a bad idea?
Colette Kassia
Kassia Industrial Supply
#9 - 2015-02-16 22:21:32 UTC
I already wrote this reply, so I'll just link to it.
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
#10 - 2015-02-16 23:19:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Petrified
What amazes me is how many people sign up to be a crew member on the ship of a known suicide pilot.

I mean, surely these people are not that desperate to end their lives but lacking in courage to pull their own trigger? Do they just randomly sign up and neglect to read about their captain's history?

What if Capsuleers had to pay for crew members the way they have to pay for labor costs? What if the more frequently you lose your ship to criminal acts the more it costs to hire a crew, or the longer it takes to get them? If so many people are willing to die in a Catalyst, why do the Sansha have to abduct people?

Lol

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#11 - 2015-02-16 23:20:18 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
How about... no?

Quote:
What amazes me is how many people sign up to be a crew member on the ship of a known suicide pilot.

I mean, surely these people are not that desperate to end their lives but lacking in courage to pull their own trigger? Do they just randomly sign up and neglect to read about their captain's history?

Hands of a Killer

tldr; EVE is a dystopia where life is cheap as pennies and people will do almost anything for money. Even if there is a high probability they will be killed... the few ISKs they earn will go to their families.
NOTE: a person with 15,000 ISK is equivalent to being a multi-millionaire by planetary standards.


Personally... I just hire convicts with life-terms, give them a crash course in maintenance and repairs, and then seal them up in ships will no escape pods (usually the very "high-risk" ships in my hanger).
They think they will be getting a pardon if they can survive an insurance cycle... what they don't know is that not one of my ships has survived past one insurance cycle. Those that get close seem to suffer from "accidents." Twisted

How did you Veterans start?
Lugh Crow-Slave
#12 - 2015-02-16 23:38:05 UTC
Colette Kassia wrote:
I already wrote this reply, so I'll just link to it.


screw your idea for bounties they need to be fixed yes but in a way that i can still place one on someone for pissing me off in local if i want

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#13 - 2015-02-17 01:35:13 UTC
Kestrix wrote:
We need to take ganking away from being a recreational hobby with little or no consequences.
Then we'll need to take ISK away from being something you can get in highsec, as a way to keep things balanced.

Seriously though, I have come here to tell you in no uncertain terms to HTFU and accept that EVE is not space-WoW. People can, will and do kill each other for no reason at all and if that's unacceptable to you then perhaps you should find a game that's more suitable to your tastes.

As a long-time highsec dweller myself, you and everyone like you and every one of these "ganking is out of control" posts fills me with an intolerable feeling of disgust and nausea. It's embarassing that people like you are the standard that everyone thinks of when they say or hear "highsec". You are a disgrace, a pox, a plague, a cancer. You are the reason we need Marmite and MiniLuv and why we need CODE. You are a festering boil that must needs be lanced, a parasite that can only be flushed out with Holy Antimatter, the cleansing justice of 1400mm Artillery fire, gatecamps, pipebombs, permanent wardecs.

I'd throw a 500m bounty on you to help compensate gankers for their ship losses as a way to keep you tasty, but I find that I'm fresh out of money after the last "remove PvP from highsec" post some miner put up in here last week.

Stay in EVE and accept it for what it is or leave and know that you will be neither mourned nor missed. Make your choice and live with it.

/thread
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2015-02-17 01:55:03 UTC
What you mean with no reason, there is always a reason for kill, to have fun, cause you have merc contract or any other reason.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
Kabark
Schilden
#15 - 2015-02-17 02:00:42 UTC
Look nothing is wrong with the current ganging system. Glass Cannons were implemented specifically for this purpose. I lose 2b in ded and faction stuff in a Tayra about a week ago flying from Jita. I got scanned out of Jita and about three jumps out was blipped by 2 Tornados. Yes I am a little mad but it's my fault for flying a squishy Indy loaded with 2b worth of stuff. I'm not going to flame the guy who did it, props to him for his coordination. (Only 300m worth of stuff dropped anyway lol) Learn to scout, hire a courier, or use a JF and just eliminate the hyper dunking problem on your terms. This is another "I don't want to die as a carebear" thread.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#16 - 2015-02-17 02:12:42 UTC
Hrothgar Nilsson wrote:
Kestrix wrote:
We need to take ganking away from being a recreational hobby with little or no consequences.

Why haven't you created consequences for them?

exactly,
you want to screw with them... falcons.

falcons and alpha

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Iyacia Cyric'ai
Lai Dai Counterintelligence
#17 - 2015-02-17 02:46:17 UTC
Kabark wrote:
Look nothing is wrong with the current ganging system. Glass Cannons were implemented specifically for this purpose. I lose 2b in ded and faction stuff in a Tayra about a week ago flying from Jita. I got scanned out of Jita and about three jumps out was blipped by 2 Tornados. Yes I am a little mad but it's my fault for flying a squishy Indy loaded with 2b worth of stuff. I'm not going to flame the guy who did it, props to him for his coordination. (Only 300m worth of stuff dropped anyway lol) Learn to scout, hire a courier, or use a JF and just eliminate the hyper dunking problem on your terms. This is another "I don't want to die as a carebear" thread.
"I used to fly a Tayra, then I took an alpha to the knee".
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
#18 - 2015-02-17 03:07:13 UTC
Before I start into some responses let it be on record that I support the current ganking mechanic in its basic concept. Does it need some tweaks maybe but I am not the one to say how or what needs to be changed so I simply accept what it is and will adapt no matter how CCP may change it in the future.

With that out of the way some responses to posts by others.

Hrothgar Nilsson wrote:
Kestrix wrote:
We need to take ganking away from being a recreational hobby with little or no consequences.

Why haven't you created consequences for them?

This is a good idea in theory, however in the face of high sec mechanics and the current state of EvE with relation to gankers it is not really something that will be a big factor.
Hard to get players to sign on to protect you because it is so crushingly boring for one.
They really cannot do anything anyway unless they are willing to take the same sec hits and Concord response that the gankers suffer so that limits the pool of possible options.
Once the gank has occured what is the purpose to shooting an empty pod? assuming the gankers are still hanging around and that you have a ship close by to use. What does that solve and how does that add risk or costs for the ganker especially now that clone costs have been removed?


Black Pedro wrote:
Ganking is in the game on purpose. Why should CCP raise the bar on an activity that they put in the game for good reasons and has already been repeatedly nerfed? Highsec criminals are an intended part of the game design.

The bottom line here comes down to cash money that CCP needs to keep this game going. The changes your link points out were considered necessary to help protect that cash income because of the backlash from high sec players and you can bet that they will further nerf or even completely eliminate ganking if needed to protect that cash income. So all I can say is get used to it and get ready for more in the future because there will be more nerfs to ganking in the future I can virtually guarantee that.

Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
As a long-time highsec dweller myself, you and everyone like you and every one of these "ganking is out of control" posts fills me with an intolerable feeling of disgust and nausea. It's embarassing that people like you are the standard that everyone thinks of when they say or hear "highsec". You are a disgrace, a pox, a plague, a cancer. You are the reason we need Marmite and MiniLuv and why we need CODE. You are a festering boil that must needs be lanced, a parasite that can only be flushed out with Holy Antimatter, the cleansing justice of 1400mm Artillery fire, gatecamps, pipebombs, permanent wardecs.

I'd throw a 500m bounty on you to help compensate gankers for their ship losses as a way to keep you tasty, but I find that I'm fresh out of money after the last "remove PvP from highsec" post some miner put up in here last week.

Stay in EVE and accept it for what it is or leave and know that you will be neither mourned nor missed. Make your choice and live with it.

/thread

How to respond to this?
While I agree with virtually everything you have said here I cannot agree with how you choose to say it. Even if it does not violate any of the forum rules this type of post is really counter productive and serves to only further enrage the OP.
I am also somewhat surprised by this one as this is not your normal pposting style so I guess this one really does get under your skin.
Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
#19 - 2015-02-17 04:23:30 UTC
Hrothgar Nilsson wrote:
Kestrix wrote:
We need to take ganking away from being a recreational hobby with little or no consequences.

Why haven't you created consequences for them?
You say this like its a thing... please oh so great and mighty PVP god who can blow up non-fit haulers, how does one "create consequences" for these pilots, or -10 for that matter?

And before you say the usual spiel of use an alt in a griffin etc... how about you spend some time camping a -10 sebo'd thrasher that is hitting pods on a gate, tell me how often you are successful in preventing them from killing their target. I can tell you from my experience that there is about a 20% chance of being able to jam a -10 sebo'd thrasher before they make their shot. Even with a fully sebo'd griffin, you have to rely on terrible server ticks to inform your client that the thrasher has exited warp and is no longer invulnerable. By that time they have already locked their target. Then you have to wait for the server to acknowledge that you locked the thrasher, then another series of ticks to acknowledge you activated a jam. By then nearly every time the deed has already been done.

So tell me again, how does one "create consequences" for a pilot who never flys more than a cheap fit dessie and an empty pod?
ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#20 - 2015-02-17 05:09:44 UTC
Quote:

Forum rules

17. Redundant and re-posted threads will be locked.

As a courtesy to other forum users, please search to see if there is a thread already open on the topic you wish to discuss. If so, please place your comments there instead. Multiple threads on the same subject clutter up the forums needlessly, causing good feedback and ideas to be lost. Please keep discussions regarding a topic to a single thread.


Closed.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Senior Lead

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department