Player Features and Ideas Discussion

The current problem that mining barges/exhumers have is that barges are pretty useless after training for the next ship (Procurer useless in general) and that the exhumers are a bit OP in their ability where as t2 ships typically focus on a specific use, and not multiple uses. So in this reguard...

Procurer - Keeps ore bonus(so still usable for new players that never really use them anyway), receives a deep core mining bonus equal to 85% of the Skiff's effectiveness.

Retriever - Keeps current ore mining capability, receives and ice mining ability equal to 85% of the Mackinaw's ice yield.

Covetor - 85% of the effectiveness of the hulk's ore mining capability (slight nerf) Skill requirement reduced to mining barges lvl 4. (this is possible because the retriever will be given ice capability meaning it's still effective 24 hrs later.)

Skiff - Losses any ore or ice mining capability besides deep core mining. It's a t2 ship and should focus purely on it's main function.

Mackinaw - Losses any bonuses not related to ice. Blah blah, t2 ship

Hulk - Losses ice mining bonus. (Currently a bit OP. Very slightly less effective than the Mack, but more effective than the Mack until you have exhumers lvl 5).

New Mining Barge

Sifter - Gas mining barge - Same ore mining capability of the Procurer. Same slot layout, skill requirment, and stats as well. Able to fit a gas extractor. 85% gas mining effectiveness of the Purger.

Purger - Gas mining exhumer - Stats, slots, and skill requirement of the Skiff. Able to fit a gas extractor.

As far as gas bonuses, I don't know. Someone with more experience in gas mining will have to establish this.

New modules
Gas Extractor (harvester was already taken) - Basically, the same thing as an ice harvester with t1 and t2, but for gas.
Gas Mining Upgrade - Same thing as ice and ore mining upgrades. Fit in low slots.
Gas Surveyor - Survey scanner meant for gas.
(Again, stats will have to be determined by other people, or maybe just CCP.)

New Rigs
Rig to increase yield 3-5% t1, 5-7% t2
Rig to decrease cycle time 3-5% t1, 5-7% t2
Rig to increase strip miner/harvester range as well as survey scanner range by x% t1, x% t2

Changes

Fleet bonuses effecting strip miner/harvester range also increase survey scanner range of ships.

Orca - Given a compression ability similar to the Rorqual, but 1/4 the effectiveness, however, still requiring the same blue prints and skills. (The reasoning behind this is that it doesn't make Orca's any more efficient, it just means they have to dock up less. These ships having to dock as much as they do changes nothing about the fleet besides the orca pilot being annoyed with docking. If the fleet times it right, the Orca docking makes no difference at all, so why make it have to dock so much?)

New additions
Exhumers will be given an ability related to their use

Hulk - 300m3 crystal hold (4 crystals per miner)

Purger - Able to compress gas into a smaller tank than normally used for gas, but requires some energy typically used for thrusters, reducing velocity and warp speed by half while the compressor is running.(Would need a cycle time)

Mackinaw - on board heating/cooling tank. Able to melt ice and refreeze it into a solid block reducing the room it takes up to 2/3 the m3. Thus allowing it to store more ice in its hull. Seperate portion of the ship, but takes power typically used for thrusters in order to do so, reducing velocity and warp speed by half while in use.(would need a cycle time as well.)

Skiff - This one is complicated since I don't deep core mine, but it should have some functionality to allow it to do the same as the Mack and purger

When I think of t2 ships, I think of ships that are designed to be a master at their use (like marauders for example)
This is why I've given them these abilities. Why wouldn't ORE give exhumers some kind of advanced storage capability??
This would make Exhumers more "Industrial" in terms of effectiveness, where as mining barges are just simple shells. Which gives even more reasoning behind the massive price difference.


I feel these are all changes that could be implemented that wouldn't be negative, but would instead increase the quality of life for Eve players, as well as giving mining barges more use so they're not worthless once the next ship is trained for. Procurer is pretty much worthless, and the retriever would be even more so worthless with the Covetor skill requirement being reduced to 4, so this is why I have suggested giving them a portion of their t2 relative's functionality. It also gives those who are more risk adverse a cheaper ship to fly for a reduced costs, but come with reduced effectiveness and other crap as well.

Hit it.

May I suggestion:

Remove all barges and exhumers period. Fixes that little exploit of instant gratification KM with little risk by popping hulks and rettys.

Refund all SP related to industry, skills related to production are not touched. Reinvest in to warships in stead

Minerals are now seeded from NPC (again) but at over inflated prices, that mineral basket becomes a a 55 gallon barrel sucking up isk . Trit at the gallente ice level and everything just goes up from their, thats how much its going to be painful when you loose a rifter .

Rorq is removed. No need for that ship anymore, as mining has now been wiped out completely. Orca can stay, so the average joe has a Minny (<-- joke!) carrier to get their stuff around.

Problem solved. Gankers lose their instant ego-stroking easy kills, huge isk sink is created from NPC seed markets, and no more whining about high sec needing to be safer. Only thing extra needs to be added, CONCORD poping pods with SP loss even if you have an upgraded clone because its a very harsh universe and even pirates should be reminded of it. They shouldn't be the badass wolf praying on the meak sheep sitting in the asteroid, everyone should be hit by a harsh stick if you are involved in a ganking

• Procurer - it'll still be useless.
• Retriever - no.
• Covetor - um, it's already there. Hulk only gets 15% yield over the cov.
• Skiff - so, no change
• Mackinaw - it only has Ice Harvesting modifiers (25% penalty to duration, 100% bonus to yield)
• Hulk - Fully max skilled, max boosted (T2 Rorqual), and implants -- you get 77 Ice/Hour in the Mack, and 63 in the hulk (i.e. 20% less).

Give the "new" barges abilities to the Procurer, no need for a T2 variant so much. There are no need for rigs (especially the scanner one -- use an orca). Modules are OK, because you'd need them for the gas harvesting (though ambivalent about the survey scanner).




Why do you need an extended scanner? Orca already gets a 500% bonus to the survey scanner's range. Speaking of the Orca, it doesn't need the ability to compress ores at all. A dock/undock cycle doesn't take that long, and if you have enough miners running where it's "annoying" for the Orca pilot, maybe you should get some other haulers (and/or another Orca to haul).

As for the exhumer "special" things -- not at all. You essentially take away the purpose of the rorqual with them.

The point of giving them these bonuses is they will be useful and the Covetor is actually slightly more than 85% better yield than the hulk.. Somewhere around 86.7% or so.
Hulk shouldn't have any ice mining capability. It is an ore mining boat and should stay as such, so no ice bonus.




This can go either way. The introduction of new ship types is just more room for the market to grow.



The scan range is extended for a reason. When I'm in a fleet I prefer to use my own scanner as compaired to anything else. So a boost to my scanner range to equal my boosted mining range would be nice.

Yes, the orca doesn't take long to return ore to station and the fleet doesn't take much effect when they do, so what's the difference? There isn't. Except now there will be more compressed ore available in high sec, which means those purchasing the ore for ship contruction or whatever else will be able to transport more ore since it's compressed.

Again though, it's mainly a orca supported fleet quality of life slightly better.

Like I said, these are all bonuses that would increase quality of life for miners in several ways to include t1 variant capability for risk adverse players.

up

If its not broken, don't fix it. Sure, the procurer is useless, but other than that the barges and exhumers are balanced nicely. Skiff is the best mecoxit miner, Mackinaw the best ice miner and Hulk the best normal ore miner. Sure, the hulk gets an ice mining bonus, making it more versatile than the rest, but its also the most skill intensive and costly. Lets face it, mining is something that doesn't need to be nerfed, its already one of the worst in isk/hr professions in the game.

Gas cloud harvesting is primarily an exploration profession, not a mining profession. As such, gas never can be found in significant quantities, and the skill itself allows the use of one extra harvester per level, which is different than the normal mining skills.

Procurer could use some love so it's not totally useless, and I agree that a dedicated gas mining vessel could be nice, but apart from that I think that the barges/exhumers are fine as they are.

bump

This is FAR too overpowered. Leave the cycle time (and penalty) the same -- with T2 fittings and an orca, you're just a hair over 3 min/cycle as it is...