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Meaningful Combat
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Cannibal Kane
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#121 - 2015-02-07 05:25:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Cannibal Kane
Ortus Maleficus wrote:
Zimmy Zeta wrote:
The problem is that for the most part, pvp is no longer the means to achieve your set goal, but the goal itself.


A little behind on keeping up on the forums -- but this is the point I'm really trying to make here, guys.

It is kind of like profit in business. So many businesses chase money as if it were the only goal itself. However, profit is actually a symptom of doing good things that people in the market want. As in, pvp should be a symptom of things happening in the world, not the goal in of itself.

I apologize if I wasn't very clear in my original post, this sort of thing is hard for me to describe perfectly.


Wardeccing corps is what I do because it makes me isk. Or it might be because you said something stupid on the forums. That right there is plenty meaningfull since said person took a risk saying something dumb and now has to pay for it.

Who are you? ALT, to tell me it should be more meaningful? When you yourself decide to use a safety char to avoid the meaningful pvp you desire and pay for your mistakes.

"Kane is the End Boss of Highsec." -Psychotic Monk
Astroia Tichim
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#122 - 2015-02-07 07:38:14 UTC
In RL I've been a gamer for over 30 years. Eve pvp makes my heart race. Its the only game I've played in 20+ years that does that. Thats all the "meaning" I need.

Oh... And my killboard stats are bad. Really bad.
Lailyana Enaka
State War Academy
Caldari State
#123 - 2015-02-07 08:32:53 UTC
Astroia Tichim wrote:
In RL I've been a gamer for over 30 years. Eve pvp makes my heart race. Its the only game I've played in 20+ years that does that. Thats all the "meaning" I need.

Oh... And my killboard stats are bad. Really bad.


I quit caring about my killboard long ago, if i see you and think you make a worthy opponent ill attack, if i die youll get a gf in local, if you die youll still get a gf in local and the promise thhat i will sell whatever your ship dropped. :)

"Here's to the crazy ones. The Misfits, The rebels. The Troublemakers. The round pegs in the square holes. 
McChicken Combo HalfMayo
The Happy Meal
#124 - 2015-02-07 09:44:34 UTC
If one wants meaningful combat, one must first answer the question: What is the meaning of combat?

Shocked

There are all our dominion

Gate camps: "Its like the lowsec watercooler, just with explosions and boose" - Ralph King-Griffin
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#125 - 2015-02-07 16:29:37 UTC
Its a computer game.

None of the combat is real.

None of the combat is meaningful.

Get over it.
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#126 - 2015-02-07 18:07:25 UTC
McChicken Combo HalfMayo wrote:
If one wants meaningful combat, one must first answer the question: What is the meaning of combat?

Shocked

I'd say to decide the fate of outworld and Earthrealm, but that may just be my Mortal Kombat binge lately (was going through my parent's house and found ALL of the old movies, so cheesy, also a copy of some of the older non-arcade versions of the games)
Pok Nibin
Doomheim
#127 - 2015-02-09 02:34:09 UTC
Truly meaningful combat makes you feel guilty on your deathbed. That's when you call a priest.
If at that moment you aren't religious you suddenly get religion THEN you call a priest. Lol

The right to free speech doesn't automatically carry with it the right to be taken seriously.
Desimus Maximus
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#128 - 2015-02-11 17:13:37 UTC
The keyword here should be L I M I T S.

Wardecs - 5 Max per corp/alliance at a time. This will bring more players into non-NPC corps since Marmite won't have 150+ active wardecs at a time and just sit off of Jita/Amarr and pop almost anyone who undocks simply for being randomly chosen. More player retention = more content.

Sov - First 5 systems are base cost. Every system of ownership after that costs 1.2x base cost.. then the next is 1.4x base cost.. then the next is 1.6x base cost... onward and upward with no end.

Capitals - cut all resource requirements and manufacturing time for ALL capital ships in half.

let the good times roll.

ps. why do none of the 'leet pvpers' ever just go to low/null to find gudfights? I guess wardeccing industrial corps is pvp.
Sera Kor-Azor
Amarrian Mission of the Sacred Word
#129 - 2015-02-13 02:55:19 UTC
Jean-Paul Sartre once posed the existential crisis. "In a world devoid of God, what meaning does life have?" The answer? "Whatever meaning you invent for it."

So, if putting ships in bottles or hanging out in truck stops and sucking the chrome from a trucker's smokestack for a bag full of bad crack is what gives your life meaning and joy, well then that's the meaning of life as far as you define it.

So it is with EVE. If you want your combat to have meaning, then invent your own meaning. Simply start role playing.

If you are Amarrian for example, start telling people you are a Blood Raider who sacrifices slaves and uses their blood for weird religious rituals. Pirate

I can guarantee that other role playing Amarrians such as PIE will start shooting you for a definite reason, namely because you are a 'Heretic'.

Roleplaying Minmatar such as Ushra Khan will start shooting at you because you are a 'slaver'. Even the Gallente and Caldari roleplayers will stomp you flat like a cockroach whenever they see you, and then explain to you the reason why. No one really likes weird cultish cannibals, well except other weird religious cannibals.

If space Vampires are not your thing, you can always consider being a Sansha. Then, when someone starts shooting at you, it won't be for 'no reason', it will be because you are a creepy roboticized cyborg zombie who wants to enslave the whole cluster in order to expand the hive mind.

If you want your EVE life and combat to have 'meaning', then check out the vast amount of resources available to you in the EVE Chronicles and EVElopedia. Decide what kind of character you want to be, a stalwart defender of goodness and righteousness, a razor licking psychopath, or just a morally ambiguous opportunist. Step out of the cookie cutter personality mold that CCP provided and decide for yourself what your own character's interests, motivations and philosophies are.

Also, check out the 'Intergalactic Summit' here in the forums. That is where the role playing people hang out. If you are looking for motivations and reasons to kill or be killed in EVE, that's the mother load.

Oh, and on a further note....yes everyone in EVE roleplays to an extent. Each of the factions/ races has their own backstory, which can be as superficial or as in depth as you choose it to be. Caldari hate Gallente for a reason. Minmatar hate Amarrians for a reason. That reason is there for you to discover.

EVE has a 'future history' of events, which outlines who hates who and why. The Amarrian religion alone for example has several different offshoots, each with their own radically different philosophies and perspectives. Blood Raiders, Tetrimon, Cult of the Lash, Equilibrium of Mankind. You can also be, for example, an Amarrian who fights against the Empire on the side of the Minmatar.

CODE engages in roleplaying as a justification for their actions. It's not just 'ganking'. The miners they shoot aren't just like dots they gobble up for points in a game of Pac man. The miners are players too. There are people behind the keyboard, which is probably why CODE came up with a back story and issues permits.

tl; dr: If there is no meaning in EVE combat for you, INVENT one.

"A manu dei e tet rimon" - I am the devoted hand of the divine God.
Swanky nutjob
Holding Inc.
#130 - 2015-02-13 11:36:05 UTC
Desimus Maximus wrote:
The keyword here should be L I M I T S.

Wardecs - 5 Max per corp/alliance at a time. This will bring more players into non-NPC corps since Marmite won't have 150+ active wardecs at a time and just sit off of Jita/Amarr and pop almost anyone who undocks simply for being randomly chosen. More player retention = more content.

Sov - First 5 systems are base cost. Every system of ownership after that costs 1.2x base cost.. then the next is 1.4x base cost.. then the next is 1.6x base cost... onward and upward with no end.

Capitals - cut all resource requirements and manufacturing time for ALL capital ships in half.

let the good times roll.

ps. why do none of the 'leet pvpers' ever just go to low/null to find gudfights? I guess wardeccing industrial corps is pvp.


Because almost everyone who subscribes to calling themselves ~elite pvp~ is an idiot.
Sumitos Madeveda
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#131 - 2015-02-15 01:35:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Sumitos Madeveda
Ok ..hears an idea.......3 servers...pvp, pve and rp(for those that really get into character)

1.pvp server - full on no holds bard......still have concord, large scale npc frieghter to all major parts and mining bot fleets. improve ore gain for mining like 300% (more chinese bots for u miner bumping) heavier or larger scale rat pirates. system wide pirate incursions and roaming pirate gangs. Improve the bounty based on how long they can keep it, once your dead, bounty resets to zero...no more wanted poster. you kill a NPC freighter or miner an automatic 100k bounty is placed on you. No ship insurance...same as (rp server)

2.pve server- flagged player can only shoot u if u shoot back or u flag as well. more and larger roaming pirates in systems and asteroids in all secs. 5 min timer when u miner a belt, Wh etc. can only put bounty on a person within the killed time limit and once a person with a bounty is killed it resets to 0. make it only dangerous (pvp viable) from null and beyond space...instead of ganker getting one shotted(whatever) concord/faction police strip their ships shield/armor/structure each each kill by 25%( ship stays in space for 30min if logged out, can't station (unless its your home station). dps is reduced by 10%. Your flagged for 3hr no if or buts.

3.rp server (optional) - as it is now in tranquility server with more bonus on corps and alliances with option to liberate, conquer, or embargo systems from other alliance or even npc faction (could be added to pvp server aswell).

Don't trash the idea..think about it......


Should of put this in a new topic ....
Sera Kor-Azor
Amarrian Mission of the Sacred Word
#132 - 2015-02-15 07:21:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Sera Kor-Azor
Sumitos Madeveda wrote:
Ok ..hears an idea.......3 servers...pvp, pve and rp(for those that really get into character)

1.pvp server - full on no holds bard......still have concord, large scale npc frieghter to all major parts and mining bot fleets. improve ore gain for mining like 300% (more chinese bots for u miner bumping) heavier or larger scale rat pirates. system wide pirate incursions and roaming pirate gangs. Improve the bounty based on how long they can keep it, once your dead, bounty resets to zero...no more wanted poster. you kill a NPC freighter or miner an automatic 100k bounty is placed on you. No ship insurance...same as (rp server)

2.pve server- flagged player can only shoot u if u shoot back or u flag as well. more and larger roaming pirates in systems and asteroids in all secs. 5 min timer when u miner a belt, Wh etc. can only put bounty on a person within the killed time limit and once a person with a bounty is killed it resets to 0. make it only dangerous (pvp viable) from null and beyond space...instead of ganker getting one shotted(whatever) concord/faction police strip their ships shield/armor/structure each each kill by 25%( ship stays in space for 30min if logged out, can't station (unless its your home station). dps is reduced by 10%. Your flagged for 3hr no if or buts.

3.rp server (optional) - as it is now in tranquility server with more bonus on corps and alliances with option to liberate, conquer, or embargo systems from other alliance or even npc faction (could be added to pvp server aswell).

Don't trash the idea..think about it......


Should of put this in a new topic ....



It is a good idea, and does deserve it's own thread. However, I see some problems with it already.

On Tranquility, everything in a station costs something like 100 ISK. You could mine like a madman, but if you can't transfer the ISK to the main server, what good would it do you? If you can transfer ISK, it is an exploit. You can also PVP in Tranquility like a madman, but unless you have to earn that ISK by grinding missions and/or asteriods, what are the consequences of losing a ship?

Roleplaying can be done anywhere. Much of it actually occurs on the forums. You don't even need to log in to EVE to engange in role playing. It doesn't really interfere with, or take away from game play. Rather, it is gameplay on a different level. If you are a non-roleplayer, someone blows up your ship and that is it. If you are a roleplayer, someone blows up your ship because you are a Heretic, or a Provist, or a Slaver, or Caldari sympathizer or whatever. Someone types up a paragraph or two about why they hate (or love) you, and you type up a paragraph or two in response.

As for a separate server where miners or mission runners can make endless ISK without fear of interference? Erm, well...no. That's not really EVE.

In some ways, wormholes are like a separate server. Obviously, there is no guarantee that no one will invade your wormhole, but you are sort of in your own separate world cut off from the rest of EVE.

"A manu dei e tet rimon" - I am the devoted hand of the divine God.
Ortus Maleficus
Lambent Enterprises
#133 - 2015-02-16 22:08:52 UTC
Splitting the world into two separate pvp and non-pvp worlds will destroy eve for good. I saw it happen to Ultima Online.
Harrison Tato
Yamato Holdings
#134 - 2015-02-17 00:21:07 UTC
Cannibal Kane wrote:
Ortus Maleficus wrote:
Zimmy Zeta wrote:
The problem is that for the most part, pvp is no longer the means to achieve your set goal, but the goal itself.


A little behind on keeping up on the forums -- but this is the point I'm really trying to make here, guys.

It is kind of like profit in business. So many businesses chase money as if it were the only goal itself. However, profit is actually a symptom of doing good things that people in the market want. As in, pvp should be a symptom of things happening in the world, not the goal in of itself.

I apologize if I wasn't very clear in my original post, this sort of thing is hard for me to describe perfectly.


Wardeccing corps is what I do because it makes me isk. Or it might be because you said something stupid on the forums. That right there is plenty meaningfull since said person took a risk saying something dumb and now has to pay for it.

Who are you? ALT, to tell me it should be more meaningful? When you yourself decide to use a safety char to avoid the meaningful pvp you desire and pay for your mistakes.



http://imgur.com/gallery/Fjktz3b