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Medium Drones damage application on Frigates.
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Arla Sarain
#41 - 2015-02-09 17:35:46 UTC
Oreb Wing wrote:

I should charge for this class..

Why?
Galmil already provide the market with the best non-faction T1 frig anyway.
Oreb Wing
Last Rites.
#42 - 2015-02-09 17:46:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Oreb Wing
Arla Sarain wrote:
Oreb Wing wrote:

I should charge for this class..

Why?
Galmil already provide the market with the best non-faction T1 frig anyway.



I'll edit my comment, but I disagree. All navy ships are very good. You see Slicer's everywehre. They are great. Hookbill's get out dps'ed in many situations but are very good at applying their dmg with a mdium ASB and missiles. One of the best squad pvp ships. Firetails are also pretty amazing with 4 mids and the pg for arty's, sporting web and point with even a dual tank. Just cross-train and use the best tool for the job.

::edit:: I read that wrong. I still use the Atron, Incursus, and Maulus more often than the Tristan. If you are worried about super tanked Tristan's, expect them to be AB or even not have a prop mod. The best way to know a counter is to know the ship. Cross-train.
Doctor Knuckles
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#43 - 2015-02-09 18:04:54 UTC
Arla Sarain wrote:

Galmil already provide the market with the best non-faction T1 frig anyway.



My god you're getting tiresome.

Just explain to me how comes all the times i saw you in black rise in a tristan you ran from me flying solo in clearly inferior boats such as breachers, executioners, tormentors, atrons, slashers.

Every. Single. Time.
Ashlar Vellum
Esquire Armaments
#44 - 2015-02-09 18:31:06 UTC
Doctor Knuckles wrote:
Arla Sarain wrote:

Galmil already provide the market with the best non-faction T1 frig anyway.



My god you're getting tiresome.

Just explain to me how comes all the times i saw you in black rise in a tristan you ran from me flying solo in clearly inferior boats such as breachers, executioners, tormentors, atrons, slashers.

Every. Single. Time.


Well, he has a point; the best is debatable, but surely it is the most versatile T1.
Doctor Knuckles
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#45 - 2015-02-09 19:15:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Doctor Knuckles
is it?

tristan. kite no highs fit. brawl armor fit. scram kite armor fit. neut brawl fit. any single one of these is sub par compared to other frigs in their best kite / brawl /scram kite fits. The only oddball being the neut fit, which is unique to the tristan but gimmicky at best and so easily countered.

pick a kestrel. You can snipe fit, kite fit it, brawl fit it, you can go shield buffer, you can go 200mm plate, you cna go 400 mm plate, you can active tank it, you can slap 2 webs, you can slap a web +td

pick a firetail. dual prop. SAAR AC with 2 webs. SAAR ac with web and td. Shield AC. Arty 2 webs.

pick a breacher. kite fit? check. brawl fit? geee, so many possibilities. 1 masb, 2 masb, masb + saar.

slasher? dual prop. 2 webs. web td. nos or neut or launcher?

atron. rail kite. rail scram kite. shield fit. armor fit. repper fit. null fit. mwd fit. ab fit.

hookbill. 400mm rockets. 200 mm + repper rockets, 2 webs td. kite missile fit. TDs or damps? sniper fit. shield fits out of its ass.

torm? active or buffer? beams or pulses? EANM or 1 more HS? Please do get in a AB beam torm and picture the look of dismay on the kite tristan guy that thought he had you when you load aurora and proceed to murder his shield buffer up to out of heated point range while his drones tickle you
Arla Sarain
#46 - 2015-02-09 20:05:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Arla Sarain
Doctor Knuckles wrote:

Just explain to me how comes all the times i saw you in black rise in a tristan


You never saw me in a tristan, unless it was a fleet tristan in a plexing fleet.

Saying I ran from you Every. Single. Time. when we are in the same system maybe once a month and on the same grid in fleet fights only means you likely mistake me for someone else.

And warping gate to gate isn't running. Would be dumb to run by flying into the enemy.

I recall you suggesting we go 1v1 one time only when I was in a probe. That was a while back.
Aiyshimin
Shiva Furnace
#47 - 2015-02-09 22:42:21 UTC
Phaade wrote:
ValentinaDLM wrote:
mmm, these are very tasty tears that remind me so much of a time when Hurricanes and Rifters were found everywhere.

I don't think drone are OP. If you look at my Killboard it is clear I do use them, but I also use every other weapon system too because they are all good. Maybe not at every role, but they are all good.


They are mostly good depending on situations, but drones are almost always great AND offer immense versatility with immunity to all ewar and zero fitting or cap costs.


Fitting cost = one less slot
Ares Desideratus
UNSAFE SPACE
#48 - 2015-02-09 22:48:59 UTC
Anyone with a problem with current game mechanics is just a butt-hurt care-bear.

Oh and don't worry about all of the really stupid problems we have with balance in this game, it's alright, it's working as intended. They intended for the game to be completely imbalanced. Lol
Shilalasar
Dead Sky Inc.
#49 - 2015-02-10 13:29:31 UTC
Lloyd Roses wrote:
Drones were altered to also shoot while approaching. SO earlier, drones around you would trail to far behind and then miss you constantly even though they had low transversal against you. THese days, drones got 4+km optimal and falloff, meaning that if you're in a tight 500m orbit, you're always in rage for drones, and they easily can track you.

It's not just the meds, heavies - esp. praetors/zerkers - hit AB frigs quite easily for massive damage.


It´s pretty much this.
Most people remember drones being slow, wonky on their MWD and only shooting when you are already out of their optimal again. Heavies could only really hit webbed targets and it was hilarious having 50+ medium drones run after you but do nothing.
But this has been changed and they will hit you whatever you do you can just mitigate a bit of the deeps. Be it normal heavies, mediums, Geckos or even fighters with some boni.
And this is nothing about if the shiphulls are balanced.
Leokokim
Mining Industry Exile Foundation
Synergy of Steel
#50 - 2015-02-10 14:09:22 UTC
This thread is too gold to not join in!

Oreb Wing wrote:
1)We killed a great fitted Worm without any losses


> rocket, ab, brawling worm. I lol'd.


And for the main topic of this thread:

Yes, drones are hilariously op. So the solution? Wait for the nerf and until then, fly drone boats. Kinda obvious...

Also I like how people complain about the application of Hammerheads on a Vexor.
I guess you guys have not experienced DNC Gilas yet...
Ashlar Vellum
Esquire Armaments
#51 - 2015-02-10 23:09:50 UTC
Doctor Knuckles wrote:
is it?

tristan. kite no highs fit. brawl armor fit. scram kite armor fit. neut brawl fit. any single one of these is sub par compared to other frigs in their best kite / brawl /scram kite fits. The only oddball being the neut fit, which is unique to the tristan but gimmicky at best and so easily countered.

pick a kestrel. You can snipe fit, kite fit it, brawl fit it, you can go shield buffer, you can go 200mm plate, you cna go 400 mm plate, you can active tank it, you can slap 2 webs, you can slap a web +td

pick a firetail. dual prop. SAAR AC with 2 webs. SAAR ac with web and td. Shield AC. Arty 2 webs.

pick a breacher. kite fit? check. brawl fit? geee, so many possibilities. 1 masb, 2 masb, masb + saar.

slasher? dual prop. 2 webs. web td. nos or neut or launcher?

atron. rail kite. rail scram kite. shield fit. armor fit. repper fit. null fit. mwd fit. ab fit.

hookbill. 400mm rockets. 200 mm + repper rockets, 2 webs td. kite missile fit. TDs or damps? sniper fit. shield fits out of its ass.

torm? active or buffer? beams or pulses? EANM or 1 more HS? Please do get in a AB beam torm and picture the look of dismay on the kite tristan guy that thought he had you when you load aurora and proceed to murder his shield buffer up to out of heated point range while his drones tickle you

imo it is.

Tristan is the only T1 ship that can put whatever in it highs(blasters, rails, autos, neuts/vamps) or nothing and still have decent damage. It can fend off kiters in a brawl fit not a lot of ships can do that too. Can be armor tanked: buffer or AAR, shield tanked, hull tanked. Also can throw one of it's ship bonuses out of the window and still be combat able.
All that with kind of selectable damage type, weapon system that don't care about ewar and don't care about your positioning, but can be destroyed.

Now about the fits there are so many options:

NoHighs Kite; HullTank Kite; TD Kite; 150mm Rails ScramKite; 125mm Rails/Vamp ScramKite; 200mm + 125mm Rails; 400mm plate/ 150Autos; AllNeuts; Neuts StructureTank; Neuts HullTank AAR; DualRep Rails (saw one last week, weird thing but some peeps use it)

So yeah man, versatile.

Now don't get me wrong I'm not saying it is op, it is just very versatile good ship a swiss army knife among t1 frigs. ;P
Ares Desideratus
UNSAFE SPACE
#52 - 2015-02-11 01:20:50 UTC
You basically have to kill the Tristan's drones in a 1v1. You could make do some of the time just deciding to brawl with it but brawling with a Tristan can be a bit of a gamble depending on the situation. 100% the best strategy to use against Tristans is to destroy the drones first, and then the ship.

Not sure if it should be this way exactly.

I don't think the Tristan is overpowered in this context, but then again I don't know what I'm talking about.
Arla Sarain
#53 - 2015-02-11 10:18:52 UTC
Ares Desideratus wrote:
You basically have to kill the Tristan's drones in a 1v1.

For the first couple of tries this is exactly what I did. But after a while I realised that 8 drones have more EHP than 2 tristans.
Ares Desideratus
UNSAFE SPACE
#54 - 2015-02-11 15:00:52 UTC
It probably depends what ship you're in and your style of flying but in my experience it's the surest route to victory if you can stay out of the Tristan's "danger zone" and pick off his drones one by one.
Mr Spaxi
#55 - 2015-02-11 15:50:46 UTC
Drones die and they do not have even close DPS to the 'real weapon' equivalents, unless we are talking about hard-bonused ships like a Gila. Also, they are a lot easier to tank than any other weapon system, just because their DPS mark is a lot lower than other weapons. You have a choice in every fight vs. a drone boat - in most of the cases, I know I'll out DPS it and go straight for it; in other cases, I'll have to kill the drones. All they do is add variety to a wonderful game, and there's no issue about it. Where are the people complaining about my Incursus pushing 300 dps while a same priced Tristan can get... 200 while being severely undertanked?
Arla Sarain
#56 - 2015-02-11 16:22:11 UTC
Mr Spaxi wrote:
Where are the people complaining about my Incursus pushing 300 dps while a same priced Tristan can get... 200 while being severely undertanked?

Anywhere beyond 3km.
RavenPaine
RaVeN Alliance
#57 - 2015-02-11 16:39:20 UTC
Just coming from a different point of view here.

Drones SHOULD be able to kill a frigate. Especially one that stays in the same small orbit. I mean.. what good would they be otherwise?

We can't have AB frigates that can outrun drone damage, or they would be seriously OP.
Mr Spaxi
#58 - 2015-02-11 16:49:57 UTC
Arla Sarain wrote:
Mr Spaxi wrote:
Where are the people complaining about my Incursus pushing 300 dps while a same priced Tristan can get... 200 while being severely undertanked?

Anywhere beyond 3km.


You have ways to stay under 3km. To my knowledge, Tristan is the heaviest of all Gallente frigates, which means both Incursus and Atron dictate range vs. it. It's all how you place yourself, really. If drones were to be nerfed, they would be crap,
Ashlar Vellum
Esquire Armaments
#59 - 2015-02-11 16:53:17 UTC
Mr Spaxi wrote:
Drones die and they do not have even close DPS to the 'real weapon' equivalents, unless we are talking about hard-bonused ships like a Gila. Also, they are a lot easier to tank than any other weapon system, just because their DPS mark is a lot lower than other weapons. You have a choice in every fight vs. a drone boat - in most of the cases, I know I'll out DPS it and go straight for it; in other cases, I'll have to kill the drones. All they do is add variety to a wonderful game, and there's no issue about it. Where are the people complaining about my Incursus pushing 300 dps while a same priced Tristan can get... 200 while being severely undertanked?

200 dps tristan? is it blaster fit can you share this fit?
If I'm not mistaken x2 DDA tristan(no guns) get around 150 dps with hobs, 125mm rail tristan get around 180 dps and have decent enough tank.
Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#60 - 2015-02-11 17:03:03 UTC
Leokokim wrote:
This thread is too gold to not join in!

Oreb Wing wrote:
1)We killed a great fitted Worm without any losses


> rocket, ab, brawling worm. I lol'd.


And for the main topic of this thread:

Yes drones are hilariously op. So the solution? Wait for the nerf and until then, fly drone boats. Kinda obvious...

Also I like how people complain about the application of Hammerheads on a Vexor.
I guess you guys have not experienced DNC Gilas yet...


I baited a mission running Gila into aggressing me. And had my AB fit armor tanked Retribution with ~70% thermal resist promptly nuked by hammerhead II's. Which are supposed to have the lowest tracking of the four. Hardly even time for a "WTF."