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Crime & Punishment

 
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[Looking for MERCs] - a warning for people looking for help here

Author
Solitary Pal
The Filthy Few
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#21 - 2015-02-07 00:24:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Solitary Pal
Actually the mistake you made was posing a comepletely unreasonable contract with a ridiculous price. No merc corp will move assets to your HQ system for 10 million isk per kill up to 200 million (does anyone even do PPK anymore?) and no money upfront, you followed completely the wrong route to finding a merc to help you.

I have a monocle therefore my opinion matters more than yours.

Kaely Tanniss
Black Lotus Society.
#22 - 2015-02-07 01:00:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Kaely Tanniss
Lucas Kell wrote:
Coaxil,
Fold your corp up and disband it, then immediately recreate it. Every time they wardec you, repeat this process. Don't post anymore about it and don't respond to any mails or convos they send you. Eventually they will get bored and go away.

This thread by the way is a prime example of why it's generally best to just use the good old fashioned methods of evading a wardec. The second you point out to mercs that you are wardecced and willing to pay for it to go away, you become a target.


His issue was how he posted his request. In that situation, you don't make demands..or you will indeed become a target. His post was borderline tears, he made unreasonable demands, and what he's willing to pay isn't even worth the time it takes to move assets. There are merc adverts here for a reason..however, discretion and private negotiations are the way to go. I'm sure he has learned that lesson, or at least hope he has, quite well. Running from decs does not make them go away. Fight back...even if you lose, try to earn some form of respect. Twisted

If I had a nickel for every time someone said women don't play eve, I'd have a bag of nickels to whack the next person who said it..

MadChild1
#23 - 2015-02-07 12:27:07 UTC
this thread is lolz
Shadow51585
Relapse Anonymous
Sedition.
#24 - 2015-02-07 16:01:06 UTC
At the minimum, you're going to have to pay the war dec fee up front.

Beyond that, it depends on the group. Pay per kill, high value targets, etc... that's all up to the people you are working with.

No group in New Eden would accept the terms you put out, and in fact, most would be very insulted by it. That's why you got war decced :P
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#25 - 2015-02-07 17:57:12 UTC  |  Edited by: La Rynx
It appears to me, that like many others things, mercs in EvE do no work like they would work in RL.
"mercs" in EvE specially in hisec tend to work "dont care" directive. When hired there is a good chance that those "mercs" will not do what they are payed for. Its like hiring pirates to do the job. In RL those pirate-mercswill not get many subsequent jobs, since even maybe specially merc are hired by reputation. I was thinking hiring merc from time to time, but in EvE its not worth the effort. Not many take the job of merc serious and do the jobs they are payed for. Instead the use the excuse of EvE being a harsh place and just take the money.

At best hiring "mercs" is unsafe business, it might even be just throwaway isk. Or indirectly giving isk to the alts of those ppl that wardecced you.
As the OP can see, asking for the help of "mercs" just gets you more deccs.

Go with the tips Lucas Kell gave.

Am i wrong?
What are the mercs best known for doing their jobs and being honest with jobs they will not do instead of just taking the money?

Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."

Starrakatt
Empire Assault Corp
Dead Terrorists
#26 - 2015-02-07 20:52:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Starrakatt
La Rynx wrote:
What are the mercs best known for doing their jobs and being honest with jobs they will not do instead of just taking the money?

I think it can sefely be said taht Break-A-Wish and Pursuit of Happyness are well know for being thorough and professional for their contract's completion.

You can also get Forsaken Asylum amongst the good and reliable mercenaries as far as being thrustworthy and getting the job done. At least, we get new clients all the time and old clients coming back, so we must do something right. For myself, I just personally got a 100m bonus from a pleased client, heh. Smile

Marmite can also do it, though they do have a lingering reputation of pipe and hub campers, but less so recently, and they always had a core of hunters who focus on their targets.

Deadly Fingertips seems to be promising, though they got an instant rep of being station campers when they started out, you can see on they KB that they have a group of players that actually move a lot.

Devil's Warrior also have a good reputation, though I don't know if they are still active as mercenaries.

I am likely forgetting other mercs that are out there.
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#27 - 2015-02-07 21:29:53 UTC
Starrakatt wrote:
I am likely forgetting other mercs that are out there.


Thank you for your input.
Trust is something mercs need and as of now, i am still not convinced, that the marmite/code banter was something serious. Considering Breake-a-wish i do not think, they would go all-out on code for example.

Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."

Starrakatt
Empire Assault Corp
Dead Terrorists
#28 - 2015-02-07 22:08:32 UTC
La Rynx wrote:
Starrakatt wrote:
I am likely forgetting other mercs that are out there.


Thank you for your input.
Trust is something mercs need and as of now, i am still not convinced, that the marmite/code banter was something serious. Considering Breake-a-wish i do not think, they would go all-out on code for example.

One cannot really go all out against a bunch of -10.0 Catalyst gankers.

Everyone is already doing it.
Sahriah BloodStone
State War Academy
Caldari State
#29 - 2015-02-07 22:53:51 UTC
Starrakatt wrote:
La Rynx wrote:
Starrakatt wrote:
I am likely forgetting other mercs that are out there.


Thank you for your input.
Trust is something mercs need and as of now, i am still not convinced, that the marmite/code banter was something serious. Considering Breake-a-wish i do not think, they would go all-out on code for example.

One cannot really go all out against a bunch of -10.0 Catalyst gankers.

Everyone is already doing it.


My buddy here speaks the truth. Code aren't worth chasing and most of them are -10 which makes a war dec pointless. We do get contracts on them occasionally anyway though.

There are plenty of reputable mercs out there that will do the job, the key is to determine exactly what you want, we all have our specialties.

In regards to the OP, his 'tone' was quiet insulting and his terms laughable. If you want to hire mercs, you best contact us privately, that the point of our threads.

Sahriah Bloodstone

No.Mercy // Triumvirate

"Never underestimate your enemy or disrespect its abilities. If you do, you shall become the hunted "

Adriel Malakai
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#30 - 2015-02-08 01:12:46 UTC
La Rynx wrote:
Starrakatt wrote:
I am likely forgetting other mercs that are out there.


Thank you for your input.
Trust is something mercs need and as of now, i am still not convinced, that the marmite/code banter was something serious. Considering Breake-a-wish i do not think, they would go all-out on code for example.


Honestly, we wouldn't take a contract against CODE. This has nothing to do with the fact that I think they are hilarious or that we have assisted them in the past, but is entirely based upon that fact that I do not believe we can meaningfully impact the operations of CODE. This is exactly why the Mermaid crusade against them has achieved nothing.

The vast majority of what CODE does involves suicide ganking, which results in damn near everyone being -10. They are already taking all the reasonable precautions required to avoid putting their ships in a position of danger until the moment they begin ganking. Because of this, the best we could possibly hope for would be to interrupt the occasional gank. Maybe save a single freighter, if we were lucky. But the reality is that even if we were successful, it would impact such an insignificant amount of their activity that it would be a monumental waste of time, effort, and manpower.

So no, I wouldn't "go all-out" on CODE because I'm an honest enough merc to tell you that I cannot meaningfully impact them - that there aren't any mercs that could meaningfully impact them. I'm not willing to take your ISK and commit to something knowing full well that I'm screwing you over and will achieve nothing.
Kaely Tanniss
Black Lotus Society.
#31 - 2015-02-08 01:17:31 UTC
Starrakatt wrote:
La Rynx wrote:
What are the mercs best known for doing their jobs and being honest with jobs they will not do instead of just taking the money?

I think it can sefely be said taht Break-A-Wish and Pursuit of Happyness are well know for being thorough and professional for their contract's completion.

You can also get Forsaken Asylum amongst the good and reliable mercenaries as far as being thrustworthy and getting the job done. At least, we get new clients all the time and old clients coming back, so we must do something right. For myself, I just personally got a 100m bonus from a pleased client, heh. Smile

Marmite can also do it, though they do have a lingering reputation of pipe and hub campers, but less so recently, and they always had a core of hunters who focus on their targets.

Deadly Fingertips seems to be promising, though they got an instant rep of being station campers when they started out, you can see on they KB that they have a group of players that actually move a lot.

Devil's Warrior also have a good reputation, though I don't know if they are still active as mercenaries.

I am likely forgetting other mercs that are out there.


We are still active :)

If I had a nickel for every time someone said women don't play eve, I'd have a bag of nickels to whack the next person who said it..

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#32 - 2015-02-08 02:58:25 UTC
Kaely Tanniss wrote:
His issue was how he posted his request. In that situation, you don't make demands..or you will indeed become a target. His post was borderline tears, he made unreasonable demands, and what he's willing to pay isn't even worth the time it takes to move assets. There are merc adverts here for a reason..however, discretion and private negotiations are the way to go. I'm sure he has learned that lesson, or at least hope he has, quite well. Running from decs does not make them go away. Fight back...even if you lose, try to earn some form of respect. Twisted
Agreed that that is why he was attacked, but his initial problem is he was dealing with the situation wrong. You're right that he offered too low a price, but then why offer a higher price when for practically nothing he can just disband and recreate, or even just disband and create a channel, depending on what they do?

And ye, running from wars definitely makes them go away. Fighting only works if you can win, which either you'll pay considerably more than it;s worth for someone else to win for you, or you'll likely lose, since the reason you're a war target is because you're not considered difficult. If you fight and lose, you're an even better target than you were before they threw in the first wardec, because you provide them content.

So the best way, evade wardec using any and all mechanics, ignore wardeccers. Eventually they do get bored with throwing away isk.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Kaely Tanniss
Black Lotus Society.
#33 - 2015-02-08 04:02:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Kaely Tanniss
Lucas Kell wrote:
Kaely Tanniss wrote:
His issue was how he posted his request. In that situation, you don't make demands..or you will indeed become a target. His post was borderline tears, he made unreasonable demands, and what he's willing to pay isn't even worth the time it takes to move assets. There are merc adverts here for a reason..however, discretion and private negotiations are the way to go. I'm sure he has learned that lesson, or at least hope he has, quite well. Running from decs does not make them go away. Fight back...even if you lose, try to earn some form of respect. Twisted
Agreed that that is why he was attacked, but his initial problem is he was dealing with the situation wrong. You're right that he offered too low a price, but then why offer a higher price when for practically nothing he can just disband and recreate, or even just disband and create a channel, depending on what they do?

And ye, running from wars definitely makes them go away. Fighting only works if you can win, which either you'll pay considerably more than it;s worth for someone else to win for you, or you'll likely lose, since the reason you're a war target is because you're not considered difficult. If you fight and lose, you're an even better target than you were before they threw in the first wardec, because you provide them content.

So the best way, evade wardec using any and all mechanics, ignore wardeccers. Eventually they do get bored with throwing away isk.


That is a bit of a generalization. Not all mercs or war deccers take on wars because the target is "easy". Any merc worth a s*#t prefers a challenge over a corp full of fodder. Sure, dropping a corp will get you out of a war for the time being..but will also open doors to other issues. After all..an animal that always runs has labeled himself as prey..and will always be in the eye of the predator. Don't get me wrong..there is a time to fight, and a time not to fight..and I choose my battles like anyone with some sense would... but personally, I'd rather die on my feet than live on my knees. Smile

If I had a nickel for every time someone said women don't play eve, I'd have a bag of nickels to whack the next person who said it..

Starrakatt
Empire Assault Corp
Dead Terrorists
#34 - 2015-02-08 05:36:21 UTC
Sometimes, we het hired to assist, and/or otherwise attack some agressors. Sometimes, they are your average corp with some individuals with a PVP mindset (often the leadership side), that put their whole in jeopardy for a question of hubris, pride, or they are just annoyed with someone else, and they end declaring a war.

In these situations, hiring mercs is pretty sweet, given the agressor corp will often surrender or agree to terms and sometimes the situation is ruled without a shot being fired.

At other times, and something that happens time and again, the agressors are small time wardeccers that either confine themselves to hubs or were thinking to find an easy prey to take their POCO or whatever assets, and find themselves out of their dept and end up not logging or staying out of the way for the duration of the war. Or they will assist against 'us', labelling themseleves as mercs and scamm the client not moving from the Amarr undock.

Whatever the agressor or target do, there is a merc organiztion out there that will likely have the abilities and/or capabilities to deal with the situation. You want to hunt down people, hire teh right tool. Same if you want to interdict hubs or lock down a system.

And yes, sometimes, like Lukas says, folding one's corp is the easy way out. It is not always a solution though for alliances or corps with assets such as POS or POCO.
And sometimes, people have some pride and will refuse to fold (rigth or wrong) and hire muscle to help them what tehy can't achieve by themselves.

I am not to judge. Cool
Reppyk
The Black Shell
#35 - 2015-02-08 10:28:20 UTC
Starrakatt wrote:
I am likely forgetting other mercs that are out there.
I never get love. Maybe I should be back in the business. :(

I AM SPACE CAPTAIN REPPYK. BEWARE.

Proud co-admin of frugu.net, a French fansite about EVE !

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#36 - 2015-02-08 11:32:12 UTC
Kaely Tanniss wrote:
That is a bit of a generalization. Not all mercs or war deccers take on wars because the target is "easy". Any merc worth a s*#t prefers a challenge over a corp full of fodder. Sure, dropping a corp will get you out of a war for the time being..but will also open doors to other issues. After all..an animal that always runs has labeled himself as prey..and will always be in the eye of the predator. Don't get me wrong..there is a time to fight, and a time not to fight..and I choose my battles like anyone with some sense would... but personally, I'd rather die on my feet than live on my knees. Smile
You say that, but mercs generally need to have a decent killboard in order to get more customers, so for non-contract targets they go after people who they are almost certain to win against so they can keep their efficiency above 95%. I'm not saying I don;t understand why it's done, I'm not even saying they shouldn't do it, but if you advertise to a merc corp that you are an easy, active target willing to go so far as to pay considerably more than the wardeccers paid to dec you, you asking to be targetted.

And no, dropping corp generally works. If you just keep doing it every single time, people will stop wardeccing you eventually. A few hundred mil of wardec fees in and they'll start to ask why they are wasting their time just for you to evade and move on.

Starrakatt wrote:
And yes, sometimes, like Lukas says, folding one's corp is the easy way out. It is not always a solution though for alliances or corps with assets such as POS or POCO.]
Indeed, sometime you'll have assets which complicate matters. Even so, it's generally lest costly just to rip down a POS that is is to pay the fees of merc corp. Perhaps it's also time to consider then if you should really hold a POS or a POCO if you can't defend it yourself.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Starrakatt
Empire Assault Corp
Dead Terrorists
#37 - 2015-02-08 13:51:57 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Starrakatt wrote:
And yes, sometimes, like Lukas says, folding one's corp is the easy way out. It is not always a solution though for alliances or corps with assets such as POS or POCO.]
Indeed, sometime you'll have assets which complicate matters. Even so, it's generally lest costly just to rip down a POS that is is to pay the fees of merc corp. Perhaps it's also time to consider then if you should really hold a POS or a POCO if you can't defend it yourself.

True enough, though EVE is littered with organisations that cannot hold their own assets if seriously threatened, or thought that POS was unknown/hidden and emergency hire mercs to defend/rep the thing, and I do not think it is going to change anytime soon, so it keep us mercs in business.

All a merry round of players interacting and content creation! Smile
Lady Ayeipsia
BlueWaffe
#38 - 2015-02-10 20:59:13 UTC
Let me offer some advice based on what was told to me oh so long ago when leader of a small Indy corp.

When wardecced, do the following:

Unanchor any POS.
Create a chat channel for Corp mates.
Have all Corp members save for the CEO (or even better, the CEO's alt) join Red vs Blue.
Enjoy learning PvP in a more relaxed manner while the wardeccers get nothing.

Honestly, I got hooked. I tried a few other things in eve, but kept coming back to RvB. Now some 7000 kills later, I'm Still enjoying RvB and war decs... Eh... Now they really don't mean much.
Intar Medris
KarmaFleet University
#39 - 2015-02-11 09:10:29 UTC
For everyone of those ships listed a handful of AB fitted tackle frigates would have done the job. Research frigate PVP. You may be surprised just how easy it is to kill Cruisers and up with Frigates. Especially if they are fit right. My first 1v1 kI'll was Frigate vs Cruiser. He didn't like me shooting his MTUTwisted

I try to be nice and mind my business just shooting lasers at rocks. There is just way too many asshats in New Eden for that to happen.

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