EVE General Discussion

To be honest, the posts by Celestia and Legetus were quite pointless stereotyping and unlikely to reflect any real reasons why women are so underrepresented in EVE. Women do not seem to find EVE attractive even in the cultures were gender roles about violent and competitive masculinity and nurturing femininity are not as strongly taught to children as they are in Anglo-American and Mediterranean cultures, so those are insufficient to explain the lack of female players.

I live in a culture that has very flexible gender roles and A LOT of female gamers and female sci-fi nerds, but very few women play EVE even in here.

Being masculine does not preclude you from being nurturing or vice versa.

allright, challenge accepted!

noone but you said anything about cultures. After all, i challenge you to name two cultures where war for example was a female domain.
(real ones please, not Amazons and such)

Its not a cultural thing, its a biology thing, brain chemistry and such.

And even so, we are at least pitching. You cant just rain on our parade with an irrelevant culture reference and no counterproposals.
What do you think the reasons are for EVE being overrun with males?

I am unaware of any relevant scientific evidence that points towards these particular traits being significant parts of our sexual dimorphism.

Some bias might be found, sure, since excessive amounts of testosterone really does lead to aggressive and violent behiaviour for example, but any genetic effect is definitely so small it vanishes under the MASSIVE impact culture has on our behiaviour. The way men and women behave is quite different in between Italy and Scandinavia for example with italy having a very classic Macho culture and Scandinavia being traditionally more egalitarian. There is definitely not enough genetic difference between northern and southern europe to explain the difference, but plenty of cultural differences.

The Dahomey Amazons. I assure you, they were very real, and only named so for resembling the semi-mythological Amazons.

i will take your word for it. still, the challenge was naming two, since one is just an exception and therefore proves nothing in itself.
Halfway there!

So would zooming in.

Well frankly, that is YOUR Eve Online. To state that is what the game should be is reductive and non-constructive.

I was part of a corp for months when some more "rural" contingents let their feelings be known about a certain ethnic group I happened to be a part of, unbeknownst to them because I don't conform to societal stereotypes and it is difficult to pick up on comms with me. I didn't seek to educate anyone, I politely dropped comms and corp and found a corp that I have been in to this day with more like minded people, tolerant, and frankly better people. EVE doesn't have to degenerate into some cesspool unless that is what you personally seek, in which case you gravitate towards those people and enjoy playing in your greasetrap, but that wills till only be one group in a sea of many.

That said, and not trying to be offensive, but maybe a black man who instead of supporting another black man offended by racist speech over comms, instead derides that person claiming he was playing the victim and mocks his attempts to "educate" the offenders should maybe take a long hard look at themselves before postulating anything about being "tough enough" for anything; let alone a videogame.

and therein lies the issue that most people ignore.

GUys like hanging out with guys, and girls with girls. GUys and girls have (or at least believe they have) different standards of language, context, jokes, and humour. Doing it in front of the opposite (the very word itself doesn't assist the issue) sex is exposing a vulnerability, or asking for rdicule. As such men generally hold back and can't be themselves 'or' go even further than they would (especially when 'safe' behind a mnoitor screen). Women ... dunno, maybe they just don't want to get offend, or disgusted by the manly things.

Massive generalisations ... but usually true when you get groups of more than 5. And reputation drives the rest.

Props to the ladies who tolerate, and even surpass, the guys in EVE.

Story time:

I know of an almost completely female alliance and a few separate female corps. They generally, quietly do not invite randoms and keep men closed out. I came across them through Second Life.

I have a friend from years ago that I met in EVE. Completely forgot she is a woman and convinced her to join our alliance. I did a bit of a double take when I heard her on comms. Offered to get her into the above mentioned female only alliance. She declined and is doing fine because she works in a male dominated industry.

So, you want to know why there are so few women that you come across?

... because of you. Well most of you.

All the combat gets your testosterone levels up, so you all argue, swear and joust with your e-peens and they have no interest in that.

(I even know a few women that use voice synthesisers to sound like men and avoid the "ti.ts or gtfo" type of behaviour.)