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So, i was running the Gallente Epic arc, and....

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Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#21 - 2015-02-05 14:36:50 UTC
Solonius Rex wrote:
Nope, i was fighting this, for example, and he didnt have defender missiles.

http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/item.php?type_id=24126

Damage was still erratic.



"entityDefenderChance, 0.13"


http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
Black Panpher
CastleKickers
Rote Kapelle
#22 - 2015-02-05 18:09:52 UTC
Tikra Vargur wrote:
No target painter,I have been doing this for awhile and the damage is always steady. Caldari Navy Inferno Torps. I usually get two volleys before I am targeted back. The damage works steadily through the shields and then the armor and then all of a sudden my DPS sucks and the armor is slowly regenerating and I can't get it do anything about it.

I have tried to maintain fire only to see the armor completely regenerate while my anemic DPS never recovers.

Too bad really I was having a lot of fun with that setup. If its not a bug it's really disappointing


well just fyi, I have a hound fit that can kill them all but then again my sub cap skills are supreme!
Sean Parisi
Blackrise Vanguard
#23 - 2015-02-05 18:25:10 UTC
Fluctuating resistances, speed and more importantly defender missiles - if shooting smaller targets it will be due to signature radius. They can vastly reduce the damage of a volley.
Solonius Rex
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#24 - 2015-02-05 18:29:27 UTC
Amelia Ronuken wrote:
Solonius Rex wrote:
NovaCat13 wrote:
Did you transition to a new HP pool? Shields vs Armor vs Hull? Since they often have different resistances, I'll sometimes catch myself wondering what changed between shots and realize I'm just dumb.


My understanding was that NPC sheild and armor have the same resists.

Abrazzar wrote:
Oh, now I remember: Defender missiles. Sometimes they hit, sometimes they don't.


Nope, i was fighting this, for example, and he didnt have defender missiles.

http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/item.php?type_id=24126

Damage was still erratic.

War Kitten wrote:
Did the lower number hit only come once in a while... say right about the time a particular ship died? You can't hit for 1500 damage if there's only 400 hp left.


Nope, it was right in the middle, i.e. middle of shields, middle of hull, etc. Literally, i was in the middle of hitting the enemies sheilds, it would go 50% down because i did 4k damage, and then the next would only bring his sheilds down to like 40% because i only did 800 damage.



According to that link, your NPC does have defender missiles.

"entityDefenderChance 0.13"


I find it quite unbelievable that Defender missiles could account for 4k damage to be reduced to 800, and at nearly every other hit. Or 1500 to 400.

Here are some screenshots:
http://i.imgur.com/TqXvTkM.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/W5eb0Mn.jpg

I was in the Studio 1 mission of the epic arc. This was the NPC that i was attacking:
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/item.php?type_id=29697

Equal resists on both armor and sheilds according to this info. Using the same ammo type. Speed nearly identical(792 vs 848), though this was occurring throughout the entire attack. No target painters.

So, what, Epic arc battleships shoot down 3/4 of my cruise missiles with each defender missile volley?
Davey Talvanen
Kingsparrow Wormhole Division
Birds of Prey.
#25 - 2015-02-07 17:01:16 UTC
Solonius Rex wrote:


I find it quite unbelievable that Defender missiles could account for 4k damage to be reduced to 800, and at nearly every other hit. Or 1500 to 400.

Here are some screenshots:
http://i.imgur.com/TqXvTkM.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/W5eb0Mn.jpg

I was in the Studio 1 mission of the epic arc. This was the NPC that i was attacking:
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/item.php?type_id=29697

Equal resists on both armor and sheilds according to this info. Using the same ammo type. Speed nearly identical(792 vs 848), though this was occurring throughout the entire attack. No target painters.

So, what, Epic arc battleships shoot down 3/4 of my cruise missiles with each defender missile volley?


Probably. The defender missiles will kill the majority of the volley
Chris Winter
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#26 - 2015-02-07 17:20:06 UTC
Xenuria wrote:
The way in which most NPCs interact in combat follows different rules than other players.

Signature strength for example has no effect on the ability of enemy rats to jam you.
Yes it does. It has the expected effect, but NPC jam strength is so strong that they'll still jam you anyway a good chunk of the time.
Quote:

They also don't suffer the same sig rad penalty from using MWD.
Yes they do. Most NPCs don't have MWDs, but those that do (sleepers, incursion rats, and some mission rats) definitely suffer the sig bloom penalty.

OP, it's possible the NPC had just shut off their MWD when your smaller volley hit. They'd still be going the same speed (coasting down to normal speed) but wouldn't have the sig bloom anymore. I see this all the time.
Solonius Rex
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2015-02-07 20:20:22 UTC
Davey Talvanen wrote:
Solonius Rex wrote:


I find it quite unbelievable that Defender missiles could account for 4k damage to be reduced to 800, and at nearly every other hit. Or 1500 to 400.

Here are some screenshots:
http://i.imgur.com/TqXvTkM.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/W5eb0Mn.jpg

I was in the Studio 1 mission of the epic arc. This was the NPC that i was attacking:
http://games.chruker.dk/eve_online/item.php?type_id=29697

Equal resists on both armor and sheilds according to this info. Using the same ammo type. Speed nearly identical(792 vs 848), though this was occurring throughout the entire attack. No target painters.

So, what, Epic arc battleships shoot down 3/4 of my cruise missiles with each defender missile volley?


Probably. The defender missiles will kill the majority of the volley


This isnt true with all other tests regarding defender missiles on NPCs, though.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=263252

Heres a good thread detailing the NPC defender missiles.
Solonius Rex
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2015-02-07 20:21:51 UTC
Chris Winter wrote:
Xenuria wrote:
The way in which most NPCs interact in combat follows different rules than other players.

Signature strength for example has no effect on the ability of enemy rats to jam you.
Yes it does. It has the expected effect, but NPC jam strength is so strong that they'll still jam you anyway a good chunk of the time.
Quote:

They also don't suffer the same sig rad penalty from using MWD.
Yes they do. Most NPCs don't have MWDs, but those that do (sleepers, incursion rats, and some mission rats) definitely suffer the sig bloom penalty.

OP, it's possible the NPC had just shut off their MWD when your smaller volley hit. They'd still be going the same speed (coasting down to normal speed) but wouldn't have the sig bloom anymore. I see this all the time.


Unless they were activating and reactivating every couple of seconds, because speed was relatively constant, i dont see how this is the case.

They were over 40Km away, after all.
Pok Nibin
Doomheim
#29 - 2015-02-09 02:31:45 UTC
Okay. I have to ask. What's a Gallente Epic arc?

The right to free speech doesn't automatically carry with it the right to be taken seriously.
Solonius Rex
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#30 - 2015-02-09 07:26:41 UTC
Pok Nibin wrote:
Okay. I have to ask. What's a Gallente Epic arc?


Its like a string of L4 missions that lasts for 10 missions. You get like 5-10 million isk each for completing it, and a Black eagle drone link augmentor worth 160 mill at the end.
Desimus Maximus
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#31 - 2015-02-11 16:53:07 UTC
1) Size of ship you were hitting

2) Shield, armor, hull of corresponding ship and that ship's resistances of each, npc or not.
Gleb Koskov
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#32 - 2015-02-13 03:35:30 UTC
Have you tried ungrouping all the launchers and have one missile absorb all the defender missiles?
Zaxix
State War Academy
Caldari State
#33 - 2015-02-13 04:00:48 UTC
Gleb Koskov wrote:
Have you tried ungrouping all the launchers and have one missile absorb all the defender missiles?

Possibly this. I vaguely remember that the defender is hitting an area, not a missile. If you're volleying everything you've got in one go, it hits them all (or nearly all). I always grouped 2 launchers together, with slight delays between activations and didn't have issues with this arc. Lots could have changed, I suppose.

Bokononist

 
Ferni Ka'Nviiou
Doomheim
#34 - 2015-02-13 08:43:35 UTC
The Defender missile only targets one enemy missile, because that's how missile damage works.

Un-grouped or not, a lone Defender missile only destroys one.
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#35 - 2015-02-13 09:29:12 UTC
This thread has been moved to Missions & Complexes.

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
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