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Even ore mined should be taxed with this on. This abomination is another nail in the coffin that is content in eve.

CCP Devs, I have one question:

Currently, as proposed for Tranquility, changing the FF states of a corp involves a 24 hour cooldown and creates a notification for all corp members.

Good call on both of those.

But what happens if someone who has roles wants to leave before FF becomes active (or inactive for that matter)? Since they have a 24 hour cooldown before leaving corp, they will always have some period where they are "stuck" in the new FF state with no control over it.

How hard would it be to have the "drop roles" cooldown requirement be alleviated during the 24 hour period between changing FF states? And, assuming it's not too hard to implement, do you think it would be appropriate?

Thanks.

I think that if you turn the FF option ON you should have to pay a fee. Right now to legally shoot players in high sec in a different corp, you have to pay a fee, a war dec fee. I see no reason why it should be any different if you want to shoot players in the same corp. You want to shoot players legally? Pay for it.

Remote Repairing a random person does not generate suspect status unless they have an LE timer or Suspect status.
Why would this change?

My question really only applies to a rather specific situation which I didn't make at all clear. It's also been a while so I may be mistaken about what currently happens.

As I recall, if your corp is at war and you Remote Assist a corpmate who is tangling with a war target, you don't gain suspect status. At the same time I thought (and I may be mistaken) that if you Remote Assisted someone outside your corp who is tangling with one of their war targets (but not yours?) you'd gain suspect status.

If the above is the case, my question is whether Remote Assisting a corpmate with Friendly Fire toggled off who is tangling with a war target will put the remote assister in the second, suspect gaining situation or in the first, non suspect gaining situation.

Yes let's make risky eve gameplay cost you more because game should be safe.
The kind of people that play eve these days... Eve USED to have content generating mechanics.

Guess what you read about on mittani eve24 and the other blogs...
It's sure as hell not about how someone killed a mission rat or mined ENTIRE belt in under an hour.
Not to mention none of NPC interactions really generate social interaction.

Don't go saying that incursions are social interaction because you know it's not past the point where everyone knows exactly when to press F1. On the other hand pvp never ceases to be more random.

Any comments as to the effect this will have on players using game mechanics to their advantage such as webbing a freighters to get them into warp faster? (I'm assuming that based on my current knowledge of Eve that if Concord intervenes for corp fire now that this will no longer be possible for corps that are using concord intervention?)

I keep seeing this. Time to dispel it.

Before Tiamat, here are the corps newbies could get into:
1) newbie friendly specific corps (EUNI, Brave, etc.)
2) really bad corps that have no concept of recruitment checks, etc.
3) scam corps
4) good corps willing to pick up and train newbies

After this change, the above list DOES NOT CHANGE. We just add to it:
5) mediocre and/or good corps who WEREN'T willing to pick up and train newbies because they are not focused on being newbie friendly and had no interest in putting themselves at risk

So there was no guarantee before that a newbie would end up in a good corp and there's no guarantee after. However, the corps who were at least smart enough pre-Tiamat not to expose themselves to the risk (aka corps that are demonstrably not THAT horribad) will now also be available, for some people, some of the time. Overall, this is a net gain.

If the logic makes no sense, I'll explain by anecdote.

Over the years I have had probably a dozen people from my gaming clan express interest in playing EVE. Every one of them pretty quickly comes to the same questions; "What's your character name/corp info?" and "Can I join your corp so we can play together?". And I say "Uh... no. I don't want to risk getting wardecced or have my freighter/mission boat popped one day. But I'll totally send you some ISK from an alt and give you all kinds of advice!" And they get all sad and lonely and don't even try it.

People like to have an identity and belong to something, especially people that have an out-of-EVE connection. My dozen gaming friends don't want to join EUNI, they want to play with ME. But I know these people would not fare well if immediately tossed into my lowsec FW corp where I wouldn't care about the risk (though most would get there eventually).

I DO, however, have a nice high sec corp where I stick my freighter alt and mission/incursion alt and whatever else I want to squirrel away for random purposes, on which I am active on at least one character often enough that I would be "around" to answer questions in corp chat, etc. and generally make these folks feel connected and part of my play. I'd be happy to setup a nice public hangar for them in this corp filled with skill books and frigates and dessies, etc.

But there's no way in hell pre-Tiamat I'd ever actually bring anyone into that corp because I'm not risking one of them turning out smart and evil enough to pop my freighter or mission boat once they figure out the mechanics of EVE.

Now, I *could* make a dedicated corp on yet another alt just for those folks. But did I? No, because I'm lazy, I don't have a free alt slot for it, and so on. But most importantly, I wouldn't ever be ONLINE on that alt, so it wouldn't help anyway. My gaming buddies would feel disconnected and abandoned because I'd never be there under that particular identity.

This is just my personal anecdote. But I do know that post-Tiamat the very first thing I'm going to do is disable FF on my highsec alt corp and then go invite about a dozen people I know from my clan to come try out EVE and join me in that corp where I can actually help them out directly. If even one of them does, I think this change will have served its purpose.

I have a sneaking suspicion that there are a LOT of one-man-highsec-corps just like me in a similar scenario. I suspect lots of people would love to be able to bring their friends into the game under that corporate identity/umbrella but can't/don't because the risk is just too high and the alternative (a dedicated buddy-friendly alt corp) is just too inconvenient and awkward. So they tell their friends to **** off and join EUNI or Brave and their friend goes "why would I play EVE if not with you?" and finds a different game.

Well I'm not a "wealthy highsec player". I'm an "EVE player". Major issue on the forums to try and simplify everyone into a single playstyle and then deride it. I do/have done null life, I do/have done WH's (though not c5/c6), I do/have done mfg and industry, I do/have done lowsec piracy and FW, I do/have done highsec ganking, I do/have done missions and incursions, I do/have done "self-directed RP content that fits no category, makes no sense, but amuses the hell out of me". And so on. This change isn't just a benefit to my wealthy highsec player face; it's a benefit across all my facets because I can bring people I know into the game in a way that increases the chance they'll enjoy the game, which is a net benefit to all of EVE and every playstyle across the board.



Well I just showed that it will help between one and twelve people who are truly new find decent corps where they will get personal attention to help learn the game. Up to twelve people who 1) want to play with a friend, 2) don't want to be a faceless entity in EUNI, and 3) I would not in a million years bring into my high-sec corp pre-Tiamat.

I simply don't buy the argument that the #2 category is going to somehow expand explosively out of proportion to the new #5 category. I expect quite the opposite. Especially since I see basically NO REASON for the #2 category to change at all; the number of clueless corps should remain constant. Every single new corp willing to recruit is going to be a #5, not a #2, because if they were smart enough NOT to recruit pre-Tiamat they are pretty much guaranteed not to be a #2.

And what is the basis for your assertion that the number of scam corps (#3) will increase? I can honestly see no compelling argument as to why that would occur. Scam corps are 100% about personal interaction and abuse of trust; the state of the FF flag is going to have no effect on the % of people that get suckered into those confidence schemes. The people experienced enough to see the FF option as a red-flag are already the same people who would never have joined a random scam corp in the first place, and everyone else is naive enough that it's not going to matter either way.

"oh, yeah, we turned FF off but the corp info hasn't updated yet, don't worry"

"FF is on because we don't want to look weak and get wardecced; don't worry we would never shoot you!"

Or maybe you just mean that people will join 75% tax, FF off corps and get nothing out of it? Like how they pay 20% tax in the NPC corp and get nothing right now (or whatever the NPC tax rate is, I have no idea)? But even if the number of people sucked into that particular niche case goes up, I can't actually see this having a net-negative impact on the game. It's basically the same effect as if CCP just increased the NPC tax rate. Plus, maybe having that identity is worth 75% tax to them and they'll stay longer as a result. Bottom line with this group is that you can lead a horse to water and all that, but these are not people that any amount of corp changes will ever help. But it sure isn't somehow funneling these people AWAY from the good corps either.

This argument is stupid

There is risk still, the exact same risk as shooting or being shot by anyone in hisec in fact.

Why would it make any sense for it to be ok for someone in the same company as you to be allowed to shoot you?

Where is the Risk v Reward for the Awoxer? they get all reward with no risk as it stands