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Capitals in highsec? Make standings matter then
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Kain Coorhagen
Doomheim
#1 - 2015-01-25 11:13:54 UTC
Recently there was lot of hint that CCP might allow capitals in Highsec again and I'm guessing it's being considered how to pull it off.

Here is one idea.

Highsec faction are allowing capsulers use of capital ships in their controlled space if capsuler has standing of 5.0 (or some other number) towards that faction. This gives standings some meaning other then install jump clone once and get some discount on taxes (useful mostly just to traders). It gives initiative for people to get their standings up. It also limits how many people are able to have capitals in highsec (faction standings cannot be shared or bought like corporate one). Basically it ask for dedication if you want to have cap in highsec.

What would happen if you don't have standings and undock/jump in an capital? You get warning from militia and you get 1 minute (or some other number) to dock up or to leave system. After 1 minute they start jamming your electronics / sensor dampening or something that hinders usage of the ship (I'll leave this up to CCP). After x minutes (CCP roll a number) they would start applying damage to your ship.

Why reward carebears with ability to have caps?
Why not? They will be able to defend themselves easier and might even consider using them in wardecs and that will generate nice killmails. Also any decent HS PVPer or wardecer can work on his standings as well to get his own carrier in that part of space really fast, just needs a bit of dedication.

So what do you guys think?
Black Pedro
Mine.
#2 - 2015-01-25 12:46:43 UTC
Kain Coorhagen wrote:
Recently there was lot of hint that CCP might allow capitals in Highsec again and I'm guessing it's being considered how to pull it off.

Here is one idea.

Highsec faction are allowing capsulers use of capital ships in their controlled space if capsuler has standing of 5.0 (or some other number) towards that faction. This gives standings some meaning other then install jump clone once and get some discount on taxes (useful mostly just to traders). It gives initiative for people to get their standings up. It also limits how many people are able to have capitals in highsec (faction standings cannot be shared or bought like corporate one). Basically it ask for dedication if you want to have cap in highsec.

What would happen if you don't have standings and undock/jump in an capital? You get warning from militia and you get 1 minute (or some other number) to dock up or to leave system. After 1 minute they start jamming your electronics / sensor dampening or something that hinders usage of the ship (I'll leave this up to CCP). After x minutes (CCP roll a number) they would start applying damage to your ship.

Why reward carebears with ability to have caps?
Why not? They will be able to defend themselves easier and might even consider using them in wardecs and that will generate nice killmails. Also any decent HS PVPer or wardecer can work on his standings as well to get his own carrier in that part of space really fast, just needs a bit of dedication.

So what do you guys think?

Capital ship usage in highsec wardecs will favour the aggressors who will employ them to destroy POSes and POCOs much more easily. I am not sure that that will benefit highsec carebear corporations at all.

That is not to say I am necessarily against capitals or your proposal (I haven't really thought about it much to be honest), but if you think your proposal will limit capitals to the hands of just carebears you are mistaken.

The 8 Golden Rules of Eve

Why Do They Gank?
Celthric Kanerian
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2015-01-25 13:11:56 UTC
Kain Coorhagen wrote:
Recently there was lot of hint that CCP might allow capitals in Highsec again


Mind sharing any of those "hints" ?
u3pog
Ministerstvo na otbranata
Ore No More
#4 - 2015-01-25 13:17:52 UTC
Celthric Kanerian wrote:
Kain Coorhagen wrote:
Recently there was lot of hint that CCP might allow capitals in Highsec again


Mind sharing any of those "hints" ?


When CCP announced jump fatigue and the usage of gates for caps, they mentioned that using them in high sec remains unchanged, but they will stay open minded for future changes, which means they "might" reconsider allowing caps in hs in the future.
Roberta Gastoni
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2015-01-25 13:23:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Roberta Gastoni
What is going to stop people from buying a standing service like they used to do when PoSess required a certain amount of standing to be anchored?
Colette Kassia
Kassia Industrial Supply
#6 - 2015-01-25 14:41:58 UTC
If they are, and it's a big 'if', then perhaps they should allow Cyno Gen Arrays at hisec POSes (while waiving the normal sovereignty rules), but now allow ship mounted cynos.

This will require people to invest the time and effort to setup a POS in a specific system and allow limited capital ship activity in highsec without causing the whole place to go crazy with carriers.
Arden Elenduil
Unlimited Bear Works
#7 - 2015-01-25 15:42:49 UTC
Mmhmmm, and with capitals being able to use gates combined with the complete safety of travel in highsec, i'm sure loads of people will put up poses with cynogens...

All things aside, even if they allow caps in highsec, i say a big no to them requiring standings for the simple reason that NO ONE should be forced to go through that agonizing grind that is missions in order to build up standings...
Lugh Crow-Slave
#8 - 2015-01-25 16:30:40 UTC
so to have a capital in HS i have to spend hours grinding standings? no thanks just because you find f1ing crosses fun doesn't mean the rest of us do.

they removed standings from POS they don't need to add it back in to something else

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Iain Cariaba
#9 - 2015-01-25 17:45:31 UTC
Oh no, faction police don't like me and are after my carrier!!!! If only I had the ability to tank an entire system's worth of faction pol... oh wait, I do.
Amak Boma
Dragon Factory
xX SERENITY Xx
#10 - 2015-01-25 17:45:44 UTC
if CCP want freely allow capitals go to highsec they should limit their combat capablities somehow to not make them All-in-one ship for evrything. carrier/dred in highsec is great disadvantage to other players who dont have them. so my idea is way diferent than any else

currently capitals cant enter highsec, and those that are still there, can only mine asteroids, undock and fly around. they cant be used during wardec, they cant be used to agress people, cant run missions etc.

how about this
capitals could enter hichsec, dock to stations
still could not be undocked during wardec, faction warfare
you could get your capital ship confiscated for 30 days if you do wardec hunting, suspect hunting or baiting in capital ships to get eventual kills in high security space with your capital. the penalies will stack and after 30day confiscaton there will be 90day next 180day confiscation, after that you will be prohibited to get capitals in highsec, ofc you will still be able to but concord will destroy them. .
still no triage no siege ,
drone control units could be used but no fighters no fighterbombers , only light medium heavy , ewar , logi mining and sentry drone usage
capital ships could not be used for destroying POS and POCO ,
capital ships could run few level 4 missions without requiring of use of acceleration gate
cannot set security to red on capital ship in highsec space
Zimmer Jones
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2015-01-25 18:05:34 UTC
or instead of needing permits, space lawyers and the blessings of factions we could simply not have them in highsec.

Use the force without consent and the court wont acquit you even if you are a card carryin', robe wearin' Jedi.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#12 - 2015-01-25 18:22:51 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Amak Boma wrote:
if CCP want freely allow capitals go to highsec they should limit their combat capablities somehow to not make them All-in-one ship for evrything. carrier/dred in highsec is great disadvantage to other players who dont have them. so my idea is way diferent than any else

currently capitals cant enter highsec, and those that are still there, can only mine asteroids, undock and fly around. they cant be used during wardec, they cant be used to agress people, cant run missions etc.

how about this
capitals could enter hichsec, dock to stations
still could not be undocked during wardec, faction warfare
you could get your capital ship confiscated for 30 days if you do wardec hunting, suspect hunting or baiting in capital ships to get eventual kills in high security space with your capital. the penalies will stack and after 30day confiscaton there will be 90day next 180day confiscation, after that you will be prohibited to get capitals in highsec, ofc you will still be able to but concord will destroy them. .
still no triage no siege ,
drone control units could be used but no fighters no fighterbombers , only light medium heavy , ewar , logi mining and sentry drone usage
capital ships could not be used for destroying POS and POCO ,
capital ships could run few level 4 missions without requiring of use of acceleration gate
cannot set security to red on capital ship in highsec space

At which point the question becomes; why bother allowing capitals into high-sec at all?

All your rules do is...

- allow them to travel through high-sec in perfect safety (due to their tank and the aggression rules of high-sec) in addition to bypassing jump fatigue penalties at the same time.
- allow them to haul ships through high-sec in perfect safety (stepping on the Bowhead's role)
- allows them to haul certain materials en mass through high-sec in perfect safety (stepping on the Jump Freighter's role)
- allows every major capital ship power in the game to store their capitals in an easy-to-access place where no one can disrupt or harass them (at least in low-sec the threat of being "disrupted" is omni-present... which is part of the reason why capitals are balanced there).


Plus... no player will 100% respect the rules you have laid out above. There are so many capitals and capital trained characters that any rules concerning their day-to-day use would have to be hardcorded into the game.

How did you Veterans start?
Arden Elenduil
Unlimited Bear Works
#13 - 2015-01-25 18:27:12 UTC
Not to mention that actually policing all that would be a major pain in the ass.
Also, ccp wants less convoluted rules about the game, what your suggestion does is adding a metric fuckton of them
Lugh Crow-Slave
#14 - 2015-01-25 18:42:01 UTC
To be honest i feel capitals in HS would ruin one of the biggest moments players have in eve i'm sure most if not all of us can remember the first time we saw a capital.


if they are allowed in HS the first time you see them will be your first undock

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Iain Cariaba
#15 - 2015-01-25 19:18:08 UTC
Zimmer Jones wrote:
or instead of needing permits, space lawyers and the blessings of factions we could simply not have them in highsec.

This.

/thread
ashley Eoner
#16 - 2015-01-25 20:27:00 UTC  |  Edited by: ashley Eoner
Black Pedro wrote:
Kain Coorhagen wrote:
Recently there was lot of hint that CCP might allow capitals in Highsec again and I'm guessing it's being considered how to pull it off.

Here is one idea.

Highsec faction are allowing capsulers use of capital ships in their controlled space if capsuler has standing of 5.0 (or some other number) towards that faction. This gives standings some meaning other then install jump clone once and get some discount on taxes (useful mostly just to traders). It gives initiative for people to get their standings up. It also limits how many people are able to have capitals in highsec (faction standings cannot be shared or bought like corporate one). Basically it ask for dedication if you want to have cap in highsec.

What would happen if you don't have standings and undock/jump in an capital? You get warning from militia and you get 1 minute (or some other number) to dock up or to leave system. After 1 minute they start jamming your electronics / sensor dampening or something that hinders usage of the ship (I'll leave this up to CCP). After x minutes (CCP roll a number) they would start applying damage to your ship.

Why reward carebears with ability to have caps?
Why not? They will be able to defend themselves easier and might even consider using them in wardecs and that will generate nice killmails. Also any decent HS PVPer or wardecer can work on his standings as well to get his own carrier in that part of space really fast, just needs a bit of dedication.

So what do you guys think?

Capital ship usage in highsec wardecs will favour the aggressors who will employ them to destroy POSes and POCOs much more easily. I am not sure that that will benefit highsec carebear corporations at all.

That is not to say I am necessarily against capitals or your proposal (I haven't really thought about it much to be honest), but if you think your proposal will limit capitals to the hands of just carebears you are mistaken.
Oh boy I know it'd be hard for me to resist wardeccing galore in highsec with that. 500 million isk or your tower will meet my fleet of dreads/carriers....



Yeah the more I think about it the more I can't see it as being a good idea at all. Would break missions would break hauling would break the risk of having capitals. Would break all kinds of stuff.
ApolloF117 HUN
The All-Seeing Eye
GaNg BaNg TeAm
#17 - 2015-01-25 23:07:57 UTC
bet all these "no capitals in higsec" crying babies don't even have or had capital ships in the last 2-3 patch, because its fun to do 20 cyno jump with araund 2-4 day waiting without ******* up the "jump fatigue" in lowsec to get from A point to B, right crying babies?
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2015-01-25 23:19:42 UTC
ApolloF117 HUN wrote:
bet all these "no capitals in higsec" crying babies don't even have or had capital ships in the last 2-3 patch, because its fun to do 20 cyno jump with araund 2-4 day waiting without ******* up the "jump fatigue" in lowsec to get from A point to B, right crying babies?


Hmm long time ago I was flying once on my Orca from jump gate to station using AB only instead of warp.
This kind of pain... I will never forget.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#19 - 2015-01-25 23:36:47 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
ApolloF117 HUN wrote:
bet all these "no capitals in higsec" crying babies don't even have or had capital ships in the last 2-3 patch, because its fun to do 20 cyno jump with araund 2-4 day waiting without ******* up the "jump fatigue" in lowsec to get from A point to B, right crying babies?

*strokes his Thanatos and Archon*

*hears his Moros purring in the background*

*laughs at the idea of Jump Fatigue if could enter high-sec in a capital...
because he could just warp from gate to gate without a problem...
and it wouldn't be any different from using a Freighter...
except nothing would be dumb enough to gank him...
because it would take 60+ T2-fit Talos to kill a basic Triage fit Thanatos in a 0.5 system....
which would cost 6+ billion ISK*


I think you'll find that capital pilots are the most opposed to "caps in high-sec" ideas... mostly because such people are VERY aware of such ships' strengths and know how to use them for maximum benefit (especially with the more restrictive aggression rules in high-sec).

How did you Veterans start?
Lugh Crow-Slave
#20 - 2015-01-25 23:41:04 UTC
ApolloF117 HUN wrote:
bet all these "no capitals in higsec" crying babies don't even have or had capital ships in the last 2-3 patch, because its fun to do 20 cyno jump with araund 2-4 day waiting without ******* up the "jump fatigue" in lowsec to get from A point to B, right crying babies?


You mean you find it odd that even capital pilots would be opposed to circumventing the jump changes that were mad?

forcing capitals to be basically stuck to one region was the point. you aren't supposed to be doing 20 jumps well the hell to point B

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
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