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Why Afk is fine in highsec
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Ferni Ka'Nviiou
Doomheim
#81 - 2015-01-13 23:33:01 UTC
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
Crumplecorn wrote:
Provence Tristram wrote:
The simple fact is, the very nature of EVE's skill queue precludes anyone doing particularly well in combat for a good 4-6 months.
Ironcially, while you sit there AFK-mining because combat characters can't do anything for 4-6 months, you get ganked by a 1 month old combat character.


How does that one month old combat character finance his life of crime?
Not relevant.
All Crumplecorn had said was that the SP required to gank someone is little-to-none.

Whether they join up with CODE. and get provided with ships, or fund the ships themselves (not that hard), as I say, it's not relevant.
Demerius Xenocratus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#82 - 2015-01-13 23:58:08 UTC
Ferni Ka'Nviiou wrote:
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
Crumplecorn wrote:
Provence Tristram wrote:
The simple fact is, the very nature of EVE's skill queue precludes anyone doing particularly well in combat for a good 4-6 months.
Ironcially, while you sit there AFK-mining because combat characters can't do anything for 4-6 months, you get ganked by a 1 month old combat character.


How does that one month old combat character finance his life of crime?
Not relevant.
All Crumplecorn had said was that the SP required to gank someone is little-to-none.

Whether they join up with CODE. and get provided with ships, or fund the ships themselves (not that hard), as I say, it's not relevant.

Does CODE actually reimburse ships? 5M isk thrown away at a time is quite a bit for a new player. And to solo gank anything not a venture requires decent skills and a tech 2 fit. I feel like people sometimes forget that not every new character is someone's 19th alt who can rely on transfers from the 5 year old main's wallet.
Kaely Tanniss
The Conference Council
The Conference
#83 - 2015-01-14 01:11:40 UTC
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
Ferni Ka'Nviiou wrote:
Demerius Xenocratus wrote:
Crumplecorn wrote:
Provence Tristram wrote:
The simple fact is, the very nature of EVE's skill queue precludes anyone doing particularly well in combat for a good 4-6 months.
Ironcially, while you sit there AFK-mining because combat characters can't do anything for 4-6 months, you get ganked by a 1 month old combat character.


How does that one month old combat character finance his life of crime?
Not relevant.
All Crumplecorn had said was that the SP required to gank someone is little-to-none.

Whether they join up with CODE. and get provided with ships, or fund the ships themselves (not that hard), as I say, it's not relevant.

Does CODE actually reimburse ships? 5M isk thrown away at a time is quite a bit for a new player. And to solo gank anything not a venture requires decent skills and a tech 2 fit. I feel like people sometimes forget that not every new character is someone's 19th alt who can rely on transfers from the 5 year old main's wallet.


1: Yes, they do reimburse ships. 2: To get into a t2 catalyst with decent skills to gank is less than a month of training, even a t1 cat can be quite effective and you can fit one up for less than 5mil a pop. 3: not every new ganker is an alt. If you gank wisely, a lot of the time it can finance itself.

That being said, though in some ways it's true what you said about not being effective in combat for several months, it is also a fact that sp does not determine a pilot's ability. A 1 year old char can beat a char several years old if he is a better pilot. Skill is the deciding factor, not sp..though sp does balance in your favor if you are wise and skilled enough to exploit it to its fullest. The one thing I love about Eve is the fact that sp doesn't detemine skill, nor does age. If that were the case, no char 10 years old would ever die..and yet it happens all the time. Smile

If I had a nickel for every time someone said women don't play eve, I'd have a bag of nickels to whack the next person who said it..
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#84 - 2015-01-14 01:17:20 UTC
I gotta fight for time to play this blasted game I'm not going AFK.


More commonly my problem is "DAK". Drunk at keyboard.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
The Conference
#85 - 2015-01-14 06:16:00 UTC
Arancar Australis wrote:

Well since you asked so nicely, the real agenda of all carebears is a truly insidious, evil and dire one. The agenda that we follow is one which no other self respecting game player would ever lower themselves to do, let alone contemplate.

To put it simply, it is to play the game as we see fit, you know, similar to the way you play this game as you see fit. P Yes carebearing must be destroying the game as we know it, we can see clearly how it has destroyed null.

Cheers,

An evil, demonic carebearing AA Twisted

There would be no problem if you only "play the game as you see fit". But what a lot of you carebears do is to whine on the forums instead and push CCP to change the game in their favour. And yes, I don't think a self respecting gamer would try to change the rule of a game which already favours him greatly and where he pretty much already lives in complete safety if he only cares a little about how the game works. Also a self respecting gamer wouldn't probably use his free time to mine virtual space rocks, but that may just be my own opinion...

Evil RatKid
Arancar Australis
Dead Sun Rising Enterprises
#86 - 2015-01-14 06:39:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Arancar Australis
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
Arancar Australis wrote:

Well since you asked so nicely, the real agenda of all carebears is a truly insidious, evil and dire one. The agenda that we follow is one which no other self respecting game player would ever lower themselves to do, let alone contemplate.

To put it simply, it is to play the game as we see fit, you know, similar to the way you play this game as you see fit. P Yes carebearing must be destroying the game as we know it, we can see clearly how it has destroyed null.

Cheers,

An evil, demonic carebearing AA Twisted

There would be no problem if you only "play the game as you see fit". But what a lot of you carebears do is to whine on the forums instead and push CCP to change the game in their favour. And yes, I don't think a self respecting gamer would try to change the rule of a game which already favours him greatly and where he pretty much already lives in complete safety if he only cares a little about how the game works. Also a self respecting gamer wouldn't probably use his free time to mine virtual space rocks, but that may just be my own opinion...



A lot of us carebears? lol, sorry that did make me smirk at work, i thank you for that. Big smile

Maybe i don't go trolling through all the foum threads, but when i do see a thread from a carebear about making changes, it usually is started by "i was happily mining when the big bad nasty code dude came along and blew up my ship and said it was for my own good". So a bit of cause and effect happening there. If my mining alt loses a ship to a ganker, i just laugh, but they don't get a "gf" in local because it wasn't a fight, fair or unfair.

The main message that i see coming from the code sheep is that this game is about interacting with others and the game...and you know what, i support your playing style for this. My message is that this sandbox allows me to spend my money to play the game mining asteroids as i see fit, even if i get blown up by some random ganker, it's a part of the game.

The difference is that where i have no problem with your playing style because the sandbox nature allows you to do (heck, i'll even defend your right to do so), because you are spending your money for that right, you have a major problem with how people want to spend their time in eve because you have this belief that eve has to be played in a particular way...your way.

My only suggestion, stop hiding behind a manifesto that is written by some 2 bit tv evangelist that will probably get caught in the act of rubbing wads of donated isk over body parts susceptible to paper cuts. Just state you don't like my playing style and we'll leave it at that.

Ultimately our opinions are meaningless in the long run as you will do and play the game as you want, and i will play the game as i want...i just hope that we can both just laugh it off and enjoy the game for what we make of it.

Have fun mate!! Bear

P.S. Thanks for the diversion at work, it can get a bit slow and boring towards the end.
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
The Conference
#87 - 2015-01-14 07:24:40 UTC
Arancar Australis wrote:
The difference is that where i have no problem with your playing style because the sandbox nature allows you to do (heck, i'll even defend your right to do so), because you are spending your money for that right, you have a major problem with how people want to spend their time in eve because you have this belief that eve has to be played in a particular way...your way.

If you don't push CCP to change the game then I have no problem with you. I don't think I write very cryptic posts, but it is my believe that I wrote that all the time now.

Arancar Australis wrote:

My only suggestion, stop hiding behind a manifesto that is written by some 2 bit tv evangelist that will probably get caught in the act of rubbing wads of donated isk over body parts susceptible to paper cuts. Just state you don't like my playing style and we'll leave it at that.

So you don't get sarcasm? Are you the next rebel leader? (before you write something lengthy, the last question was sarcastic too)

Evil RatKid
Arancar Australis
Dead Sun Rising Enterprises
#88 - 2015-01-14 09:04:46 UTC
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
Arancar Australis wrote:
The difference is that where i have no problem with your playing style because the sandbox nature allows you to do (heck, i'll even defend your right to do so), because you are spending your money for that right, you have a major problem with how people want to spend their time in eve because you have this belief that eve has to be played in a particular way...your way.

If you don't push CCP to change the game then I have no problem with you. I don't think I write very cryptic posts, but it is my believe that I wrote that all the time now.

Arancar Australis wrote:

My only suggestion, stop hiding behind a manifesto that is written by some 2 bit tv evangelist that will probably get caught in the act of rubbing wads of donated isk over body parts susceptible to paper cuts. Just state you don't like my playing style and we'll leave it at that.

So you don't get sarcasm? Are you the next rebel leader? (before you write something lengthy, the last question was sarcastic too)


Don't need a lengthy reply mate, just read your last quote and reverse the viewpoint. Obviously role playing and sarcasm is a code only ability Big smile

I would have used rhetorical question rather than sarcastic Big smile

But thanks for the smile, lad to see you ignored the last part about laughing it off Roll
Nami Kumamato
Perkone
Caldari State
#89 - 2015-01-14 11:07:01 UTC
Tisiphone Dira wrote:
Why sinning is not fine in highsec:

The wages of sin is death.






Some 'wise' men may tell you to ignore the commandments of the code, to do as you please. Such 'wisdom' comes not from above, but is instead earthly, unspiritual and demonic.

if you need to pee and don't want to dock up, fine! The New Order has a protocol for that, simply ask the Supreme Protector or one of his agents for permission first. Otherwise, don't go afk. The reasons are enumerated in the code. For further reading you could start with the manifesto I and manifesto II.


Bwahaha

Fornicate The Constabulary !
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
The Conference
#90 - 2015-01-14 14:55:30 UTC
Arancar Australis wrote:
But thanks for the smile, lad to see you ignored the last part about laughing it off Roll

We both know you are actually whining

Evil RatKid
Arancar Australis
Dead Sun Rising Enterprises
#91 - 2015-01-14 15:45:18 UTC
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
Arancar Australis wrote:
But thanks for the smile, lad to see you ignored the last part about laughing it off Roll

We both know you are actually whining


Try again, oh pixelated one Lol

But if it helps you get through the night you believe that, since most of my posts on this topic have been around acceptance of playing styles. You are the one who brought up about how the big bad scary carebears are wanting to change the game and yet i stated nothin about you stopping the ganking of them.

But we see what we want to believe, so have fun, just like i do in this game Big smile


Hmm rebel leader, wonder if that would look good on my resume.

But seriously thanks for the amusement, it's fun sparring with someone who is just as argumentative as i.

Cheers,

AA
Vector Symian
0 Fear
#92 - 2015-01-15 01:59:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Vector Symian
Bing Bangboom wrote:
The New Halaima Code of Conduct and James 315's associated manifesto's clearly explain why mining, or hauling, or autopiloting while AFK is bad for Eve. Players who do this are trying to gain something, either assets or time, while expending no effort on their part. This tendency to maximize gain while minimizing effort is the heart of botting.

So, its clear that players who AFK WOULD bot if only the rules allowed it. It is the logical conclusion of someone who wants to make more while doing less. If CCP were to institute some loosening of the rules regarding botting some of those who now just AFK would move towards automation. A little more loosening and more would start down this dark path. Soon the fledgling AFKer has become a hardened, exploitive botter. AFKing is BAD, mkay?

And, with the emergence of the New Order of Highsec, its stupid.

Only an idiot or a completely uneducated newbie OR a highsec miner (but I repeat myself) would think its perfectly OK to undock an expensive but untanked ship, siddle up next to an asteroid or ice block in a public space, start the lasers... and then go do the laundry. And yet they do it ALL DAY LONG. Then, to top things off, when they are educated about their bad decision making process they get hostile and refuse to accept that, "What?!? Someone can shoot my ship? GRIEFER!".

Players need to learn that highsec is as dangerous and as full of killers as any low-sec or null-sec system. In fact, there are probably more in a typical highsec ice belt system than in some random low-sec system. If you AFK in highsec, you WILL be shot. Just because some players have avoided it until now doesn't mean it won't happen tonight... or tomorrow. Look at the CODE. killboard. Its filled with plenty of players who thought they could AFK and get away with it.

Well, they didn't. And neither can you.

BBB


Your points are definitely relevant and appropriate and it is definitely an issue.

But the point is it is that living in highsec...just being their limits your potential income.

This makes the fuel for the null sec wars cheap. If it wasn't then unfortunately they would not be as big...and ergo content limiting. the high sec ores are the foundations of eve ship building and it has to be cheaply available and provided by those who accept mining afk in high sec is going to get them no where fast but hey their washing is getting done.

in truth the Afk miners in particular are selling their commodity for far less then its worth as the ore they sell is well near worthless due to inflation and a waste of time collecting anyway

As for haulers I cannot understand why you would attack them as they have to move one guys tonne of crap to another guys tonne of crap and doing 30+ jumps and hour is not fun yet it is necessary

the main culprit for your anger should be the Null bear botters as the can chip away uninterrupted at highly prized ores under the terrifying reputation of Null sec for massive isk return for little effort

Maybe if gankers were to target the spoils of null bear exploitation then maybe your concerns and the ganker action taken on them would be more respected and valued

Afk is a risk but should be treated as such
Vector Symian
0 Fear
#93 - 2015-01-15 02:06:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Vector Symian
Kaely Tanniss wrote:
Vector Symian wrote:
Hello it may shock you but I am a pretty active pilot and I don't care about going A.F.K (away from keyboard)

The reasons are fairly straightforward ...

- It is high sec, filled with the pilots who may not have the free time available to hold down a activity/isk quota for one of the alliances.
- We are human and I sometimes need to pee...or watch a Game of Thrones episode.
- We pay a subscription this is an allocated amount of time in which we may play as we will, or not if we so choose.
- Those who grind for plex are guilty for simply being tight with their money and will never succeed at the game any way as it requires making decisions, and having fun with friends (and making contacts) is one of the most important strategies of the game.
- A lot of game styles may require days of waiting to be able to do something with out unnecessary loss.
- It has created a whole new style of play, preying on those who happily accept the risk of going afk

on counter point their is no issue with freighter ganking, this is based purely on the massive potential income a ganked freighter may possess

Basically if you can get away with it then by all means

I am wondering is their any reason I may of missed?

please discuss freely

Thankyou for reading

By all means, feel free to afk anytime..it adds content and target practice for other Eve players. Just don't get angry about it. Every choice comes with consequenses, If you choose to afk in space, you accept that your ship may not be there when you get back. Twisted



That is also a relevant point

I fully accept that I could be ganked and never(well their was that one time...in band camp) been angry about it

however a new player may not understand the etiquette In the risk and would take it personally
Altirius Saldiaro
Doomheim
#94 - 2015-01-15 07:21:34 UTC
I like to pretend that I am AFK cloaking in nullsec. It always amuses me to watch a station with everyone docked up, afraid to go mine or run sites. Its that local channel. If it wasnt there, they'd be playing the game and having fun. Instead they sit in station and hope that I'll leave. I have lots and lots of patience. Those bears come out eventually. Its all mind games.
Ima Wreckyou
The Conference Elite
The Conference
#95 - 2015-01-15 08:06:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Ima Wreckyou
Vector Symian wrote:
Maybe if gankers were to target the spoils of null bear exploitation then maybe your concerns and the ganker action taken on them would be more respected and valued

But my day wouldn't be complete without the soul nourishing screams and tears of exploding highsec carebears. I don't hate them or have an issue with them doing what they chose to do. It's just a lot of fun to see them cry while all their assets go up in flames as their existence is extinguished with the help of my antimatter bullets.

So there... I dared to say it.. is everyone happy now?

Evil RatKid
Jasmine Deer
Perkone
Caldari State
#96 - 2015-01-15 11:18:13 UTC
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
Vector Symian wrote:
Maybe if gankers were to target the spoils of null bear exploitation then maybe your concerns and the ganker action taken on them would be more respected and valued

But my day wouldn't be complete without the soul nourishing screams and tears of exploding highsec carebears. I don't hate them or have an issue with them doing what they chose to do. It's just a lot of fun to see them cry why all their assets go up in flames as their existence is extinguished with the help of my antimatter bullets.

So there... I dared to say it.. is everyone happy now?


For sure we can't have exploding null bears whining to the Supreme Council of the Blue Doughnut.
Altirius Saldiaro
Doomheim
#97 - 2015-01-15 14:03:01 UTC
Jasmine Deer wrote:
Ima Wreckyou wrote:
Vector Symian wrote:
Maybe if gankers were to target the spoils of null bear exploitation then maybe your concerns and the ganker action taken on them would be more respected and valued

But my day wouldn't be complete without the soul nourishing screams and tears of exploding highsec carebears. I don't hate them or have an issue with them doing what they chose to do. It's just a lot of fun to see them cry why all their assets go up in flames as their existence is extinguished with the help of my antimatter bullets.

So there... I dared to say it.. is everyone happy now?


For sure we can't have exploding null bears whining to the Supreme Council of the Blue Doughnut.


They're getting too fat on doughnuts as it is. We have to thin them down by chasing them around.
Varathius
Enlightened Industries
Goonswarm Federation
#98 - 2015-01-15 14:17:51 UTC
Vector Symian wrote:
Hello it may shock you but I am a pretty active pilot and I don't care about going A.F.K (away from keyboard)

The reasons are fairly straightforward ...

- It is high sec, filled with the pilots who may not have the free time available to hold down a activity/isk quota for one of the alliances.
- We are human and I sometimes need to pee...or watch a Game of Thrones episode.
- We pay a subscription this is an allocated amount of time in which we may play as we will, or not if we so choose.
- Those who grind for plex are guilty for simply being tight with their money and will never succeed at the game any way as it requires making decisions, and having fun with friends (and making contacts) is one of the most important strategies of the game.
- A lot of game styles may require days of waiting to be able to do something with out unnecessary loss.
- It has created a whole new style of play, preying on those who happily accept the risk of going afk

on counter point their is no issue with freighter ganking, this is based purely on the massive potential income a ganked freighter may possess

Basically if you can get away with it then by all means

I am wondering is their any reason I may of missed?

please discuss freely

Thankyou for reading


You will most likely be the safest when players from CODE alliance are online and in your system. Those guys always do the right job to keep the numbers in local balanced.
Omgitsbears
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#99 - 2015-01-15 14:19:57 UTC
Ferni Ka'Nviiou wrote:

You lost my interest at 'People grinding for PLEX being guilty of being tight with money'
At that point I realise there is probably nothing to discuss with you.


That quote really hit a sore spot with you.
Imperial Concubine
Doomheim
#100 - 2015-01-15 16:54:39 UTC
Ganking is a necessary part of gameplay.

It teaches you to fit your ships better.

To become less greedy.

To be aware of your surroundings (who is in system?)

When CODE. enters the system i am in, I mock, taunt and dare them.

Or flee is there are more that 2 LOL.