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New atmospheric environment effects for asteroid belts.

First post
Author
Dersen Lowery
The Scope
#41 - 2015-01-11 05:54:20 UTC
Salpun wrote:
Vincent Athena wrote:
Just did the mass test. Still just as bad for me: 1.7 FPS in a belt. For comparison, during the PvP part of the test I get 8 FPS zoomed out, and 4 zoomed in. In clear space with just a station and maybe a ship or three, I get 30.

Have you down loaded EVE Probe so your setup is in the graphics team database with values?


Vincent's running on a Mac. We don't have EVE Probe yet.

Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables.

I voted in CSM X!

Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#42 - 2015-01-12 02:20:41 UTC
Dersen Lowery wrote:
Vincent's running on a Mac. We don't have EVE Probe yet.

I'd settle for support for OS X 10.10...

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.

Basil Pupkin
Republic Military School
#43 - 2015-01-12 04:34:17 UTC
Belts went fine with my GTX 590 - 110+ FPS as usual (120 Hz monitor, window mode).

Then I got into an anom and found those new effects in a cloud there... screeeeeeeech, up to 80C, down to 30 FPS.

Anything I should do to help resolving this?

Being teh freightergankbear automatically puts you below missionbear and minerbear in carebear hierarchy.

If you're about to make "this will make eve un-eve" argument, odds are you are defending some utterly horrible mechanics against a good change.

Malou Hashur
Enterprise Holdings
#44 - 2015-01-12 08:21:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Malou Hashur
never mind

CCP Philosophy ==>>

  1. If it works, break it. If it’s broken, leave it and break something else.

  2. Ignore all Forum comments that raise issues and concerns about our "features", and bring said "features" in anyway.

Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#45 - 2015-01-12 14:16:46 UTC
I know the focus is on the Proteus release, but afterwards... Any chance of getting a Mac-specific update on supporting the AMD Radeon R9 M290X and M295X graphics cards?

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.

Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
#46 - 2015-01-12 14:40:03 UTC
Since there hasn't been any dev responses in any of the Proteus feedback threads I guess I will extend my chances of my issue/question being read and post it here too:

I saw there was another patch to sisi yesterday so I decided to check to see if anything has been fixed with the new asteroid belt effects.

1) Asteroid debris sprite blob:

http://imgur.com/DjuHoeO

http://imgur.com/GUg4M2v

Nope, still looks like an awful blob of duplicated sprites. Does not make belts feel more real or look neater, at all. I've seen better more realistic sprite blobs in older games. And yes, I have my graphics all the way up. A better way to do this might be just spawn many much smaller asteroids that can actually be mined, or add small bits to the larger asteroids that float around them depending on size. And ice belts need ice chunks floating around, not rock sprites cluttering the screen(granted they aren't the same brown color as the asteroid sprites but still don't look like they quite below), it is a ice field after all, not an asteroid belt.

2) Light Rays:

In order to be able to see the light rays, you also have to have the Asteroid Sprite Blob enabled as well. Why advertise these as 2 separate features if one requires the other? I don't see why we shouldn't be able to see the light rays if we don't want to see the sprite blob. I mean they don't have sprite blobs in Incursion systems yet we get to see the light rays, should be no different here.

Please separate these 2 features. If you don't believe me go and turn off the asteroid sprite blob but leave light rays on, you will not see the light rays. Unless this is a bug and they are supposed to be visible on their own without the sprite blob?
Murkar Omaristos
The Alabaster Albatross
Unreasonable Bastards
#47 - 2015-01-12 22:47:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Murkar Omaristos
I got no clue what you're running, but this is what the belt effects actually look like if you're able to run with graphics settings maxed out:

New Belt Effects

Super cool new navy exequror model in there because why not :P
CCP BunnyVirus
C C P
C C P Alliance
#48 - 2015-01-13 11:07:03 UTC
Dangeresque Too wrote:
Since there hasn't been any dev responses in any of the Proteus feedback threads I guess I will extend my chances of my issue/question being read and post it here too:

I saw there was another patch to sisi yesterday so I decided to check to see if anything has been fixed with the new asteroid belt effects.

1) Asteroid debris sprite blob:

http://imgur.com/DjuHoeO

http://imgur.com/GUg4M2v

Nope, still looks like an awful blob of duplicated sprites. Does not make belts feel more real or look neater, at all. I've seen better more realistic sprite blobs in older games. And yes, I have my graphics all the way up. A better way to do this might be just spawn many much smaller asteroids that can actually be mined, or add small bits to the larger asteroids that float around them depending on size. And ice belts need ice chunks floating around, not rock sprites cluttering the screen(granted they aren't the same brown color as the asteroid sprites but still don't look like they quite below), it is a ice field after all, not an asteroid belt.

2) Light Rays:

In order to be able to see the light rays, you also have to have the Asteroid Sprite Blob enabled as well. Why advertise these as 2 separate features if one requires the other? I don't see why we shouldn't be able to see the light rays if we don't want to see the sprite blob. I mean they don't have sprite blobs in Incursion systems yet we get to see the light rays, should be no different here.

Please separate these 2 features. If you don't believe me go and turn off the asteroid sprite blob but leave light rays on, you will not see the light rays. Unless this is a bug and they are supposed to be visible on their own without the sprite blob?




For Issue number one. The additional asteroids in dx9 consist of sprites and not instanced geometry, you only get those with dx11.

3D Artist

Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
#49 - 2015-01-13 15:43:04 UTC
CCP BunnyVirus wrote:
For Issue number one. The additional asteroids in dx9 consist of sprites and not instanced geometry, you only get those with dx11.
Oh, you mean the in game graphics setting that is controlled via a setting buried in the Launcher's settings menu? Maybe I'm silly for expecting a graphics setting to be in a more applicable place. Until you mentioned it I never took the additional time to search through every single menu possible to find it, kept seeing people mention dx9 or dx11 but hadn't the foggiest where exactly it was since it wasn't on the graphics or general settings in game.

But anyhoo, seriously, that really doesn't look much better. I parked my ship next to one, still looked terrible. The rock was half the size of my ship, I could fly right through it, and it had no more depth look/feel to it than the sprite version. The field still looked like a bunch of over-cluttered dots on my screen from a normal viewing distance. And even though my FPS stayed at 60, I was watching the system draw the new objects as I rotated my screen around. If this were done right there would be tons of tiny fragments of the actual asteroids floating around the belt that you could actually mine as well, seeing how some of these 'objects' are larger than some of the mineable rocks to begin with. And maybe your ship could actually colide with these fragments as well, but since they would be smaller they would bounce off instead of your ship bouncing around, or have them slowly orbit some point in the belt or one of the larger asteroids.

But I really like how you just left #2 hanging... and no, it didn't work correctly with dx11 either. In both you have to enable the asteroid blob in order to see the light rays. Not exactly ideal.

So as it stands this is another feature (Asteroid Environment) which will remain turned off from my end. Not because my system can't handle it, but because it looks terrible and is poorly implemented. Now if the Light Rays got fixed to not also require Asteroid Environment to be enabled as well, that would be nice as they do look good and are at least pretty decently implemented. These are going to be a terrible drag to some of the missions that were already hugely taxing to most systems with all of their hundreds of structures to form a simple wall next to a billion washed out bright gas clouds inside a widespread asteroid belt with other structures all over. Yeah, you can barely see anything now, let alone not being able to see through the combined clouds or its exaggerated effect on framerate. My guess is in mission effects weren't taken into consideration when this was being thought up. Another example of unfinished features and ignored feedback.
Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
#50 - 2015-01-15 15:02:09 UTC
CCP BunnyVirus wrote:
Dangeresque Too wrote:
2) Light Rays:

In order to be able to see the light rays, you also have to have the Asteroid Sprite Blob enabled as well. Why advertise these as 2 separate features if one requires the other? I don't see why we shouldn't be able to see the light rays if we don't want to see the sprite blob. I mean they don't have sprite blobs in Incursion systems yet we get to see the light rays, should be no different here.

Please separate these 2 features. If you don't believe me go and turn off the asteroid sprite blob but leave light rays on, you will not see the light rays. Unless this is a bug and they are supposed to be visible on their own without the sprite blob?
For Issue number one. The additional asteroids in dx9 consist of sprites and not instanced geometry, you only get those with dx11.
So, *cough cough*, about them Light Rays... intended, broken, don't care?
CCP Darwin
C C P
C C P Alliance
#51 - 2015-01-15 17:58:30 UTC
Dangeresque Too wrote:
In both you have to enable the asteroid blob in order to see the light rays. Not exactly ideal.


Those "light rays" are the bright areas between shadows from the rocks. The switch controls whether the rocks cast shadows in the fog. I suggest that having shadows cast from rocks that are not there would look very strange and not be desirable.

CCP Darwin  •  Senior Software Engineer, Art & Graphics, EVE Online  •  @mark_wilkins

Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
Tactical-Retreat
#52 - 2015-01-15 22:58:51 UTC
You guys should really consider making it on by default Big smile

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Ultimate Citadel Guide - 2016 EVE Career Chart

MuppetsSlayed
Angelus.Mortis
#53 - 2015-01-16 18:31:28 UTC  |  Edited by: MuppetsSlayed
Dont get me wrong it looks good but there is one huge issue with it.

If your in a cloaked ship in an asteroid belt you cant tell what is a real asteroid that will uncloak you and what is a bit of new debris that is in effect a ghost u can fly right through.

The same issue exists with getting stuck (hung up) when trying to warp or align out - u cant tll what is a real asteroid or what is a ghost.

I turned it on for a play about and discovered it was just too dangerous to use so turned it off again.
Its all well and good doing visual only features, it looks great, but it doesnt work in a game play sense.

Nice try but but fail! Shocked
Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
#54 - 2015-01-19 18:26:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Dangeresque Too
CCP Darwin wrote:
Dangeresque Too wrote:
In both you have to enable the asteroid blob in order to see the light rays. Not exactly ideal.


Those "light rays" are the bright areas between shadows from the rocks. The switch controls whether the rocks cast shadows in the fog. I suggest that having shadows cast from rocks that are not there would look very strange and not be desirable.
So you aren't accepting that there were already rocks in the belts, you know, the ones people mine? I guess that even though they also cast shadows in addition to the new asteroid blob that asking for a mode where it was just the normal asteroids and their shadows would be too much to ask? Nobody ever said that the Light Rays have to cast shadows for the sprite blob when the blob is turned off, or did I?

You are almost saying that the normal asteroids can't cast shadows on their own or don't exist, but they do. The asteroid blob of sprites isn't the only thing that casts shadows, am I right? I can't be the only one that saw the 2 separate options and then wrongly presumed that if you had just Light Rays turned on that you would still get shadows from the normal asteroids.

And further, did anyone take into account the effect this would have on missions that already had too much environment to begin with?
Dangeresque Too
Pistols for Pandas
#55 - 2015-01-21 18:36:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Dangeresque Too
You seriously saying that the normal asteroids can't cast shadows on their own or don't exist? But they do. The asteroid blob of sprites isn't the only thing that casts shadows, am I right? I can't be the only one that saw the 2 separate options and then wrongly presumed that if you had just Light Rays turned on that you would still get shadows from the normal asteroids.

When did I say that we need shadows being cast from things that weren't there? I just said let the Light Rays cast shadows with the things that were still there, like I don't know, the harvestable asteroids that were there to begin with.

Or are you saying that the normal harvestable asteroids are incapable of casting shadows on their own without the sprite blob's shadows being cast at the same time?

I mean when in those belts even your ship casts shadows, but it isn't an asteroid sprite, so I don't see why the asteroids wouldn't be able to cast shadows without the presence of the sprite blob.
Van Beyus
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#56 - 2015-01-29 12:06:26 UTC
I know I'm a bit late on this but I have to say these new effects are an amazing addition to the game. Congratulations for the team who worked on it. The effect is real trippy when you are moving slowly around an end of the asteroid and focus the camera at the other end. There's a small FPS reduction running on an old graphics card, but it doesn't compromise the effect. I'd love to see those kind of effects replacing all the fog textures. It gives a much better sense of depth.

I'm not online most of the time, but I won't change this signature when I do just to make your life easier.

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