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Crime & Punishment

 
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Hisec Ganking is Really Fun- and Easy ~my (long) story~

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Meilandra Vanderganken
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#81 - 2015-01-11 18:58:15 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:


Ya, people who commit CRIMES suffer the loss of their crummy 5 million isk ship. A few of them can cause billions of isk in damage.

gimme a break

A t1 fitted frigate can cause billions of damage in the right circumstances, clearly the problem is with the T1 frigate being overpowered. Roll
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#82 - 2015-01-11 19:34:26 UTC
Meilandra Vanderganken wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:


Ya, people who commit CRIMES suffer the loss of their crummy 5 million isk ship. A few of them can cause billions of isk in damage.

gimme a break

A t1 fitted frigate can cause billions of damage in the right circumstances, clearly the problem is with the T1 frigate being overpowered. Roll


The problem is that you can repeatedly commit crimes with a 5 mil isk frigate...inflict tens of billions of isk in damage, and face no real consequences. That is called a broken and dysfunctional criminal justice system.
Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#83 - 2015-01-11 19:42:52 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
Mag's wrote:
I'd love a 5 mill gank cat. Does anyone have the fitting and magic space dust to make it work?


How much does a gank cat with all meta 1 stuff cost? Can't imagine it's over 5 mil....even meta 4 stuff should be reasonably cheap.


meta 4 is usually right around 10 mill market value (cheaper if you build the pieces you can build yourself like rigs and the damage mods).

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#84 - 2015-01-11 19:44:27 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Tengu Grib wrote:
You actually can clear any number of concord with one person, it just takes 15 minutes per concord, and you have to know how their responses are determined. Mail me if you'd like more info.
Strategically placing ships before going GCC can cut that down considerably.


Yes absolutely, with safes and an orca full of shuttles or noob ships (or even just empty ones abandoned at safes) you can clear as many concord as you need to with one person in a single GCC timer.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#85 - 2015-01-11 19:57:05 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Hm. The guy who activates a killright and pops the target loses nothing.
The guy who finds a war target and pops him/her/it loses nothing.
The guy who suspect baits someone and pops them loses nothing.
The guy who duels someone and pops them loses nothing.
The guy who suicide ganks someone loses his ship every time.

Your chair has no legs.


Ya, people who commit CRIMES suffer the loss of their crummy 5 million isk ship. A few of them can cause billions of isk in damage.

gimme a break


I can awox a corp and clean out billions in assets and isk from their coffers. I lose nothing. (in fact I gain the medal that I so generously give myself!) I think you are under the mistaken conception that crime in Eve is actually punished by the game itself, the only meaningful punishment comes from other players. If other players cannot or will not punish you, then there is no punishment. Working as intended, this is Eve.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#86 - 2015-01-11 20:08:43 UTC
Tengu Grib wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Hm. The guy who activates a killright and pops the target loses nothing.
The guy who finds a war target and pops him/her/it loses nothing.
The guy who suspect baits someone and pops them loses nothing.
The guy who duels someone and pops them loses nothing.
The guy who suicide ganks someone loses his ship every time.

Your chair has no legs.


Ya, people who commit CRIMES suffer the loss of their crummy 5 million isk ship. A few of them can cause billions of isk in damage.

gimme a break


I can awox a corp and clean out billions in assets and isk from their coffers. I lose nothing. (in fact I gain the medal that I so generously give myself!) I think you are under the mistaken conception that crime in Eve is actually punished by the game itself, the only meaningful punishment comes from other players. If other players cannot or will not punish you, then there is no punishment. Working as intended, this is Eve.


You are right, awoxxing is a disaster and is broken. That's why CCP wants to get rid of it. And the fact that CONCORD blows up your ship and gives you a 15 minute GCC timer belies the idea that the only meaningful punishment is player based. Punishing suicide gankers should not be left to players who, at most, can destroy some crummy cheap gank ship. Only CCP is capable of imposing meaningful punishments that can actually deter some of the activity in question.
Super Perforator
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#87 - 2015-01-11 21:09:46 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:

You are right, awoxxing is a disaster and is broken. That's why CCP wants to get rid of it. And the fact that CONCORD blows up your ship and gives you a 15 minute GCC timer belies the idea that the only meaningful punishment is player based. Punishing suicide gankers should not be left to players who, at most, can destroy some crummy cheap gank ship. Only CCP is capable of imposing meaningful punishments that can actually deter some of the activity in question.


The 15 minute timer is only important if my scout finds the next target before it has run out... normally it takes me that 15 mins to pull concord, write a letter offering a mining permit to the criminal that had his illegal equipment confiscated, and in the rest of the spare time I can be refitting new cats/coercers/thrashers... and, of course, scouting out the next criminal.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=5610165#post5610165

Praise James!
John E Normus
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#88 - 2015-01-11 23:56:06 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
You are right, awoxxing is a disaster and is broken. That's why CCP wants to get rid of it. And the fact that CONCORD blows up your ship and gives you a 15 minute GCC timer belies the idea that the only meaningful punishment is player based. Punishing suicide gankers should not be left to players who, at most, can destroy some crummy cheap gank ship. Only CCP is capable of imposing meaningful punishments that can actually deter some of the activity in question.


Take it easy old buddy, you're better than this.

Between Ignorance and Wisdom
Tear Jar
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#89 - 2015-01-12 03:12:26 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Tengu Grib wrote:
You actually can clear any number of concord with one person, it just takes 15 minutes per concord, and you have to know how their responses are determined. Mail me if you'd like more info.
Strategically placing ships before going GCC can cut that down considerably.


Huh I hadn't thought about that. Thanks for the tip.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#90 - 2015-01-12 03:30:37 UTC
Tengu Grib wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Hm. The guy who activates a killright and pops the target loses nothing.
The guy who finds a war target and pops him/her/it loses nothing.
The guy who suspect baits someone and pops them loses nothing.
The guy who duels someone and pops them loses nothing.
The guy who suicide ganks someone loses his ship every time.

Your chair has no legs.


Ya, people who commit CRIMES suffer the loss of their crummy 5 million isk ship. A few of them can cause billions of isk in damage.

gimme a break


I can awox a corp and clean out billions in assets and isk from their coffers. I lose nothing. (in fact I gain the medal that I so generously give myself!) I think you are under the mistaken conception that crime in Eve is actually punished by the game itself, the only meaningful punishment comes from other players. If other players cannot or will not punish you, then there is no punishment. Working as intended, this is Eve.

I think it's time for CCP to step in to stop this.

First, of course, prevent corp awoxing in highsec... ah, wait a moment

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Velicitia
XS Tech
#91 - 2015-01-12 12:32:34 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Tengu Grib wrote:


I can awox a corp and clean out billions in assets and isk from their coffers. I lose nothing. (in fact I gain the medal that I so generously give myself!) I think you are under the mistaken conception that crime in Eve is actually punished by the game itself, the only meaningful punishment comes from other players. If other players cannot or will not punish you, then there is no punishment. Working as intended, this is Eve.

I think it's time for CCP to step in to stop this.

First, of course, prevent corp awoxing in highsec... ah, wait a moment


ugh, CCP don't do this. For the love of the Amarrian god, don't do this.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Gaylord Fappington
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#92 - 2015-01-12 15:07:23 UTC
The only thing I hate more than Goons is Goons who kill defenseless miners. Grrr.
Tengu Grib
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#93 - 2015-01-12 18:03:43 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
Tengu Grib wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Hm. The guy who activates a killright and pops the target loses nothing.
The guy who finds a war target and pops him/her/it loses nothing.
The guy who suspect baits someone and pops them loses nothing.
The guy who duels someone and pops them loses nothing.
The guy who suicide ganks someone loses his ship every time.

Your chair has no legs.


Ya, people who commit CRIMES suffer the loss of their crummy 5 million isk ship. A few of them can cause billions of isk in damage.

gimme a break


I can awox a corp and clean out billions in assets and isk from their coffers. I lose nothing. (in fact I gain the medal that I so generously give myself!) I think you are under the mistaken conception that crime in Eve is actually punished by the game itself, the only meaningful punishment comes from other players. If other players cannot or will not punish you, then there is no punishment. Working as intended, this is Eve.


You are right, awoxxing is a disaster and is broken. That's why CCP wants to get rid of it. And the fact that CONCORD blows up your ship and gives you a 15 minute GCC timer belies the idea that the only meaningful punishment is player based. Punishing suicide gankers should not be left to players who, at most, can destroy some crummy cheap gank ship. Only CCP is capable of imposing meaningful punishments that can actually deter some of the activity in question.


The only thing they are removing is corp member flagless aggressrion. Nothing I talked about actually requires that. You live in a world where you think CCP should protect you from the bad people. Everyone else, including CCP tells you that you need to protect yourself. The tools are there. Use them. You don't need to punish the ganker if he fails to gank you.

Rabble Rabble Rabble

Praise James, Supreme Protector of High Sec.
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#94 - 2015-01-13 04:08:07 UTC
Tengu Grib wrote:


The only thing they are removing is corp member flagless aggressrion. Nothing I talked about actually requires that. You live in a world where you think CCP should protect you from the bad people. Everyone else, including CCP tells you that you need to protect yourself. The tools are there. Use them. You don't need to punish the ganker if he fails to gank you.


Look, I think threat should be taken care of as well. As long as the criminal justice system does not work, there is no rational reason for highsec players to join player corps. Until the system is fixed....people will rationally choose to remain in npc corps.

Gankers expose themselves to no real risk. They can inflict billions of isk in damage in cheap gank ships...never needing to risk undocking in an expensive ship. They can make their isk on nullsec alts in blue donut space.

BROKEN
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#95 - 2015-01-13 05:22:11 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
never needing to risk undocking in an expensive ship. They can make their isk on nullsec alts in blue donut space.

BROKEN

That can be said of any type of gameplay in which ship loss is common. Having an alternate source of income on a different character is hardly something that can reasonably be considered a balancing factor.
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#96 - 2015-01-13 05:24:03 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
Veers Belvar wrote:
never needing to risk undocking in an expensive ship. They can make their isk on nullsec alts in blue donut space.

BROKEN

That can be said of any type of gameplay in which ship loss is common. Having an alternate source of income on a different character is hardly something that can reasonably be considered a balancing factor.


Ya, but here one group of players is effectively denying another group of players the ability to make isk...all the while being shielded from bearing the consequences of their criminality due to the ability to simply go and do PvE on nullsec alts.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#97 - 2015-01-13 05:32:06 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:

Ya, but here one group of players is effectively denying another group of players the ability to make isk...all the while being shielded from bearing the consequences of their criminality due to the ability to simply go and do PvE on nullsec alts.


That tends to happen when a group of people who actually play the game go up against a group of people who are just afk.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Charlie Jacobson
#98 - 2015-01-13 08:18:11 UTC
Clearly the solution would be to disallow having alts? Everyone should only play on one character, always! (That's what I do anyway) \o/

I support James 315 and the New Order of Highsec
Don Purple
Snuggle Society
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#99 - 2015-01-13 10:49:09 UTC
Sounds like you had fun, hit me up for fleets if you are in town :D

I am just here to snuggle and do spy stuff.
servalaan
#100 - 2015-01-13 16:09:56 UTC
Mr Omniblivion wrote:
This turned into a long story, my posting sucks, you probably shouldn't read it.


Thanks, I didn't

If pinocchio told you his nose was about to grow, what would happen?