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Warfare & Tactics

 
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Wardec's and RR logi

Author
Koltann Uitra
Dystopian Angels
#1 - 2015-01-05 17:03:11 UTC
So this has bothered me for a bit what CCP's idea is behind this mechanic. How is a neutral non-valid target conducting RR actions on a war target actively engaging another war target legal in highsec? Seems to be the equivalent of me giving a lift to a few guys that just robbed a bank. It would make sense that by providing a buff or any other negative or positive action to a combatant would make you a valid target for this engagement.

It's a valid tactic and anywhere you can take an advantage by all means take it! But it seems to me that it removes from the war game mechanic. Maybe CCP intends to fix this, I hope so. But In my opinion the act of RR a war target should give you a limited engagement timer, the same should go with criminal and suspect timers.
Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#2 - 2015-01-05 17:28:38 UTC
I'm totally for remote reps in the case of war decs, what's stopping you have neutral parties on your side waiting for those reps to go flashy? I used to be in a corp that did just this. Brick tanked the war targets then wiped out the expensive logi ships. A similar situation I don't agree with neutral logi being able to help out is a duel. Totally misleading to call it a duel because it really isn't

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.

Koltann Uitra
Dystopian Angels
#3 - 2015-01-05 17:52:40 UTC
Nothings stopping me, we have used them before. Any advantage you can get for victory right? It just seems cheap. By choosing to rep an active combatant your no longer remaining neutral, your status should reflect this in game to match your actions.
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2015-01-05 19:40:32 UTC
dont neutral logi get limited engagements when they rep something aggressing another?
Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#5 - 2015-01-05 19:55:53 UTC
Even better, they go suspect so ANYONE can shoot them.

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.

Koltann Uitra
Dystopian Angels
#6 - 2015-01-05 20:06:34 UTC
Not when they rep a combatant attacking a war target.

So this gets even better. Your saying neutral RR will go suspect if they rep a criminal... but they are perfectly neutral if the RR a war target engaging another war target?
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2015-01-05 20:09:00 UTC
Koltann Uitra wrote:
Not when they rep a combatant attacking a war target.

So this gets even better. Your saying neutral RR will go suspect if they rep a criminal... but they are perfectly neutral if the RR a war target engaging another war target?


I think what we are saying is that if a neutral logi reps anything aggressing anything, they go suspect.

ValentinaDLM
SoE Roughriders
Electus Matari
#8 - 2015-01-05 20:18:41 UTC
Logi used to get concorded if they rep a criminal, pretty sure they just can't do it now since people took advantage of that.....

but outside of criminals you are going to get a suspect flag and anyone can shoot you, and you get aggression so you can't just immediately dock when you get in trouble, I would say this is about the best state neutral logi has ever been in since the game started.
Koltann Uitra
Dystopian Angels
#9 - 2015-01-05 20:34:26 UTC
To clarify,

My main focus was neutral logi alts being used in wars between corps.
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2015-01-05 20:56:42 UTC
and to which we gave the answer: neutral logi repping anything that is currently under aggression will make the logi suspect and free to shoot by everyone.

Neutral logi were once a factor in high sec wars, but not anymore.
Valkin Mordirc
#11 - 2015-01-05 20:56:51 UTC
Koltann Uitra wrote:
To clarify,

My main focus was neutral logi alts being used in wars between corps.



If any body tries to rep anybody else with a combat timer , the RR will go Suspect. Making it completely legal for ANYone to shoot at the RR.

So to clarify

Wartarget A attacks Wartarget B > Neut RR, reps Wartarget A, Neut RR goes suspect, and everyone is free to fire on RR, Now RR going yellow is sometimes hard to catch, because they tend to be 70km out. However that doesn't change the fact that any logi pilot is going to 70km out anyways.

However if the Neut RR joins corp right before then it's fair game to being with.

The only differnce between Neut RR and incorp RR is that the Logi Pilot can chose when he can be engaged,



So Neut RR is almost completely useless in Trade hubs. Neutral RR is easy to counter if you know your wartargets have it. Just bring a neutral Falcon/rook/BB and have at it.


Personally the only thing about RR that needs to be fixed is that when an In Alliance Corp tries to rep another in alliance corp, they will get a suspect timer. This was a HUGE Problem for the Mercs during the Galactic/RvB war.


So I don't think it's OP or cheep or unfair, It's not hard to see a Neutral RR in highsec, and it's pretty easy to catch as it's useally an alt of someones who is Multi-boxiing.

I hope that sums it up?
#DeleteTheWeak
Koltann Uitra
Dystopian Angels
#12 - 2015-01-05 21:06:29 UTC
It does. I'm just confused because the neutral RR did not show up as a valid target in hud as it should have. It should have showed up but it did not. Thank for the answer
Valkin Mordirc
#13 - 2015-01-05 21:15:41 UTC
Koltann Uitra wrote:
It does. I'm just confused because the neutral RR did not show up as a valid target in hud as it should have. It should have showed up but it did not. Thank for the answer



I would go ahead and check your overview, if your using a tab dedicated to only wartargets then suspect ships will not show up,

#DeleteTheWeak
Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
Aideron Robotics.
#14 - 2015-01-06 17:13:49 UTC
I agree with valkin, it's an overview issue rather than suspect mechanic.

Just Add Water

Bronson Hughes
The Knights of the Blessed Mother of Acceleration
#15 - 2015-01-06 17:42:00 UTC
Confirming above two posters. Neutrals remote repping any party in a wardec immediately go suspect. I've bagged a few T1 logi cruisers who were repping POSes engaged in a wardec. Good times.

I have been in situations where said logi ship did not show up as suspect in my overview until I re-loaded grid by warping off, but that's an overview issue.

Relatively Notorious By Association

My Many Misadventures

I predicted FAUXs

Phil Hinken
Doomheim
#16 - 2015-01-06 18:06:03 UTC
Does this have to do with that pretty massive blockade in Litiura the other day?

"With the dowhop zig-zag jello pops, kids nowadays bee zop Rudy ha ha ha ziggety zaggity puddin." - Bill Cosby