Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Ok, presuming you are still with me. I'm not anti-ganking, I love ganking, now I only do it for profit and not nearly as often as I would like to, haven't done it in a while though. But pilots with low standings (be it faction, npc, or security) enjoy relative freedom compared to what one would think would come with being of such low standing. I can't be a wanted criminal and still have free riegn to hang out at the local police office and carry out my daily business and expect anything less than to be arrested on site, so why should these bad standing pilots expect to be treated different?

Now as far as what actions need to be taken, if you can't derive that from the examples I will lay it out in more detail:

1) Negative NPC corp standings should disallow you from docking at their stations and using their services. Their stations should shoot you on site. And if you want access to those facilities again, then work with a friend to share some corp standing with you, afterall this is a multiplayer game, right?

2) Negative Faction standings, you should be shot on site from stations that belong to that faction. You should be denied access to those stations as you are an enemy of the state, thereby a sworn enemy of that station. Gate guns should appropriately engage as well, they are state operated facilities are they not?

3) Negative Security standings. Concord has declared you to be a pirate and a criminal, to be shot on site. Any NPC station to accept you would be actively aiding and abetting a fugutive, therefore you would be shot on site at any high-sec NPC station and not allowed to dock. Gate guns should engage you on site as well. (still working on if/how much gates should allow access for criminals or if it should be separated via system security level and the extent of the negative standings, but that is where a lot of the -10 grief gankers will go full ****** flame mode saying its not fair and hi-sec is already too safe, nevermind the lack of real applicable consequences to their actions currently)

4) Faction Navies should all scram/point you, and if you can kill the tackle ship and get away good for you until the next time you land on grid in their space. The Navy forces should also escalate after a set amount of time if you are just tanking their damage, bring in more guns, heavier guns, and additional tackle too.

Over the years I've seen things going on in game and thought to myself, "why in the world is that even possible or accepted?". Things like a Fleet Tempest in an opposing faction's militia sitting on a gate in a Caldari 1.0 system like everyone else is just in the wrong place. He was there for at least an hour, avoiding faction police by having his FW buddy in a frigate warp around grid all the time distracting the Navy NPCs. Thats like a division of US Marines hanging out in Pyongyang, North Korea, randomly shooting communist party members as they walk past the capital building because they have a clown making balloon animals on the corner distracting the North Korea army. Or in another situation a guy just sitting on a gate, tanking and endlessly killing the Faction Navy ships, must have been at it for at least a half hour, there were dozens of NPC wrecks floating around. That's just like those awful Walker Texas Ranger fights, where you have a dozen bad guys surround him, but they seem to only be allowed to attack him one at a time, waiting until the previous guy is out of action before sending the next one in.

With these changes being criminal would have meaningful consequences that would actually affect your ability to perform normal activities in high security space, kinda like being on Interpol's wanted list might just a little bit hinder your ability to do normal people things in public. Might even help distribute the market a little bit more back to the factional hubs like CCP would like to see happen instead of Jita 4-4 being the practical end all of market activity.

And what ever happened to the long ago announced changes to player policing like gaining sec status for killing negative sec pilots or criminals? We are still capped at best 5.0 and worst -10 no matter what a pilot does. And both sets of those pilots have exactly the same access to stargates and stations and services etc.

TLDR:
*NOT ABOUT GANKING ITSELF, OR IF IT IS RIGHT OR WRONG, HOW TO PROTECT AGAINST GANKS, OR THE GOOD/BAD ABOUT CRIMINAL LIFE*

Having negative standings should have a tangible consequence. You should no longer have access to the stations of those groups that hate your or say they will shoot on site. Stations and gates belonging to those groups that you have negative standing with should infact shoot on site. Negative security pilots labeled criminal by Concord should not be given safe refuge in NPC stations in high-sec as those NPCs would be aiding and abetting a fugitive. Regular NPC corps, or even pirate NPC corps, should deny access to those who have negative standing with them.

You can more than easily enough fix your bad standings, and it is even easier keep them fixed. Eve is a game about choices, if don't like the consequences, then don't keep making those choices. As a criminal or low standing pilot, you chose that life, and there should be consequences, live with it or learn how to fix your standings. This affects all players, PvE, FW, and criminals alike, everyone has bad standing with someone and it doesn't make much sense that those factions don't deny facility services or don't shoot them on site.

Thanks for taking the time to read this, if you are going to start heavily critizing based on the TLDR then take the appropriate time to actually read the rest of the post. I really hate having to copy/paste because people can't/don't read.

*PS: PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF ALL THINGS HOLY STAY ON TOPIC, THIS HAS BEEN DERAILED TO MANY TIMES ALREADY. BAD STANDINGS WITH NPC CORPS/FACTIONS*

CCP has also stated that criminal and negative standings should have consequences, and currently there aren't really any. I did say Eve should be more "real", I just said it should provide legit consequences for player actions and happened to give a couple relating to real life examples for people who have limited imaginations. I gave plenty of in game examples too.

Your response seems to depend on carebears working together and fighting for their protection, that idea is never going to happen and if you or CCP think it will please wake up. As you are just an alt ganking account I can understand your concern for not being able to grief anyone anywhere anytime anymore.

Why does it always come back to the "grief" word?

I didn't realize that your suggestion was actually intended to make highsec safer - if so I would have given a different response.

There are plenty of consequences: -10 players are freely shootable by anyone, and can't do anything other than warp quickly around in highsec. An outlaw is essentially limited to ganking, and only ganking and enjoys zero protection from other players. Adding station lockouts would only be yet another nerf to highsec criminals, and raise the bar of entry to new players looking to get into the profession requiring them to have an Orca alt.

CCP has spent a lot of effort coding in game mechanisms to allow highsec criminals to operate such as security status, CONCORD, Crimewatch. Why would they go to all that trouble only to make it unworkable for highsec criminals to operate in highsec?

Highsec criminals are suppose to exisit in this game by CCPs design. If you don't like them there, you are suppose to stop them yourself, as is intended by CCP.

OP, give it up. Dudes want game to have consequences, meaning they get to be the one pulling the trigger, at no risk to them selves in their cheap destroyer throw away ships but you have to suffer consequences for their actions. Meaning, they get to be the one that doesn't have to deal with consequences, you would think that the grind to get back sec status would take longer or sec status would impose a higher tax or would lock them out....nope, free ride, cheap throw away ship like a wrapper from burger that was just eaten, and you get your face stomped in. Might as well have free respawn....oh wait, CCP went ahead and made that possible a month ago.....pods should of never existed, ship blows up, you go with it, med clone cut scene respawn, lose skill points, and there is the consequences of your actions, even if you where the one in a destroyer or the barge blowing up (think T3 penalty, but applied to EVERYTHING! except newb ships and shuttles). Every time you ship went boom, you lost something that wasn't calculable with the word "isk"

geeze, i thought you werent butthurt...

faction navies do shoot players...add your own dps it helps. but if you think faction navies should be able to do it all by themselves, you are playing the wrong game.

-10 players have to stay on the move. they cant do many of the things other players do like mine or mission. They heavily rely on alts. Those are extraordinary measures to get around restricted gameplay. thats a consequence. you have not provided any reason to prevent them from docking in hi sec besides 'it would be more realistic'.

provide a good gameplay reason and we have a dicussion...what your doing is whining right now.

NPCs in EvE promise things that they can't back up all the time, and this is hardly limited to empire police NPCs. Just ask any mission runner or folks who do combat anoms/sites. They promise to destroy player's ships all the time, yet most of the time they don't.

When players do this, it's called talking smack. Why should NPCs be forbidden to talk smack?

next time you see someone tanking sentry guns in a battleship pull out a tempest and shoot them with a damage type they are not tanking. collect tears.

Being an outlaw and -10, already does have consequences. Just because they are not to your liking, doesn't change that fact.

It's not the system that's broken, it is in fact the mentality of certain players.
News flash. Players gathering together to attempt a task, will out perform those who try things solo in an MMO.

It's not the that crimewatch doesn't work, it's that other players do nothing and the criminals work with the rules. With the rules.

So how about this. Try working with the rules. Try operating with friends. Try using the options available to all. Yes even those of us who are outlaws, do just that.

I have a jump freighter, normal freighter and a full t2 cargo fit BR. All three ships are the first and only ones I've ever bought. Not lost one. Do I have some special power or cheat codes? No. I simply play the game correctly.

This will of course, fall on deaf ears. You don't want to work for your security, you want hand holding. As they say every time in these types of threads.
"Just this one nerf and it will all be balanced."
But you'll never be happy, till ganking is removed. You will claim differently, oh yes you will. But you Sir give the game away, with the use of the term 'Grief'.

So you're telling me you don't know them? Wow, it's worse than I thought.

There is an old saying. "There is more than one way to skin a cat."
You see CCP hand you the tools, you have to find ways to use them.
These also include ways to move things, that mean gankers never even get a chance at you. Not just shooting.

Oh and there are players shooting outlaws and having fun doing it. But sure, you go out there and jam away.

Why would I look you up? I have no interest in what ships you fly or have lost. I look at your request and poor scorn on that. It's not personal, it's about the game and balance.

OK here's the deal. Let's go with standings, but for everyone. While we are at it, let's include this idea, but add to it so that rats also shoot the pods of mission runners.
Then we should look at low sec stations and whether high security players be allowed to dock there.

A complete package sounds just right.

Oh dear, this thread again.
And apparently, now with 200% more wall of text