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Dev Blog - A new look for EVE’s UI – feedback needed!

First post First post First post
Author
Ommat
The Old Comrades Association
A.W.A.C.S and Friends
#701 - 2014-12-19 17:07:23 UTC
Color scheme is not very exciting. I miss the ability to set window outline/menus etc. separately from the window background. For example, I used to have medium grey windows with red borders. It made the windows easier to see and more distinct from the background.

Presently the window background is too dark and it's very very hard to see which window is currently the active window. I'm using Plasma color scheme and the active window is a very dark blue; hard to distinguish from the black inactive windows.

I can appreciate perhaps why the developers did this: to make it simple to switch the scheme to match the active ship. That is kind of wasted feature or at least of minimal value.

I'd like to see an option in the Settings window that allows you to set the window background to a separate color.f Right now, the UI is much worse than it used to be. It may be stylish by some opinions, but it is less functional.
Phice Anxu
Genetix Research Corporation
#702 - 2014-12-20 03:43:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Phice Anxu
CCP Arrow wrote:
Regarding being able to reason or recognize an icon from the beginning. Our primary goal was to make the icons recognizable once you had learned what they represent, it is an impossible task to make abstract icons unique from each other but still perfectly represent what they stand for when you see them for the first time. The most important thing is that it will become easy to memorize after a certain time, but we know it takes time and we understand the frustration of having to do that after having had them unchanged for so long. Our studies show however that those who are coming in as new players are remembering these icons much quicker than before and one of the core reasons for it is because the icons don't use specific colors. Then we don't store information about colors to remember icons but rather focus on their shapes.

We are of course always willing to discuss good arguments for how features and actions can be better represented with abstract icons, but for changes like these it is necessary to collect metrics and data for some time before doing drastic changes.

Thank you for still responding to this thread. I thought that CCP gave up on this.

"Easy to memorize" depends of the icon, as few of them don't really represent his function. Personaly, I still have an hard time to use the market, because automaticaly I "translate" the icon as a stock market function. The market in EvE behave a few like a real stock market, but it is not really one. So each time, I feel natural to click on the industry one that I placed below the market, as industry require minerals to operate... and I mostly buy minerals so... Maybe I will finish to be accustomed of him, but this icon is not good in my opinion. An icon who represent a market stand would be better (after all, there is an icon of a boat to represent a ship =) ).

By the way, I take advantage of your post to ask you what about the color schemes (aka old RGB sliders). After reading the last dev blog about the incoming Proteus patch, it seems that there are nothing about this subject, and I just log into SiSi and see nothing too. As it is not a patch note, I still hope that you will make them back or at least give us some themes with a grey background.

So, can you tell us if there is anything related about this subject in CCP, and if yes, can we have an ETA if it will not be released with Proteus ?
Bluechees 13eefcake
Khights Of Megiddo
#703 - 2014-12-20 04:43:20 UTC
could we have a choice if we want the old ones or new ones I think that all people really want
Alexei Tourani
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#704 - 2014-12-20 11:02:15 UTC
Bluechees 13eefcake wrote:
could we have a choice if we want the old ones or new ones I think that all people really want

This summarizes what I believe most players would be most accepting of, me included.
Verik dra'Har
Belwegian Royal Navy
#705 - 2014-12-21 21:25:52 UTC
Can you make the Isis browser use the same mechanics as the new map? Having it as a background graphic is really inconvenient as I have to mess with my UI layout to view Frigates in particular.
Krystyn
Serenity Rising LLC
#706 - 2014-12-21 23:38:15 UTC
Alexei Tourani wrote:
Bluechees 13eefcake wrote:
could we have a choice if we want the old ones or new ones I think that all people really want

This summarizes what I believe most players would be most accepting of, me included.


Yes, enough of the changes for changes sake. We get near pointless updates of graphics that no one is asking for.
I do admit some of the improved graphics are decent, but I play at the lowest possible setting and the sound off like a lot of the rest of us do to be able to dual box and be on teamspeak.
Mara Kell
Herrscher der Zeit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#707 - 2014-12-23 21:06:02 UTC
Dear CCP devs, i have a simple question, and maybe i can get an answer as a christmas present or so.

Are you planning or intending to make an option to deactivate the highlighting of the active UI window?

I am playing eve for 7 and a half years now, but for 2 weeks now im not really playing Eve anymore because i cant with the current UI. Those two weeks i have been waiting for an announcement, reading every single Dev post, but nothing about this problem at all :(
I will gladly wait a week or two more if you say you intend to introduce a solution. But if you dont, please be honest and say so because then i can stop it right here i do not need to wait any further.

Thanks.
Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
#708 - 2014-12-24 04:03:58 UTC
Mara Kell wrote:
Dear CCP devs, i have a simple question, and maybe i can get an answer as a christmas present or so.

Are you planning or intending to make an option to deactivate the highlighting of the active UI window?

One can only dream…

Two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity. -- Harlan Ellison

Thaloc Venport
Buccaneer Reprocessions
#709 - 2014-12-25 18:26:32 UTC
Now it's been over 10 years since i started playing this game, but the station UI now looks exactly how i remember it did when the game was first designed to work on dial up connection......

Are you running out of ideas and going backwards as no one will remember it?
Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
#710 - 2014-12-27 00:49:18 UTC
Thaloc Venport wrote:
Now it's been over 10 years since i started playing this game, but the station UI now looks exactly how i remember it did when the game was first designed to work on dial up connection......

Are you running out of ideas and going backwards as no one will remember it?

Is it bad? Do you have suggestions for improvement?

Two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity. -- Harlan Ellison

Rain6637
Simulacra and Simulation
Goonswarm Federation
#711 - 2014-12-28 06:12:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
I'm working on an animation of this suggestion.



The market tree needs to be interactable with a modifier key and the scroll wheel. This isolates the item tree and keeps it compressed, saving the viewport while also being more intuitive.

While the market modifier key is pressed, open the market tree at the top level.

With the modifier key still pressed, let the scroll wheel navigate up and down the tree, until the left mouse button is clicked, which opens that tree item. These inputs should "take" no matter where on the screen the cursor was prior to the market modifier key being pressed.

Once an item is selected, expand that tree and collapse the rest of the market items, with nothing below the tree.

At each step, left clicking on the category heading without scrolling navigates up the tree one level. ALT+Left arrow and Backspace (the browser "Back" shortcut can also navigate up the tree one level).

Remove the market tree when the market modifier key is released.

This enables the player to manipulate the market tree without moving their mouse, and return to controlling the cursor in place after releasing the market modifier key. It's time saved, mouse travel reduced, simple.

Holding shift before left clicking could bring up a separate market price window. pressing the market modifier key again should open back to the same place in the tree as the last time. pressing the market modifier key twice in rapid succession could reset the tree to the topmost level.

the price window should remember its position and remain detached from the item tree. the market item tree should also be move-able to wherever the player desires, and remember its position.

I realize not every mouse supports mouse scroll wheel left and right, or mouse scroll wheel press. There would be several options for navigating back: ALT+Left Arrow, Backspace, scroll up and left-click, mouse wheel left, and double tap market modifier key.
Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
#712 - 2014-12-30 14:41:42 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
I realize not every mouse supports mouse scroll wheel left and right

I hate mouses with bobbing wheel.

Two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity. -- Harlan Ellison

Remer Kraft
R Trast
#713 - 2014-12-30 18:33:58 UTC
Mara Kell wrote:
I will gladly wait a week or two more if you say you intend to introduce a solution. But if you dont, please be honest and say so because then i can stop it right here i do not need to wait any further.

I fully agree with you.
CCP indifference to the players causes a reaction of indifference to the game.
Uncertainty kills interest in the game.
If developers honestly say that they are not going to change the interface of the game, I quietly planned to stop playing after the end of the paid period. It is their right, it would be fair, and I would not have claims against them.
But their behavior - it is unfair to the players. Each week silence on the part of the CCP strengthens my conviction to quit this game.
Sim Cognito
Obani Gemini Corporation
#714 - 2014-12-30 18:56:51 UTC
Dieter Rams wrote:
The word performance didn't come up once in the dev blog, sets the tone nicely in typical CCP fashion.

Let me be clear with you, EVE UI performance is poor already to say the least. FPS aside, just try opening a window or changing to a different tab while in mid warp; observe how the game freezes for a split second while the change is taking place. If you have the FPS counter up you can clearly see a dip every time the interface is manipulated, this is really unacceptable in 2014.

It's like the whole deal is single threaded and rendering has to stop every time the UI does something.

If anything, fix that before you start polishing on anything; you can't put lipstick on a pig.


I read the entire thing, pressed cntrl+F on Firefox to search for performance and nothing. Whatever the quoted poster claims, 100% of player in EVE experience daily, multiple times per minute (for traders maybe even per second).

What happened to that CARBON UI backend update CCP did a while ago? "Backend" definitely includes performance, but few improvements have been made. Please look into this as it is an extremely prevalent and major disadvantage of EVE.

I really like your work on the visual aspects as well as functional improvements, and I'm looking forward to seeing more, but on the performance side of things I have only complaints.
Rain6637
Simulacra and Simulation
Goonswarm Federation
#715 - 2014-12-30 23:54:52 UTC
Tonto Auri wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
I realize not every mouse supports mouse scroll wheel left and right

I hate mouses with bobbing wheel.

I am fully supportive of usability that doesn't assume everyone has dumped money into fancy peripherals. However, I think it is assumed that we have.
Nolan Kotulan
Nova Tabula Rasa
#716 - 2015-01-02 03:05:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Nolan Kotulan
Rain6637 wrote:
I'm working on an animation of this suggestion.



The market tree needs to be interactable with a modifier key and the scroll wheel. This isolates the item tree and keeps it compressed, saving the viewport while also being more intuitive.

While the market modifier key is pressed, open the market tree at the top level.

With the modifier key still pressed, let the scroll wheel navigate up and down the tree, until the left mouse button is clicked, which opens that tree item. These inputs should "take" no matter where on the screen the cursor was prior to the market modifier key being pressed.

Once an item is selected, expand that tree and collapse the rest of the market items, with nothing below the tree.

At each step, left clicking on the category heading without scrolling navigates up the tree one level. ALT+Left arrow and Backspace (the browser "Back" shortcut can also navigate up the tree one level).

Remove the market tree when the market modifier key is released.

This enables the player to manipulate the market tree without moving their mouse, and return to controlling the cursor in place after releasing the market modifier key. It's time saved, mouse travel reduced, simple.

Holding shift before left clicking could bring up a separate market price window. pressing the market modifier key again should open back to the same place in the tree as the last time. pressing the market modifier key twice in rapid succession could reset the tree to the topmost level.

the price window should remember its position and remain detached from the item tree. the market item tree should also be move-able to wherever the player desires, and remember its position.

I realize not every mouse supports mouse scroll wheel left and right, or mouse scroll wheel press. There would be several options for navigating back: ALT+Left Arrow, Backspace, scroll up and left-click, mouse wheel left, and double tap market modifier key.


Don't think I have something against you but I have to say it again:
you definitly and really have the most pointless, weird and unusable suggestions I have ever seen about EVE's UI.
You have your very own personal vision about it but objectively there is absolutely not even one good idea to retain in your suggestions. You obviously aren't anything of an User Interface Designer (or it seems you are very bad, sorry to say it) and it seems like you don't have any clue about what ergonomy is.

Saying that because I think you are really wasting your time...

Per aspera ad astra

Rain6637
Simulacra and Simulation
Goonswarm Federation
#717 - 2015-01-02 04:34:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
lol. "personal vision" is a compliment m8. so is most of your post. the rest is typical disagreement, so thanks.

and no, I'm not a UI designer. I'm a player, with up to 10 clients in my face, and I know what would save me a lot of time and be an improvement over right-clicking things, and obscuring my clients with huge clunky tables.

here's the first part of the animation suggestion. It takes a long time to do these, so I may not be able to finish the rest of it.

Basically, part II would show the item price window opening in a separate table, along with the normal shift+click behavior.
Morgan Agrivar
Doomheim
#718 - 2015-01-02 08:25:33 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
lol. "personal vision" is a compliment m8. so is most of your post. the rest is typical disagreement, so thanks.

and no, I'm not a UI designer. I'm a player, with up to 10 clients in my face, and I know what would save me a lot of time and be an improvement over right-clicking things, and obscuring my clients with huge clunky tables.

here's the first part of the animation suggestion. It takes a long time to do these, so I may not be able to finish the rest of it.

Basically, part II would show the item price window opening in a separate table, along with the normal shift+click behavior.


You should see his monitor setup. It is insane.

Hi Rain!
Rain6637
Simulacra and Simulation
Goonswarm Federation
#719 - 2015-01-02 11:28:14 UTC
Morgan Agrivar
Doomheim
#720 - 2015-01-04 07:13:19 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
well there's a name I haven't seen in a while. Hey there.


Hows it going? Havent seen you in a while myself. Hope things are going good for you.