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Update regarding Multiboxing and input automation

First post First post First post
Author
Nolak Ataru
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#3021 - 2015-01-01 23:42:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Nolak Ataru
In no relevant order:
1) Belts have always gotten "sucked up" whether it be a corp or alliance mining op, a botter, an ISBoxed fleet, or anyone who ran 20 accounts BEFORE ISBoxer became a thing. When Hulks first came out, belts were cleared in minutes because everyone and their mother rushed out and mined in the same small areas before they spread out like they are today.
2) If you're using 15 catalysts to gank a single mining boat, even a skiff, you're doing it wrong. I have never seen such a KM, and I would wager that any KM of the sort was either those few idiots with A-type invulns on their skiff, or was practice for the latest wave of CODE gankers.
3) If you have a purple Vindicator, YOU. WILL. GET. GANKED. Stop blaming the relatively few ISBox gankers for it. They can earn far more ISK via VGs than they could ganking because after the second or third gank, fleets will dock up and stand down, depriving the gankers of targets.
4) This game has never been "use multicasting, or you are irrelevant". If you want proof, join a low-sec PVP corp, fit out a Falcon, or a Arazu, or a Curse, and tell me you aren't relevant when you start brawling another gang. Or join a WH corp, and bring out a Bhaalgorn or a neut Legion if you want to feel relevant. Better yet, join a null alliance as a scout / prober, and tell me if you don't feel relevant with a 500+ man Tempest blob waiting for you to scan down the enemy fleet.

Don't lecture me on "irrelevance" in a time of roaming Aeons and Avatars taking gates with impunity. You wanna be relevant? Go out and be relevant. Go out there and make stuff happen. Don't sit in your chair and pout and expect things to happen to you.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#3022 - 2015-01-02 02:22:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
Miomeifeng Alduin wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
Miomeifeng Alduin wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
Nidal Fervor wrote:
As a multiboxer who hates isboxer and all input broadcasting, I'd just like to make one point.

If you see a fleet of characters warping from gate to gate all at the same time, you don't need to cheat to do this. Warp gang to stargate, and then right click stargate and select jump on each character. Simple.

click the gate in overview, press D while in warp. it takes after you land.


I think you mean press D + click the gate. Just D doesn't do anything (just tested it to be sure that nothing changed).

been using it for years. fleet warp, and on each client select the gate in overview, and press d. repeat.

not only that, but if you click the wrong gate and press d, after you land the ship will warp to the wrong gate and jump.

pressing control+space while in warp cancels the command. it's like hot locking, except hot docking/jumping.

as soon as the FC says "gate is green" or "jump on contact" the client gets the d


Strange. Unless its something which only works with fleetwarp. tried multiple times, but i can't get it to work:

-initiate warp.
-while in warp press D.
-hang at 0 at the destination gate because no jump happens.

On my client, i can't use the hotkeys without clicking a target while pressing the hotkey. (been one of my major problems with the system. Is it a setting somewhere which i haven't found yet maybe?

I always wait til i'm in warp. Sometimes there's an issue where initial clicks on a client only register as making it the active client, and you have to click a second time to fully select something.

What you'll see on your client when it's successful is the text "Dock / Jump" in the white message field flash on and off as you press d.
ESN Seeker
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3023 - 2015-01-02 02:23:36 UTC
Miomeifeng Alduin wrote:

Strange. Unless its something which only works with fleetwarp. tried multiple times, but i can't get it to work:

-initiate warp.
-while in warp press D.
-hang at 0 at the destination gate because no jump happens.

On my client, i can't use the hotkeys without clicking a target while pressing the hotkey. (been one of my major problems with the system. Is it a setting somewhere which i haven't found yet maybe?

Try this:

Initiate warp.
While in warp, left-click on destination gate -- this selects it.
Press D.
Miomeifeng Alduin
Lithonauts Inc.
#3024 - 2015-01-02 04:51:30 UTC
ESN Seeker wrote:
Miomeifeng Alduin wrote:

Strange. Unless its something which only works with fleetwarp. tried multiple times, but i can't get it to work:

-initiate warp.
-while in warp press D.
-hang at 0 at the destination gate because no jump happens.

On my client, i can't use the hotkeys without clicking a target while pressing the hotkey. (been one of my major problems with the system. Is it a setting somewhere which i haven't found yet maybe?

Try this:

Initiate warp.
While in warp, left-click on destination gate -- this selects it.
Press D.


With the extra click it actually works. Thanks for that hint (and Rain6637 too). Still find it strange that i have to select the gate a second time while in warp to actually get it to register, but i'll use which works :)
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#3025 - 2015-01-02 05:59:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
inactive clients are like that for everything. most of the time. if you have a target locked, you have to click once to make the client the active one, then click the locked target to select it.

This is without ISBoxer. I don't know how ISBoxer behaves. saving a click is nice, but not worth $50/ year.

hate recurring fees for helper programs.

There's also this
Nolak Ataru
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#3026 - 2015-01-02 06:11:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Nolak Ataru
Rain6637 wrote:
inactive clients are like that for everything. most of the time. if you have a target locked, you have to click once to make the client the active one, then click the locked target to select it.

This is without ISBoxer. I don't know how ISBoxer behaves. saving a click is nice, but not worth $50/ year.

hate recurring fees for helper programs.

There's also this


There are cracks for it, and there are other replicating software that are free.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#3027 - 2015-01-02 06:23:22 UTC
Battle Cube
Cube Collective
#3028 - 2015-01-02 07:52:18 UTC
i think i have a few weeks left on my subscriptions, so i mean, maybe i'll log in and manually multibox incursions for a bit just to harvest rage from people thinking im using isboxer.

Random note about isboxer - a few days after i resubbed i saw this post and asked for a refund from isboxer - knowing i probably wouldnt get it. But they did refund me, which was cool.

Then i used that money to resub to wow XD XD (though to be fair, not going to sub beyond one month since i dont feel like buying the expansion)
Nidal Fervor
Doomheim
#3029 - 2015-01-02 09:36:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Nidal Fervor
Battle Cube wrote:
i think i have a few weeks left on my subscriptions, so i mean, maybe i'll log in and manually multibox incursions for a bit just to harvest rage from people thinking im using isboxer.

Random note about isboxer - a few days after i resubbed i saw this post and asked for a refund from isboxer - knowing i probably wouldnt get it. But they did refund me, which was cool.

Then i used that money to resub to wow XD XD (though to be fair, not going to sub beyond one month since i dont feel like buying the expansion)


Battle Cube, Isn't this the locus fleet who mines with over 50 skiffs at once?
Nolak Ataru
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#3030 - 2015-01-02 09:42:18 UTC
Nidal Fervor wrote:
Battle Cube, Isn't this the locus fleet who mines with over 50 skiffs at once?


He's a multiboxer for incursions. You're thinking of TheWiz or one of the Borg variants.
Battle Cube
Cube Collective
#3031 - 2015-01-02 09:52:38 UTC
Nidal Fervor wrote:
Battle Cube wrote:
i think i have a few weeks left on my subscriptions, so i mean, maybe i'll log in and manually multibox incursions for a bit just to harvest rage from people thinking im using isboxer.

Random note about isboxer - a few days after i resubbed i saw this post and asked for a refund from isboxer - knowing i probably wouldnt get it. But they did refund me, which was cool.

Then i used that money to resub to wow XD XD (though to be fair, not going to sub beyond one month since i dont feel like buying the expansion)


Battle Cube, Isn't this the locus fleet who mines with over 50 skiffs at once?


as nolak said, im an incursion runner. I used to run 10 vindicators in HQs (usually 1 paid, 9 unpaid support dps) for incursion communities.
Atuesuel
Kenshin.
Fraternity.
#3032 - 2015-01-02 09:58:58 UTC
CCP Falcon wrote:
Playing with multiple accounts at the same time has a long history within EVE Online, and has always been permitted. There are various ways to do it, and since there’s been a lot of discussion surrounding what is and isn’t allowed, we’d like to clarify a few terms and exactly how the EULA and our Policies must be interpreted and how some things are shifting.


[/i]


I've been waiting for this to happen, i have three accounts and 3 installs and 3 screens and have all ways input all there commands manually. ive all ways said isboxer is an unfair thing and if people want to only do one set of instructions they should make friends.
Bridie McBride
4S Corporation
The Initiative.
#3033 - 2015-01-02 13:21:54 UTC
Battle Cube wrote:
i think i have a few weeks left on my subscriptions, so i mean, maybe i'll log in and manually multibox incursions for a bit just to harvest rage from people thinking im using isboxer.

Random note about isboxer - a few days after i resubbed i saw this post and asked for a refund from isboxer - knowing i probably wouldnt get it. But they did refund me, which was cool.

Then i used that money to resub to wow XD XD (though to be fair, not going to sub beyond one month since i dont feel like buying the expansion)




Thank you very much for the heads up. I'm pleasantly surprised they are refunding, I am asking for the same thing, for teh same reasons. I paid for a product and it is no longer usable the way it was sold, so want refund, unfortunately.

07
Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#3034 - 2015-01-02 16:55:37 UTC
Alana Packham wrote:
1 post by CCP

over 3000 posts by people who probably don't even play the game.

PVP'ers are upset because they are being killed. Don't quite get that, no matter how drunk I get.

No new EULA, no update to the EULA, not even a mention on the login screen.

Is the OP still even working for CCP?

If this is an actual serious post..

I'm a multi-box miner who only came to this game to be able to use multiple accounts, I use multi-box software for fleet set-ups and moving the fleet, plus all the irritating things like opening 16 cargo bays, getting most of them to show the ore hold, launching drones and all the other pain in the arse things (like clicking on 16 'the server will be shutting down' 3 times in an hour). Selecting roids, moving ships around inside belts and mining I do individually.

For me that was the main point of this game.

Now unfortunately because people who play the PVP side of the game are getting shot (thought that was a part of PVP (and don't say there are more of them then us, try being ganked by 15 cats every hour of the day)) the miners are yet again to suffer.

What was an interesting mining setup is to be turned into a series of pointless endless mouse clicks.

Ice mining, Ore mining, surviving gankers (and pointing out they are useless wankers), hauling ore, refining, shipping mats, maybe some indy, bit of PVE missioning. All of that is gone as by the time I get my fleets to where I want them and start mining I am so bored I play something else.

And I can't figure out why the EULA change. The game became what it is by allowing things to happen. Cutting massive aspects out of the game (this change is a massive aspect to me if not to you) can only limit it even further, the term sandbox died a long, long time ago.

But I'm gonna stay until I get suspended, the way this is going it will be probably for 2 accounts being logged in within a 500 mile radius of each other but I'll be here until then.

Then after my suspension I'm gonna jettison my huge collection of PLEX into space 1 at a time and shoot them, then buy up all the spare PLEX in the game and shoot them, that'll probably be the most satisfaction this game will have to offer by that time.

I suppose the other option would be to join a PVP guild, spend all day every day camped on a gate with 40 other people just in case someone comes through, but no one will, as all that will be left by then are gate campers, gankers and bots.

So I think not, if I want PVP I'll play a PVP game, not an alleged sandbox that offers a mix of PVP and PVE where you can do whatever you want, unless it's anything you want.

apologies for the rambling, truncated post as I'm trying to write it while drunk and remembering how much fun WOT can be if you have no worries about 'friendly fire'.

btw can we please have a new promotional video entitled 'I was there the day EVE died'?



Thanks for proving a point I made god knows how many pages back..

The one where I pointed out that these stupid sized fleets wouldn't exist if it wasn't for these programmes.

You just admitted that you can't control all those accounts manually so the only reason you have them is thanks to ISBoxer.

Good riddance.

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.

Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#3035 - 2015-01-02 16:59:56 UTC
Kinda agree. Multiboxing filled a need for stimulation and brain CPU load, and ISBoxer would have negated that.
Nolak Ataru
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#3036 - 2015-01-02 19:49:23 UTC
Drago Shouna wrote:
Thanks for proving a point I made god knows how many pages back..
The one where I pointed out that these stupid sized fleets wouldn't exist if it wasn't for these programmes.
You just admitted that you can't control all those accounts manually so the only reason you have them is thanks to ISBoxer.
Good riddance.


You really can't speak. A 2012 toon and you don't know about the old mining fleets pre-input broadcasting. I'm a 2012 toon as well and I've seen the pictures of the massive mining fleets before ISBoxer became a thing. Just because one player doesn't want to put up with the bullshit anymore does not magically do-away with all the other fleets that were around.

Rain6637 wrote:
Kinda agree. Multiboxing filled a need for stimulation and brain CPU load, and ISBoxer would have negated that.

Spoken like someone who hasn't read any of the other posts in the thread, and who hasn't tried it themselves. As an incursion ISBoxer I had to keep track of 8 clients in HQs. That means keeping track of their locked targets, their location, speed, cap, ammo, shield, aggro, scripted modules, drones, wave number, ships on field, and probably more.
Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#3037 - 2015-01-02 20:06:40 UTC
Nolak Ataru wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:
Thanks for proving a point I made god knows how many pages back..
The one where I pointed out that these stupid sized fleets wouldn't exist if it wasn't for these programmes.
You just admitted that you can't control all those accounts manually so the only reason you have them is thanks to ISBoxer.
Good riddance.


You really can't speak. A 2012 toon and you don't know about the old mining fleets pre-input broadcasting. I'm a 2012 toon as well and I've seen the pictures of the massive mining fleets before ISBoxer became a thing. Just because one player doesn't want to put up with the bullshit anymore does not magically do-away with all the other fleets that were around.

Rain6637 wrote:
Kinda agree. Multiboxing filled a need for stimulation and brain CPU load, and ISBoxer would have negated that.

Spoken like someone who hasn't read any of the other posts in the thread, and who hasn't tried it themselves. As an incursion ISBoxer I had to keep track of 8 clients in HQs. That means keeping track of their locked targets, their location, speed, cap, ammo, shield, aggro, scripted modules, drones, wave number, ships on field, and probably more.


As a 2012 toon, it does beg the question..

What exactly were they using?

Macros, bots, some other programme? I dunno.

Ok I have no idea how long ISBoxer has been around as I don't go to play a game and instantly look for a cheat (programme to do the work for me ).

Oh..before anyone mentions it again..I don't care how much your programmes cost. Or how long they took/take to set up either.

But in late 2012 I was at a meet where this very situation was mentioned and discussed with CCP reps and it was on their minds then.

It really is a pity that it took so long for them to act...but then again there have been a few staff changes and upheavals.

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.

James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#3038 - 2015-01-02 20:20:12 UTC  |  Edited by: James Baboli
Drago Shouna wrote:

What exactly were they using?

Macros, bots, some other programme? I dunno.


It is easily possible to manage 20 or more clients manually if all you are doing is mining. It is possible to run Vanguards with 10-12 manually if you pick the right setup and tank like TDF. It is just barely possible to make a semi-decent bomb run manually, though you end up with an added second or so of stagger time.

It is much easier to do all of these things with broadcasting, but well within the realm of the possible to do manually. Now, solo HQS and assaults? not so much. Solo 154 toon mining fleet (which is the largest single boxer I have heard of, 3 maxed wings of miners with a siege booster and a mining booster in each wing, but usually spreads across 3 systems and leaves the siege booster offline) Not so much. Run a gank? sure, if you like turning EVE into a twitch game called "how fast can I mash the fire button"

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp

Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#3039 - 2015-01-02 20:41:16 UTC
James Baboli wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:

What exactly were they using?

Macros, bots, some other programme? I dunno.


It is easily possible to manage 20 or more clients manually if all you are doing is mining. It is possible to run Vanguards with 10-12 manually if you pick the right setup and tank like TDF. It is just barely possible to make a semi-decent bomb run manually, though you end up with an added second or so of stagger time.

It is much easier to do all of these things with broadcasting, but well within the realm of the possible to do manually. Now, solo HQS and assaults? not so much. Solo 154 toon mining fleet (which is the largest single boxer I have heard of, 3 maxed wings of miners with a siege booster and a mining booster in each wing, but usually spreads across 3 systems and leaves the siege booster offline) Not so much. Run a gank? sure, if you like turning EVE into a twitch game called "how fast can I mash the fire button"



I think you hit the nail on the head.."It is much easier to do all of these things with broadcasting"

Players don't want to work that hard to do it manually, they want an easy life..just as irl.

So now it's much less intrusive on their phone time if they get something to do it for them.

There was a guy whining about this a few pages back because he was going to get ISBoxer to help with his second account..TWO accounts and players can't be arsed to alt/tab or, like me click on the other window to switch to it, and god forbid they have to actually then click within the second or even third window.

It's easy mode for bone idle players, thats all.

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.

James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#3040 - 2015-01-02 20:46:35 UTC
Drago Shouna wrote:
James Baboli wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:

What exactly were they using?

Macros, bots, some other programme? I dunno.


It is easily possible to manage 20 or more clients manually if all you are doing is mining. It is possible to run Vanguards with 10-12 manually if you pick the right setup and tank like TDF. It is just barely possible to make a semi-decent bomb run manually, though you end up with an added second or so of stagger time.

It is much easier to do all of these things with broadcasting, but well within the realm of the possible to do manually. Now, solo HQS and assaults? not so much. Solo 154 toon mining fleet (which is the largest single boxer I have heard of, 3 maxed wings of miners with a siege booster and a mining booster in each wing, but usually spreads across 3 systems and leaves the siege booster offline) Not so much. Run a gank? sure, if you like turning EVE into a twitch game called "how fast can I mash the fire button"



I think you hit the nail on the head.."It is much easier to do all of these things with broadcasting"

Players don't want to work that hard to do it manually, they want an easy life..just as irl.

So now it's much less intrusive on their phone time if they get something to do it for them.

There was a guy whining about this a few pages back because he was going to get ISBoxer to help with his second account..TWO accounts and players can't be arsed to alt/tab or, like me click on the other window to switch to it, and god forbid they have to actually then click within the second or even third window.

It's easy mode for bone idle players, thats all.


It was actually fairly essential to my prefered form of making isk. I ran 70 clients in 2 seperate incursion HQ fleets. It goes from being "tough, but doable" to flatly impossible with this change. Rather than seeing any sort of fix to the underlying reasons I wanted to do this thing, they simply pulled the software support that let me do this with only the risks inherent in the content, not a high level of risk from UI overload and C3 issues.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp