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[SOLVED] Shield disruptor
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Xerces Ynx
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2011-12-18 01:59:22 UTC
Hi all

I think it will be a stupid question.
I decided to help one guy, who was attacked by another, without a reason. We both were flying Catalysts, the attacker was using a frigate. In a fraction of a second after I fired-up upon him, my shield gone down to 0% and in less than 2 seconds our destroyers were gone also.
My question is: what was the attacker using, that distrupted my shield completely? How to defend against that? Armor tanking won't help, as it takes time to charge, longer than a fraction of a second and when my shield goes away, I'm pretty much dead at that point (as example above shows).

Thank you for your help.

Error reading signature file: /home/xerces/.signature: No such file or directory
Luba Cibre
Global Song Setup
#2 - 2011-12-18 02:36:51 UTC
Xerces Ynx wrote:
My question is: what was the attacker using, that distrupted my shield completely?

It's called damage.

"Nothing essential happens in the absence of noise." 
Xerces Ynx
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2011-12-18 02:40:20 UTC
Yes, I'm aware of that. But nothing was hitting me. He fired after my shield gone down. Or maybe he fired, but my client did not show it (lag?).

Error reading signature file: /home/xerces/.signature: No such file or directory
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
#4 - 2011-12-18 05:46:23 UTC
What ship was he flying?

It's entirely possible, especially if your ship was untanked, that he just stripped your shields in one shot. There is no module that drains shield without doing actual damage.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#5 - 2011-12-18 05:52:19 UTC
Sounds to me like you met CONCORD.
Zanzbar
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2011-12-18 06:35:02 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Sounds to me like you met CONCORD.



yep if you attack someone without having aggression rights on them then concord comes and kills you in 1 or 2 volleys. if you were in a destroyer chances are your EHP was low enough where you would have blown up before even noticing that concord had entered the fight.
Vachir Khan
Rugged Ruff and Ready
#7 - 2011-12-18 11:37:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Vachir Khan
Xerces Ynx wrote:
Hi all

I think it will be a stupid question.
I decided to help one guy, who was attacked by another, without a reason. We both were flying Catalysts, the attacker was using a frigate. In a fraction of a second after I fired-up upon him, my shield gone down to 0% and in less than 2 seconds our destroyers were gone also.
My question is: what was the attacker using, that distrupted my shield completely? How to defend against that? Armor tanking won't help, as it takes time to charge, longer than a fraction of a second and when my shield goes away, I'm pretty much dead at that point (as example above shows).

Thank you for your help.


What you probably ran into is someone with decent skills, a good ship with a decent pvp focussed fit. As you're new your fit will probably be balls (not trying to berate you, any new player has hilarious fits, we all started like that :P). Do not think that just because you flew a bigger ship you would automatically win, EVE is a game where bigger isn't necessarily better. or where simple things like character age, SP amount or shipcost decide the outcome.

Apart from that, a catalyst wouldn't be shield tanked anyway so for most Gallente ships/fits you really don't care much about your shield other than it being a nice small buffer. What you witnessed is also the reason why most PVP ships don't use active tanking; it simply won't hold up to incoming damage in most scenarios. Instead people fit plates adding more hitpoints.

Destroyers still are a bit iffy in PVP but would a frigate run into you while flying something like the fit below (possibly translated to T1/named) and you'd fire on him he'd probably melt pretty quickly. As you can see lots of guns, a DC, plate and mag stab. I'm not assuming you'll be flying this but just posted it to give you an idea on how PVP focussed fits tend to look.

[Catalyst, PVP]
Damage Control II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
200mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I

1MN Afterburner II
J5b Phased Prototype Warp Scrambler I

Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S
Light Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge S

Small Trimark Armor Pump I
Small Trimark Armor Pump I
Small Trimark Armor Pump I


Hobgoblin II x1
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#8 - 2011-12-18 12:55:32 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Sounds to me like you met CONCORD.


Agreed, instant shield loss usually is a sign you are about to get CONCORDOKKEND.

You CAN'T help anyone in highsec if you don't have legit kill rights on the other party, if you do engage, you will be flagged as a criminal and CONCORD will jump in and you will see a huge explosion on the spot where your ship used to be.

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Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

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Velicitia
XS Tech
#9 - 2011-12-18 13:09:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Velicitia
Zanzbar wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Sounds to me like you met CONCORD.



yep if you attack someone without having aggression rights on them then concord comes and kills you in 1 or 2 volleys. if you were in a destroyer chances are your EHP was low enough where you would have blown up before even noticing that concord had entered the fight.



this. Just because someone is "your mate" doesn't mean that you can fire on an attacker of his indiscriminately.
You *should* have gotten a "hey guy, this is hisec, you really sure you want to do that" message before being allowed to fire.

IIRC hisec aggression mechanics properly, if you two were in a fleet, and he fired on your mate, you would have seen him go flashy red. At that point, you could have opened fire on him. You probably still would have DIAF though, since the frigate was likely T2.

edit -- I don't see anything about you on Google (sans this post), Battleclinic, or Eve-Kill; so it's probably you met CONCORD

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Xerces Ynx
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2011-12-18 19:18:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Xerces Ynx
Kahega Amielden wrote:
What ship was he flying?
It's entirely possible, especially if your ship was untanked, that he just stripped your shields in one shot. There is no module that drains shield without doing actual damage.

It was Incursus if I recall correctly.
I wasn't tanking. I'm too low on skills for that.

Tau Cabalander wrote:
Sounds to me like you met CONCORD.

I've never seen a CONCORD ship, but I'm preety sure it's not that. He was just a griefer, who wanted to blow up some rookie ships. First, he attecked a guy who was not agressed. Second, he targeted me as soon as I entered his range, so he clearly was lurking at the chat and he knew I'm going to help the attacked guy.

Vachir Khan wrote:
What you probably ran into is someone with decent skills, a good ship with a decent pvp focussed fit. As you're new your fit will probably be balls (not trying to berate you, any new player has hilarious fits, we all started like that :P).

Do not think that just because you flew a bigger ship you would automatically win, EVE is a game where bigger isn't necessarily better. or where simple things like character age, SP amount or shipcost decide the outcome.

I'm not questioning his skills. He was much more expierienced than we were. I'm asking here because it was strange for me, that my shield gone down "from nothing" (he wasn't firing at me) and that it happened almost at the same time I clicked OK on a window stating that this attack will lower my standings and force CONCORD pilots to put away their donuts. This message could also mean "Clicking OK will cause your shield to disappear. Are sure you want to continue?".
Because I could not find any "shield disruptor" device, I asked here what it could be and how to defend against that. If you're saying that there is no such module, it means he was firing, but my client did not show that. I had some rubberbanding that day, so maybe it was a lag.

I'm far from thinking that ship size determines battle result. I chose Catalyst because it was the only ship already fitted with offensive devices and refitting takes time. Also, the guy I was helping said he was attacked by pirates, so I assumed he mean NPCs. In 0.8 system Catalyst and rookie skills are usually enough for this kind of opponent.

Vachir Khan wrote:
Destroyers still are a bit iffy in PVP but would a frigate run into you while flying something like the fit below (possibly translated to T1/named) and you'd fire on him he'd probably melt pretty quickly. As you can see lots of guns, a DC, plate and mag stab. I'm not assuming you'll be flying this but just posted it to give you an idea on how PVP focussed fits tend to look.


Fitting cut for clarity
Thank you. I'll remember that. For now, most of those things are beyond my reach :)

Velicitia wrote:
Just because someone is "your mate" doesn't mean that you can fire on an attacker of his indiscriminately. You *should* have gotten a "hey guy, this is hisec, you really sure you want to do that" message before being allowed to fire.

IIRC hisec aggression mechanics properly, if you two were in a fleet, and he fired on your mate, you would have seen him go flashy red. At that point, you could have opened fire on him. You probably still would have DIAF though, since the frigate was likely T2.

edit -- I don't see anything about you on Google (sans this post), Battleclinic, or Eve-Kill; so it's probably you met CONCORD

All right, but how can I help then? Someone is tackling my friend. What can I do besides attacking him? Sending messages has zero effect on griefers.

We were not in a fleet. My friend called for help via local chat. He could not warp because of tackling and the attacker was sitting outside the station all the time. When I undocked, the attacker targeted me and I opened fire as soon as my mate started shooting (a minute or so later). Attacker wasn't red.

I'm pretty sure he wasn't CONCORD. Never heard of police starting a brawl with unexpierienced rookies without a reason.



EDIT: All right. I had a little chat with this lad today. It wasn't him. Station sentry gun took me out. That's why I didn't see him firing at me when my shield gone down. So now I know that stations can blow me up if I'm attacking somebody near them. Mystery solved.

Error reading signature file: /home/xerces/.signature: No such file or directory
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#11 - 2011-12-18 22:34:51 UTC
Xerces Ynx wrote:

EDIT: All right. I had a little chat with this lad today. It wasn't him. Station sentry gun took me out. That's why I didn't see him firing at me when my shield gone down. So now I know that stations can blow me up if I'm attacking somebody near them. Mystery solved.


Ergo, you got CONCORDOKKEND by the station guns like so many people here already said as you agressed someone in high-sec without legit kill-rights.

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Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

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Xerces Ynx
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2011-12-19 00:04:57 UTC
Yes, I know that now. My first loss to CONCORD. I wonder if it's the last ;)
Thank you for help. Fly safe.

Error reading signature file: /home/xerces/.signature: No such file or directory
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#13 - 2011-12-19 10:13:52 UTC
Xerces Ynx wrote:
Yes, I know that now. My first loss to CONCORD. I wonder if it's the last ;)
Thank you for help. Fly safe.


Your not the only one who had this problem btw. Even I have the same stuff lately, forgot you can't web a non-corp member in high-sec without the act of aggression. I was ignorant and continued anyway so next thing I knew I was in my pod.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club
Velicitia
XS Tech
#14 - 2011-12-19 11:59:34 UTC
Xerces Ynx wrote:
Yes, I know that now. My first loss to CONCORD. I wonder if it's the last ;)
Thank you for help. Fly safe.



nope, you'll soon learn about the ******* bots that plague the 1.0 ond 0.9 belts ... and feel that "Report Bot" isn't good enough Twisted

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia