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Crime & Punishment

 
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Announcement From Gorila

First post First post
Author
Jurico Elemenohpe
Flipsid3 Tactics
#201 - 2014-12-29 03:25:27 UTC
ggodhsup wrote:
couldnt be bothered to read 3 pages of posts. but joining code shouldnt be this dramatic.

3 pages? im tired of this post being at the top of C&P.

can we talk more about crime. and crime. and dammit more crime.

good job, switching to code and all, i love them too.

but this is absurd, 3 pages?!
3?? It's 10p now.
11* as of this post
Steppa Musana
Doomheim
#202 - 2014-12-29 03:44:20 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD BH Supogo
If you want to know why there is so much hate towards the ganking community, it's because you fly with people like this:


*snip* - Please do not post in-game chatlogs in this thread. -- ISD Supogo

Quote:
Chatlogs and "fanmail"

The posting of chatlogs and EVEmails is not permitted, as past experience has shown us that these have a tendency to incite flames and trolling.

An exception to this is the Pirate Stories Thread, where players can post chatlogs (with the names of victims/counterparts blanked out) as part of a pirate story or experience. -- ISD Supogo



And this is who you allow to be your leader. A manchild with serious personality issues. Then you wonder why miners think so poorly of your community.

Here's a suggestion... stop associating with filth if you don't want to be judged as filth.
ggodhsup
relocation LLC.
#203 - 2014-12-29 03:55:08 UTC
Jurico Elemenohpe wrote:
ggodhsup wrote:
couldnt be bothered to read 3 pages of posts. but joining code shouldnt be this dramatic.

3 pages? im tired of this post being at the top of C&P.

can we talk more about crime. and crime. and dammit more crime.

good job, switching to code and all, i love them too.

but this is absurd, 3 pages?!
3?? It's 10p now.
11* as of this post



i hate myself', dammit this is just insane.

no one cares. just do something for us. kill without bias.

and stop this madness, C&P needs something with moar content.
Veers Belvar
Swordmasters of New Eden
#204 - 2014-12-29 04:17:02 UTC
ggodhsup wrote:
Jurico Elemenohpe wrote:
ggodhsup wrote:
couldnt be bothered to read 3 pages of posts. but joining code shouldnt be this dramatic.

3 pages? im tired of this post being at the top of C&P.

can we talk more about crime. and crime. and dammit more crime.

good job, switching to code and all, i love them too.

but this is absurd, 3 pages?!
3?? It's 10p now.
11* as of this post



i hate myself', dammit this is just insane.

no one cares. just do something for us. kill without bias.

and stop this madness, C&P needs something with moar content.


Some of us think that one of the main AG mods and FCs defecting to CODE and backstabbing his erstwhile friends is actually the kind of content that should be featured in C&P.
ggodhsup
relocation LLC.
#205 - 2014-12-29 04:48:04 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:
ggodhsup wrote:
Jurico Elemenohpe wrote:
ggodhsup wrote:
couldnt be bothered to read 3 pages of posts. but joining code shouldnt be this dramatic.

3 pages? im tired of this post being at the top of C&P.

can we talk more about crime. and crime. and dammit more crime.

good job, switching to code and all, i love them too.

but this is absurd, 3 pages?!
3?? It's 10p now.
11* as of this post



i hate myself', dammit this is just insane.

no one cares. just do something for us. kill without bias.

and stop this madness, C&P needs something with moar content.


Some of us think that one of the main AG mods and FCs defecting to CODE and backstabbing his erstwhile friends is actually the kind of content that should be featured in C&P.


i mean really veers. you have no content contributions beyond that terrible post before. enjoy. we all hate you.....like highschool.
Astecus
Astral Providence
Astral Battles
#206 - 2014-12-29 07:55:11 UTC
Gorila Vengaza wrote:
As for Ast’s accusations at me, I’ll say this for the record. I respect Ast for creating Anti-Ganking and creating his site offering ECM fits etc. I wish he did a bit more in game by taking a stance but in the end it’s his choice how he plays. There was frustration on my end with him as I was out hunting and trying to do something about CODE day in and day out and what I saw him doing was working on getting the AG Channel put on Eve Live and testing how many Mining Barges he could run with ISOBOXER.

Anyone checking my killboards should see a crystalclear picture of what kind of stance I have been taking in game. I have engaged over 300 destroyers using 3 different characters. But yes, the last one was back in May, so I assume you are refering to me not continuing this day in and day out. But frankly, if you were frustrated by CODE, it is not my job to fix this for you. I don't have to come up with reasons or excuses for not doing more than I have done. If this makes you frustrated by me, then that's your issue.

I never 'worked' to get AG put on evelocal.com, I just decided one day that I would send Chribba a short mail asking politely. Then I forwarded his reply to some fellow anti-gankers. Why you choose to reference this is beyond me...

Regarding ISBoxer, I'm wondering if you are trying to spread lies about me. I might not even have undocked a barge the last year, especially not 2-3 months ago when I played around with ISBoxer for maybe a month total. And I certainly didn't need ISBoxer to know that I could easily run 14 clients sustaining the 23/7 open mining fleet I ran for a year. What I did use ISBoxer for, was try to see how quickly I could do missions to farm standings to improve my free refining service. I did mostly lvl 4 combat missions flying 12 caracals 1 noctis 1 vulture, some burner missions flying various frigates, as well as some lvl 4 mining missions flying ventures. It was fun for a bit, mostly because it was horribly overpowered, but I had already stopped doing it for quite a while when the news broke about input broadcasting. And I love CCP's new stance, it's one of the bravest decisions they have made.

Gorila Vengaza wrote:
As for that person Ast mentioned in his post above that has been sending mails? I know who he means. Industrial Mining is a longtime friend of mine and no I don’t agree with what Indy has been doing by sending mails to Ast. But I still stand by Indy’s side for the ORIGINAL incident which angered Indy. That entire mess started because Indy was simply trying to teach and instruct people in AG and he was attacked and kicked for it. I wish I had been able to get involved before Indy fired off his mails as it would have saved everyone a lot of headaches.

Out of respect, I chose to withhold his name. As you were a mod at the time, you had the power to look into how he was attacked and take measures. If I recall correctly, I tried looking into it, but got distracted by numerous abusive mails, alts disrupting AG, and eventually 29 wardecs.

To make it perfectly clear, I would much rather have a channel full of respectful and clueless newbros than a channel full of disrespectful experts. A respectful atmosphere is crucial for people to want to ask all kinds of questions and be able to traverse that learning curve quickly. Also, it is entirely possible to be both respectful and knowledgeable at the same time. Frankly, being respectful is quite easy, even doing nothing at all is enough in this case. And if you have things to say, just skip the namecalling and you are halfway there already.

Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
I don't mind having stupid and willfully ignorant people playing Eve. I love them! They're the easiest ones, overall, to blow up. They're the type who thinks hisec is safe, no need to tank, etcetc.

In short, the willfully ignorant are fodder for my playstyle.

Thank you for your honesty, many could learn from it.

Reloaded Main: Astevon | Creator of the Anti-ganking channel, Anti-ganking.net and AstralServices.net

Black Pedro
Mine.
#207 - 2014-12-29 08:37:53 UTC
Veers Belvar wrote:

Some of us think that one of the main AG mods and FCs defecting to CODE and backstabbing his erstwhile friends is actually the kind of content that should be featured in C&P.

Indeed it is. Too bad much of this thread has been taken over by the "ganking is bullying" crowd trying to justify bad behaviour on the part of some gank victims towards other players in the AG channel and elsewhere. Gorilia did say that was part of the reason he left, but really this is not the main point of this thread.

Look, if you don't like CODE. or minerbumping you don't have too. You can fight them in-game and embrace the content generated by them like AG purportedly does, or use the block function in-game and on the forums (and not go to minerbumping) and they no longer exist (although you still have to watch for "generic gankers" now - you can't isolate yourself from actual gameplay even if flying a Skiff comes pretty close these days). If you think CODE., minerbumping.com or anyone else for that matter has crossed the line into real-life harassment, then file a petition - CCP has demonstrated that they will do something when they deem behaviour harassment even if it takes place outside the Eve client. But don't try to use your dislike of other players or groups of players as an excuse for EULA-breaking insults and threats against other players just playing the game within the rules, even if you don't like the way that they do it. If you just want to vent how you dislike Code or discuss why you think they are mean, then I suggest you start a new thread for that.

Gorila said that people who take the in-game conflict too far into the real world was only one factor in him crossing the floor. He said there were other problems like his conflict with the culture of entitlement common among AFK miners, and disagreements over the general strategic approach of how best to fight Code with the other members. Seems like just a standard case of a player's goals and ideas of fun not fully meshing with his current organization.

Mag's
Azn Empire
#208 - 2014-12-29 09:38:51 UTC
Steppa Musana wrote:
If you want to know why there is so much hate towards the ganking community, it's because you fly with people like this:

*chat logs*

And this is who you allow to be your leader. A manchild with serious personality issues. Then you wonder why miners think so poorly of your community.

Here's a suggestion... stop associating with filth if you don't want to be judged as filth.
It's local spam and not even interesting spam at that. Just rather repetitive.
I agree local spam can be annoying, but I'm not sure I'd go as far as calling those doing it a manchild, filth, or even suggest he has personality issues.

I do wonder about you though, coming to such a judgement over it.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.

Piz Caldera
The Conference Elite
CODE.
#209 - 2014-12-29 09:57:49 UTC
Veers

destroyed sandcastles:

if you build a sandcastle you ll have to know before:
- you will stay just few hours at beach
- sea will take sandcastle away
- maybe dog make kaka in castle
- maybe drunken boys destroy it
- maybe loving couple wil f... on it
= you know BEFORE, that you will loose your sandcastle, in any way.
If you dont know, you will find out!
if your clever, you will learn for next time.
If your not clever, you will cry again!

If you play Eve you SHOULD know:
- its a video game
- its a massive multiplayer game, not a solo / offline game
- its for adults
- once you will stop playing it, or it will be once terminatet for any reason, all you made there, get lost
- "working for months, destroyed in seconds". Why you work in Videogame? better just work in RL and PLAY the videogame.
If you work - or play, Sim City for months but you forgot to switch off the natural disasters you could get also some butthurt.

Eve is not a game for everybody, it should not be played by too soft characters.
All other verbal or moral violations CCP check and judge - and they judged strong.

Christo Severasse
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
#210 - 2014-12-29 10:31:29 UTC
I suck at PvP, I tend towards exploration and industry. However, I think CODE. and any other ganker types make the game more fun.

I consider it a major win for me if I jump through a gate into a bubble camp and escape with my Astero in one piece. Then I might indulge in a spot of trash talking in local, whilst safely cloaked of course.

Do i get annoyed when i get podded and see 300 mill isk in cargo lost, along with an 80 mill isk ship? Of course i do.... For about 30 seconds. Then i remember something important. It is only pixels. Sure, I invested time and effort to acquire those pixels but I had some fun doing it, and I had some fun losing it too and that, surely, is the point in playing the game?

Also, if you just stick your head in the sand and refuse to adapt and evolve your game play to take into account the actions of other groups in game you deserve anything that befalls you.

Embrace the chaos. It's the Wild West in spaceships!
La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#211 - 2014-12-29 12:54:34 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD LackOfFaith
Black Pedro wrote:

Too bad much of this thread has been taken over by the "ganking is bullying" crowd trying to justify bad behaviour on the part of some gank victims towards other players in the AG channel and elsewhere. Gorilia did say that was part of the reason he left, but really this is not the main point of this thread.


Still all the same.
The poor innocent codies get threats all the time.
That they are causing the threats is ignored or denied.
But how serious are those threats?
Remembering Remiel, CCP did not act on accusations.
One might assume, that CCP too nows whats going on.
That most of those "baaaaaad baaaaad" threats are emotional outburst and not meant seriously.
Even Gorila took the apology from loyalanon, after loyalanon was {Bleep. Avoiding the profanity filter is not allowed. -- ISD LackOfFaith} on gorila hard.
No: -> RL threats are bad, no excuse.
They just have to be RL threats and not just some emotional outburst, which happen a lot of time when you lose a ship.

To speak it out clearly:
code uses those RL threats as tactical argument, less than fear of RL dangers

Why did Gorila change sides?
He did get threats as antiganker from other antigankers?
He shouldn't get rl-threats from ag when he was ag himself.
This is what you are saying.
How compassionate from him.
Just dosn't sound very logical.

Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."

La Rynx
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#212 - 2014-12-29 13:03:18 UTC
Christo Severasse wrote:
I suck at PvP, I tend towards exploration and industry.

Me 2, but i am training.

Christo Severasse wrote:

However, I think CODE.

NO!

Christo Severasse wrote:

and any other ganker types make the game more fun.

YES!

Code has a history and the bad habit to reach to the players in front of the monitor. They still embrace the acts of erotica1, who was banned by the outrage by lots of players who usually don't post in the forums. The guy and his friends making fun of a speechimpeeded man for hours. This ban made this guy a "martyr" for the code. Those guys wanna accuse others of bad behavior when they get RL threats, when they self embrace the idea of having fun with handicapped people over their handicaps on teamspeak.

Disgusting hipocrites.

Atomic Virulent : "You can't spell DOUCHE. without CODE."

Hiasa Kite
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#213 - 2014-12-29 13:20:36 UTC
Jurico Elemenohpe wrote:
Hiasa Kite wrote:
Mining for PLEX is playing the game wrong. Mining in a failfit, overly expensive T2 mining ship without trying to defend it is playing it wrong. Autopiloting with an expensive cargo is playing the game wrong.

These aren't opinions, they are facts. None of the above scenarios are beneficial to the player partaking in them. They can do the exact same job more efficently and/or more safely by not being greedy, being aware of the game's mechanics and paying attention to their surroundings.
Eh. I can't see it as truly 'wrong' (although we might be defining it differently) since eve is a sandbox and if they want to be lazy and do no research, it's not wrong. Just very stupid.

OK, I'll expand on the difference between an opinionated wrong and a factual wrong.

If I were to start putting my jeans on back-to-front, I think it's fair to say that most people would say I was doing it wrong.

Someone people would look at them while I was walking around and say they look stupid like that. That's an opinionated wrong. Most would agree that they're right, but it's still a matter of opinion.

Now, if I were to complain that my new fashion choice was uncomfortable, that putting them on and doing them up took too long and was too difficult, then I'm factually wrong because I'm simply not using the clothing as intended or suboptimally. Someone could point out to me that the fly & button should be facing the front, making my life much easier; this would be helpful advice to help me with my mistake.

The player that mines for PLEX, is going through a 40 hour process to pay for his account, not including additional mining required for spending money. Complaining that it takes too long would indicate he needs a higher pad in-game profession or to spend a little time out of game getting paid real cash in order to pay for his account; even a paper round will easily cover subscription costs and a PLEX to cash in each month.

If it takes days or weeks to pay for his ship, then compains it got blown up, his profession is too poorly paid or he chose to fly a ship that was far too expensive for him.

If a player doesn't pay attention to the game, fails to avoid an easily avoidable loss and complains about it; you guessed it, he should've paid more attention.

These are the typical positions that gank victims find themselves in. They play the game suboptimally, then complain about an ineffeicient process or that the odds are somehow stacked against them, when they just need to educate themselves and/or adapt.

"Playing an MMO by yourself is like masturbating in the middle of an orgy." -Jonah Gravenstein

Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#214 - 2014-12-29 14:27:56 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD LackOfFaith
La Rynx wrote:

The poor innocent codies get threats all the time.
That they are causing the threats is ignored or denied.


And this is what is wrong with carebears.

They are not "causing" anything. The people spouting abuse and violating the EULA are the ones at fault for that. They are responsible for their actions, and no one else.


Quote:

But how serious are those threats?
Remembering Remiel, CCP did not act on accusations.


They did not act on mine either, and I had to get the police involved with mine.

It's because their GM staff is biased.

Quote:

One might assume, that CCP too nows whats going on.
That most of those "baaaaaad baaaaad" threats are emotional outburst and not meant seriously.


If someone is so emotionally fragile that being laughed at makes them spew death threats, homophobic slurs and vile sexual insults, then they are an unstable, disgraceful excuse for a human being.


Quote:

No: -> RL threats are bad, no excuse.
They just have to be RL threats and not just some emotional outburst, which happen a lot of time when you lose a ship.


They are equally unacceptable, stop trying to excuse EULA violations, you slime. Stop trying to blame the only real victims here.

They can take the "emotional outburst" defense and shove it into a shattered wormhole. Presumably, we are all adults here, and adults are not ruled by their petty little feelings, nor are adults prone to violent outbursts when they lose at a videogame.

{Snip. No personal attacks allowed. -- ISD LackOfFaith}

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

John E Normus
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#215 - 2014-12-29 15:04:16 UTC
Why doesn't anyone like Veers?

Between Ignorance and Wisdom

Hiasa Kite
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#216 - 2014-12-29 15:08:37 UTC
John E Normus wrote:
Why doesn't anyone like Veers?

I like him when he's not trolling. Believe it or not he does occasionally make a valid post. Not often, though.

"Playing an MMO by yourself is like masturbating in the middle of an orgy." -Jonah Gravenstein

Jurico Elemenohpe
Flipsid3 Tactics
#217 - 2014-12-29 15:17:55 UTC
Hiasa Kite wrote:
Jurico Elemenohpe wrote:
Hiasa Kite wrote:
Mining for PLEX is playing the game wrong. Mining in a failfit, overly expensive T2 mining ship without trying to defend it is playing it wrong. Autopiloting with an expensive cargo is playing the game wrong.

These aren't opinions, they are facts. None of the above scenarios are beneficial to the player partaking in them. They can do the exact same job more efficently and/or more safely by not being greedy, being aware of the game's mechanics and paying attention to their surroundings.
Eh. I can't see it as truly 'wrong' (although we might be defining it differently) since eve is a sandbox and if they want to be lazy and do no research, it's not wrong. Just very stupid.

OK, I'll expand on the difference between an opinionated wrong and a factual wrong.

If I were to start putting my jeans on back-to-front, I think it's fair to say that most people would say I was doing it wrong.

Someone people would look at them while I was walking around and say they look stupid like that. That's an opinionated wrong. Most would agree that they're right, but it's still a matter of opinion.

Now, if I were to complain that my new fashion choice was uncomfortable, that putting them on and doing them up took too long and was too difficult, then I'm factually wrong because I'm simply not using the clothing as intended or suboptimally. Someone could point out to me that the fly & button should be facing the front, making my life much easier; this would be helpful advice to help me with my mistake.

The player that mines for PLEX, is going through a 40 hour process to pay for his account, not including additional mining required for spending money. Complaining that it takes too long would indicate he needs a higher pad in-game profession or to spend a little time out of game getting paid real cash in order to pay for his account; even a paper round will easily cover subscription costs and a PLEX to cash in each month.

If it takes days or weeks to pay for his ship, then compains it got blown up, his profession is too poorly paid or he chose to fly a ship that was far too expensive for him.

If a player doesn't pay attention to the game, fails to avoid an easily avoidable loss and complains about it; you guessed it, he should've paid more attention.

These are the typical positions that gank victims find themselves in. They play the game suboptimally, then complain about an ineffeicient process or that the odds are somehow stacked against them, when they just need to educate themselves and/or adapt.

Confusing, but it makes sense now.
CCP Falcon
#218 - 2014-12-29 15:24:30 UTC
This thread has gone way off topic, and is the subject of a high volume of reports, as such it's being closed.

- F

CCP Falcon || EVE Universe Community Manager || @CCP_Falcon

Happy Birthday To FAWLTY7! <3