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4/10 DED and T3s
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Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2014-12-26 17:06:28 UTC
Just tried entering a Serpentis Phit Outpost in my Loki and was denied, ran 3 of these 2 weeks ago.

So ninja fix to bar t3s from 4/10s now? Or is it just me.

Art of Explosions
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
#2 - 2014-12-26 17:10:34 UTC
Quote:
Some 4/10 exploration sites have had their gate access corrected to prevent entry by Strategic Cruisers

Patch notes for Rhea.

"I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas..." - Herman Melville
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2014-12-26 17:52:46 UTC
so its ishtar/gila or gtfo, i see

Art of Explosions
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
#4 - 2014-12-26 17:59:47 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
so its ishtar/gila or gtfo, i see

and Stratios.

"I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas..." - Herman Melville
Aplysia Vejun
Children of Agasul
#5 - 2014-12-26 23:15:23 UTC
...or nearly any t2 cruiser or most t1 cruisers
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2014-12-26 23:20:28 UTC
none of them come close to the aforementioned ships in terms of efficiency though.

Art of Explosions
Aplysia Vejun
Children of Agasul
#7 - 2014-12-26 23:32:00 UTC
Tsukino Stareine wrote:
none of them come close to the aforementioned ships in terms of efficiency though.


The Navy Vexor does.
But that wasn't your question.
In gurista space you'll need one of those ships to have a chance. But there are other regions where you have plenty of time to finish your site.
Aramatheia
Tiffany and Co.
#8 - 2014-12-27 00:03:17 UTC
having NO problem whatsoever in a faction omen fitted for relic sites, combat with probe launcher no changing or refitting required. Is a great little ship. Sure its no legion but it can take the gates and do the sites, im happy
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2014-12-27 00:18:14 UTC
must be slow as hell though

Art of Explosions
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#10 - 2014-12-27 02:18:31 UTC
Aren't t3's only bared in high sec? Where it's. .... overkill to say the least.
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2014-12-27 02:23:05 UTC
might be, the last 2 4/10s i did were in low. Why would the same site bar t3s in different sec though? Sounds overcomplicated.

Art of Explosions
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#12 - 2014-12-27 02:26:56 UTC
The baring of t3's was to allow newbies to have a chance. If you go back to the original patch notes they will explain it better. But basically faction fit tengus were just blitzing everything and scooping loot even if the newbie got the kill. And said newbie of course had no chance to fight a t3 either.
Yes Eve is harsh and pvp. But you also need newbies to be able to grow and develop. Tough balance to create.
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2014-12-28 03:42:11 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
The baring of t3's was to allow newbies to have a chance. If you go back to the original patch notes they will explain it better. But basically faction fit tengus were just blitzing everything and scooping loot even if the newbie got the kill. And said newbie of course had no chance to fight a t3 either.
Yes Eve is harsh and pvp. But you also need newbies to be able to grow and develop. Tough balance to create.

Because the Gila, Ishtar, and Stratios aren't overbearing for newbies. Or any HACs or most Faction Cruisers.

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.
Tsukino Stareine
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2014-12-28 03:43:33 UTC
Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
The baring of t3's was to allow newbies to have a chance. If you go back to the original patch notes they will explain it better. But basically faction fit tengus were just blitzing everything and scooping loot even if the newbie got the kill. And said newbie of course had no chance to fight a t3 either.
Yes Eve is harsh and pvp. But you also need newbies to be able to grow and develop. Tough balance to create.

Because the Gila, Ishtar, and Stratios aren't overbearing for newbies. Or any HACs or most Faction Cruisers.


exactly this, might as well bar anything except T1 cruisers from 4/10s

Art of Explosions
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#15 - 2014-12-28 08:20:47 UTC
I can't imagine using a gila for combat sites.... sentry drones ftw!

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
#16 - 2014-12-28 09:37:52 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
I can't imagine using a gila for combat sites.... sentry drones ftw!

In some sites sentries are faster, but in close combat gila is a beast. I don't like drone boats but all guristas ships are amazing hulls.

Omnathious Deninard wrote:
Because the Gila, Ishtar, and Stratios aren't overbearing for newbies. Or any HACs or most Faction Cruisers.

Agree. T3s are as much efficient as pirates/T2s. Sentry boats are even faster than T3s.

"I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas..." - Herman Melville
Unezka Turigahl
Det Som Engang Var
#17 - 2014-12-29 05:19:26 UTC
Yep, T3s banned again.

And yep, T3s aren't any better than a HAC or pirate cruiser for 3/10 or 4/10.

CCP has never given any reason for it. There is no reason for it. It's nonsense.
Henry Plantgenet
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2015-01-01 01:02:44 UTC
Be happy your ill gotten loot from earlier hasn't been confiscated by CCP.
T3s have been banned from 3/10s and 4/10s since Oddyssey 1.0.
Mnemosyne Gloob
#19 - 2015-01-02 13:08:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Mnemosyne Gloob
Unezka Turigahl wrote:
CCP has never given any reason for it.


Do you not remember the times when hisec explo meant predominantly tengus? The time after usage of DSP became common?

Granted this was before changes to HACs and the pirate cruisers, which now makes them maybe even more efficient. Back then the whole package of tech3+expanded launcher+dsp was probably why CCP did what they did.

And i think they should leave it how it is now, it's okay. In lowsec i welcomed this change, as it meant i could do the 4/10s and not care about the eternal tenguswarm. They fly other ships now, too, though.

[edit]NERF TENGU!!one[/edit]

[editedit]if only they would now fix broken ded escalations. if you get a 5/10 you should have to go where 5/10s are and do the whole site[/editedit]
Unezka Turigahl
Det Som Engang Var
#20 - 2015-01-02 16:59:58 UTC
They never said they banned T3s because Tengus were too efficient. That is speculation. And speculation is all that there is because they have never made a statement on it.

If it was because Tengus were too efficient, it doesn't make any sense. Odyssey also removed DSPs, which by itself reduced the efficiency of the Tengu. One of the reasons the Tengu was so popular was because it was so easy to fit the expanded launcher on it without gimping your fit. No DSPs, no need for explorers to have an expanded launcher anymore. They also made general probing far easier in Odyssey, increasing efficiency in this aspect of exploration greatly, regardless of ship. Effectively: if you're in a non-T3, your probing efficiency increased the day of Odyssey.

Then they buffed HACs and pirate cruisers, which are generally better for the job now than Tengus would be, certainly better than the other T3s.

So post-Odyssey... non-T3 ships probe faster and clear sites faster than they did pre-Odyssey. The sites are found and run in greater quantity than pre-Odyssey and are being blitzed faster than they were pre-Odyssey. Efficiency is up. Just look at the ever plummeting loot value since Odyssey.

Hell, now people can easily farm their own private hisec 4-10s and 5-10s from anomalies as you pointed out. If Tengus were banned because they made it too easy, or were too hard for other players to compete with... then why would CCP have made ANY of the other changes they've made during and after Odyssey with regards to exploration? Farming 3/10s and 4/10s has never been easier or faster. And you don't even need to compete for the sites anymore either.

Yes, I used a Tengu pre-Odyssey. I'd rather fly my Ishtar or Gila now. I want T3s allowed back in so I can laugh at them as I steal their sites, and for more variety in ship types found in 3/10s and 4/10s.
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