Player Features and Ideas Discussion

The TL;DR to the whole thread.

A/C are nice to fill highslots with on ships that don't really care whether theirs highs are filled or not. But not dedicated ships.

I could put heavy missile launchers on anything they fit on and go whore on thousands of killmails (time and sanity withstanding), and get the same metrics. Just because a killboard says they get used doesnt make them good. How many of those kills are solo? Or was it with a gang/blob? Also, most stabber kills are against frigates. Im talking about engagements with cruisers."Yea, yea.. acs kill things all the time, with a 10 man gang".

Granted not everything in EVE is meant to be soloable, but i would expect my HAC to be able to break a t1 cruiser's tank at its intended engagement range.

As it stands now, speed is all minny have going for them, but they cant kill ships at range. So instead of "In rust we trust" i vote minmatar motto "minmatar, the best at running away".

So, because we dont use them in fleet doctrines they are useless? Well then, using that logic I guess you also think that ECM is useless too given that nobody uses it in block fleets.

What kind of half arsed argument is that?

You asked where all of the auto cannons are, I showed you that the two most popular ships on the killboard this month are both autocannon ships.

This thread isn't evidence of anything, its just a bunch of people who want their fotm back. Most people in here are trying to use them like blasters then complaining that blasters are better. Well no ****.

Celestis does not use ECM. ECM is indeed a weapon. I made the exact same claim you did with autos, glad you agree its stupid.



Dont brawl with blaster boats, use your faster hulls to get range on them. Vs laser boats, get in close and use your better tracking. Rails do not have better tracking than autos. Arty platforms are still the single best alpha weapons in the game and plenty of ships can fit them.


So dont let them slingshot. Poor piloting on your part does not mean min ships are bad.


Of course you are asking for winmatar back. You are unhappy because we have a lot more options and most ships are now viable and can deal with your matari ships when fitted and flown well.

This is why using EFT for anything other than seeing if something will fit is bad.

That said, AC get twice the range of blasters. They also get selectable damage, no cap use and ammo that provides better tracking.

Tracking ammo is more useful for arty (or large a/c's) since base a/c tracking is ok for medium a/c's. Tracking ammo turns a/c dps from anemic, to almost useless. For arty, its still managable, since alpha is 2k+. So, that point is irrelevant.

A/c get selectable damage type while brawling, not kiting. You're locked into barrage so you can apply decent dps, otherwise you take a significant dps hit, meaning i can't kill anything but frigs or buffer fits at kite range. I imagine a passive shield fit ratting drake could tank it pretty easily.

No cap use, and they have a fairly low dps, where as blasters have high dps, and have cap use. Sounds like a balanced trade-off.Yet blasters reach out to a/c engagement range, and as you said yourself, destroy a/c's in brawler range. Which limits the rational engagements to kiting, which means i'm using barrage more than the "selectable" damage types. Then, with barrage, not only am i doing anemic a/c dps, but i'm taking a dps and tracking nerf from the ammo, and stuck with explosive damage.

Best case scenario i'm doing 385dps with a HAC? Yep, sounds good. The whole "speed" thing is not as big as it used to be, there is orthus, phantasm, cynabal, nomen, scyfi, stabber, deimos and every swarm of inties out there (among other ships) that are faster than minmatar's t2 "fastest ship". So thats not an excuse for the low dps. Orthus/phantasm easily out dps vagabond at their engagement ranges and are equally fast.

Skimming through your kills, you don't fly anything with a/c's. I see you sit in a mega a lot, why not a tempest, or a mael?

I mean if capless weapons with selectable damage types and tracking ammo is so great, why not roll around with a/c's more often?

The concept of popular should be about reality .. not your imagination... Cyanabals are not even CLOSE to being popular. Peopel that want fast mobile cruisers use TEngus, navy omens, and several other things that completely outclass the cynabal.

Just as many stabbers are sold as omens. More 425s are sold than heavy pulse. The cynable out sells the vigilant by a factor of two. This is the reality.

I understand this game perfectly. Most corp roams are based around fast cruisers with the bulk being the cynable. To say that the cynable is not a good ship is an outright lie and a very visible one at that. If you want to be taken seriously then the lies and explosive rage at anyone who disagrees with you need to stop.

The arguments here are weak to say the least. This thread is full of people looking at DPS numbers only, people trying to use autos and arty like other weapon system and getting bad results, people badly fitting their ships and using poor tactics then blaming the tools and whenever someone points out they are wrong they pull a tantrum and toss the insults around while not addressing the points that were raised. It is also not a good idea to start trying to say people who disagree with you don't know how to play the game when the same people are well known for their ability to get ships to do seemingly impossible things.

Neutron blasters are effective up to 30km, 800mm are effective out to 60.

Tracking wise, blaster get higher tracking due to having to deal with ships at much closer range. Autos have more range which means the strain of tracking targets is less than on blasters. This is why the canes loaded with sabot dominated roaming gangs for several years. Incidentally, nothing changed with them in terms of their firepower, they are just as deadly today as they were before. Both the Jag and Wolf are among the best frigates out there for both fleet and solo work. The rupture, stabber, fleet stabber and fleet scythe are all fully able to hold their own. The tornado is king of the alpha gankers. The pest is one of the few battleships that can solo effectively and the Mael is still by far the most effective fleet alpha boat and would still dominate null doctrines if not for the issues with shield ships and bombs.

The problem with people here is that they don't like the fact that all of the other ships are not as helpless as they used to be.

No that is a fact. I have been using them for the last 4 years, this is their effective range on most setups.



Hitting inside your falloff is often not all that effective either. AC are designed to operate in falloff, Blasters are not.


The pest has the room to fit those extenders, the mega does not unless you start making sacrifices. Said pest will also be dictating range and will be able to cripple the cap of the megathron as well as making use of the megathrons resist holes..

For smaller ships, the rupture has more than enough room for one or two TEs, the stabber will out range most blaster boats and both have the speed to dictate range and both can fit neuts. The Wolf and JAGare both very capable ships and neihers need help with range.