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Mouse Macro Clarification

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Ducian
Zero Effect Industries
#1 - 2014-12-19 16:58:09 UTC
Hi,

As an early Christmas pressie I have been given one of Razor's MMO mice (with the keypad on the side). Given the changes with CCP's policy on macros I wanted to clarify how far I can use the features on the mouse.

I presume it is OK for me to map the keypad on the side of the mouse to the function keys (1=F1, 2=F2 etc) to allow me to activate modules when flying a ship. Can this be confirmed?

I presume it is NOT OK for me to map a macro to the keypad (1=F1, pause 2 seconds, Press F1) to "pulse" a module. Can this be confirmed?

If I've posted this is the wrong section can someone let me know and I'll post where I should, once I get back from getting fags and beer.

Thanks - Ducian
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#2 - 2014-12-19 16:59:54 UTC
See here

☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
CCP Logibro
C C P
C C P Alliance
#3 - 2014-12-19 17:05:10 UTC
If you want clarification for anything like this, the best thing to do is to file a support ticket and ask the GMs. Any other answer will be non-authoritative.

CCP Logibro // EVE Universe Community Team // Distributor of Nanites // Patron Saint of Logistics

@CCP_Logibro
ISD LackOfFaith
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#4 - 2014-12-19 17:09:54 UTC
CCP Logibro wrote:
If you want clarification for anything like this, the best thing to do is to file a support ticket and ask the GMs. Any other answer will be non-authoritative.

What he said. Anything we can tell you here will not "hold up in court". It is just our best understanding of the rules.

I can try to (unofficially) help, though:

Ducian wrote:
I presume it is OK for me to map the keypad on the side of the mouse to the function keys (1=F1, 2=F2 etc) to allow me to activate modules when flying a ship. Can this be confirmed?

Sounds about right. You push a button, the client receives one command, everything is cool.

Ducian wrote:

I presume it is NOT OK for me to map a macro to the keypad (1=F1, pause 2 seconds, Press F1) to "pulse" a module. Can this be confirmed?

Correct. Any "automated" actions are not okay. You need to be the direct cause for every command your client gets.

Again, though, these answers are non-authoritative, and based on my best understanding of the rules. Please file a support ticket for an official answer.

ISD LackOfFaith

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Interstellar Services Department

I do not respond to Eve Mail or anything other than the forums.
Grauth Thorner
Vicious Trading Company
#5 - 2014-12-19 17:21:04 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
See here


This is about multiboxing, not using hardware to automate commands or (re)binding keys

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Ducian
Zero Effect Industries
#6 - 2014-12-19 17:46:51 UTC
Thanks for your help. I've logged a support ticket to see what the GMs say.

Cheers - Ducian
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#7 - 2014-12-19 17:53:24 UTC
I have the exact same setup and my reading of the eula is inline with the op.

Hotkeys are fine provided they aren't triggering an automated sequence (which those bits of kit are easily capable of).
I would advise against that functionality as I understand they breach the rules.
I have not run into any issues or warnings over the keyboard or mouse usage in the last year of use but I wouldn't because I just have hotkeys for individual commands as per normal keyboard and mouse use.

Obviously file a support ticket for clarification on exactly what constitutes a breach and get the word from ccp themselves.

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Sol Project
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
#8 - 2014-12-19 17:57:33 UTC
Hey, while we're at it ...

Can I have a button that sends a command to the other client,
without me having to need to switch focus?

No information would be sent automatically or multiplexed,
as I still have to control each client individually.


Oh. I answered my question all by myself.


Sheesh, how did I do that ?

Ladies of New Eden YC 117 by Indahmawar Fazmarai

Warning: NSFW! Barely legal girls in underwear!

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Caviar Liberta
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2014-12-19 18:03:48 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
I have the exact same setup and my reading of the eula is inline with the op.

Hotkeys are fine provided they aren't triggering an automated sequence (which those bits of kit are easily capable of).
I would advise against that functionality as I understand they breach the rules.
I have not run into any issues or warnings over the keyboard or mouse usage in the last year of use but I wouldn't because I just have hotkeys for individual commands as per normal keyboard and mouse use.

Obviously file a support ticket for clarification on exactly what constitutes a breach and get the word from ccp themselves.


As per the rules everyone will have to submit the same question.
Sol Project
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
#10 - 2014-12-19 18:05:57 UTC
Well, anyhow ....



  1. I presume it is OK for me to map the keypad on the side of the mouse to the function keys (1=F1, 2=F2 etc) to allow me to activate modules when flying a ship. Can this be confirmed?

    2. Confirming.


  2. I presume it is NOT OK for me to map a macro to the keypad (1=F1, pause 2 seconds, Press F1) to "pulse" a module. Can this be confirmed?

    3. Confirming again. You may use any button you like for any input you want,
    as long as it's only one [unit of action] you personally trigger at one single client.


What's verboten, is multiplexing and automation.

Multiplexing means that you trigger one [unit of action] and software turns it into multiple.
This unit would get sent to several other clients.

Automation is when the computer initiates a unit all by himself.


Save the GMs the time, you don't need the petition.

Ladies of New Eden YC 117 by Indahmawar Fazmarai

Warning: NSFW! Barely legal girls in underwear!

Diana Kim > AND THIS IS WHY THE FEDERATION MUST BE DESTROYED!!
bigman111222
Dead's Prostitutes
The Initiative.
#11 - 2014-12-19 18:29:45 UTC  |  Edited by: bigman111222
All doc fury's referrals and suggested should be considered fact, and can stand up in the highest eve courts.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#12 - 2014-12-19 18:53:27 UTC
ok, now page 1 needs a red GM tag (please, my OCD needs it).

spacecourt best court.

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President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#13 - 2014-12-19 19:47:23 UTC
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Bienator II
madmen of the skies
#14 - 2014-12-19 19:50:32 UTC
CCP Logibro wrote:
If you want clarification for anything like this, the best thing to do is to file a support ticket and ask the GMs. Any other answer will be non-authoritative.


yeah sure. but i guess many will have the same question. I don't own a single input device with non-programmable buttons.

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Altirius Saldiaro
Doomheim
#15 - 2014-12-19 20:17:51 UTC
CCP Logibro wrote:
If you want clarification for anything like this, the best thing to do is to file a support ticket and ask the GMs. Any other answer will be non-authoritative.


Then we get in trouble if we post that answer on the forums.

We are asking for official clarification from CCP in a dev blog, sticky thread, something public.
Mai Khumm
172.0.0.1
#16 - 2014-12-19 21:08:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Mai Khumm
Altirius Saldiaro wrote:
CCP Logibro wrote:
If you want clarification for anything like this, the best thing to do is to file a support ticket and ask the GMs. Any other answer will be non-authoritative.


Then we get in trouble if we post that answer on the forums.

We are asking for official clarification from CCP in a dev blog, sticky thread, something public.

CCP like to keep things are grey as possible.
They never give a yes/no direct answer for anything!

Annoyingly they're within their right to do so. It's just whenever a issue comes up they can take any stance they want. Also, if they give us direct rules then players will push them and see how far they get. That in itself will present a whole list of he-said she-said issues.

One of us just has to file a petition, post it online and take a bullet for the team!
Rosewalker
Khumaak Flying Circus
#17 - 2014-12-19 21:23:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Rosewalker
Altirius Saldiaro wrote:
CCP Logibro wrote:
If you want clarification for anything like this, the best thing to do is to file a support ticket and ask the GMs. Any other answer will be non-authoritative.


Then we get in trouble if we post that answer on the forums.

We are asking for official clarification from CCP in a dev blog, sticky thread, something public.


I don't think you are going to get an answer here on the forums because having rules clarifications scattered throughout the forums is a bad practice. From a tweet from CCP Random, any such posts from before 1 January 2015 will be "outdated".

Ideally, any such clarifications should be located on a EULA FAQ page so everyone knows where to find the answer.

The Nosy Gamer - CCP Random: "hehe, falls under the category: nice try, but no. ;)"
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#18 - 2014-12-19 21:40:54 UTC
The rule of thumb that I use is that if it makes what would be multiple clicks/keypresses into one, then it's probably against the rules.

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One of ours, ten of theirs.

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Prince Kobol
#19 - 2014-12-19 22:15:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Prince Kobol
I have petitioned a similar question asking for clarification and the answer I was given was basically if you are unsure do not do it.


In my opinion that is a very poor response and it has led me to letting 1 account expire with a 2nd due to expire in the next few days.

My other accounts will expire in due time.

I am not going to pay to play a game where you can not get clarification on a rule that could lead you to getting banned.

I have never come across any other game where customer support was unable to clarify a rule via petition.
J'Poll
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#20 - 2014-12-19 22:22:35 UTC
Ducian wrote:
Hi,

As an early Christmas pressie I have been given one of Razor's MMO mice (with the keypad on the side). Given the changes with CCP's policy on macros I wanted to clarify how far I can use the features on the mouse.

I presume it is OK for me to map the keypad on the side of the mouse to the function keys (1=F1, 2=F2 etc) to allow me to activate modules when flying a ship. Can this be confirmed?

I presume it is NOT OK for me to map a macro to the keypad (1=F1, pause 2 seconds, Press F1) to "pulse" a module. Can this be confirmed?

If I've posted this is the wrong section can someone let me know and I'll post where I should, once I get back from getting fags and beer.

Thanks - Ducian


As above, for a official statement, use the petition system.

However,


Option 1 kind of looks okay to me. As it's just "remapping" your F-keys to the mouse.

Option 2 isn't...as it is automation (it automatically turns off the module after 2 seconds - aka, it does 2 things seperate things with 1 single click).

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