Player Features and Ideas Discussion

If you're that new, then they probably have you as tackle, which you can do the second you create your character, or within 10 to 20 minutes.

As to the rest, again, there's nothing that says there has to be a t1 ship that can do everything a t2 can. They're not supposed to. I gave you a couple great examples of t2 ships that do things that nothing else in the game can do. How about capitals? That's even more training, and do you think anything teaches you how to use them? Those are even t1!

That's the thing of it, this is not some simple kiddy game of Hello Kitty Online, or WoW. This is EVE. Everything has its thing, it's role, its purpose, but not everything is a clear linear progression. As to the skillplans they have for you to fly certain ships, there's generally good reason for it: a lot of times the fit simply won't work without those skills. I've got an Ishkur fit (assault frigate, t2) that, prior to the hybrid buff in the last patch, had something like 0.02 power grid free, and that's with all skills that affect that ship and the fittings, at level 4 or 5. Logistics are one of those ships, the effective setups require high skills, because you need to maximize your ability to repair quickly, but also be able to maintain it indefinitely. Your job, as in any game, is also one of those most important: if the healer dies, everyone dies. They can't afford for you to be in there screwing up the cap chain, or getting in the way, and if you can't be productive in that role yet, there are other roles where you _can_ be useful with.

Alternatively, you can leave the goons, go to high-sec, and learn the game the way everyone else does, where you actually might get a chance to use those ships, like the support cruisers, that don't do the job as well. You'll get that chance, because the stakes aren't as high, and the stuff you're trying to protect not so valuable. When the guy you're supposed to try to keep from dying is flying half a billion or more worth a ship, can you really blame him for wanting the best repping him?

At the end of the day, the problem isn't the ships, it's your expectations of them. If you truly cannot wait to earn and unlock it like everyone else does, in every other game, then hop on the character bazaar forum and start looking at logistics pilots, then buy some PLEX to sell and get the isk to buy it.

ok, so the basic premise of all of this as follows:

t1 logi cruisers are less effective than other t1 cruisers when being compared to their respective t2 counterparts on a percentage basis, regardless if this is cost effectiveness or actual performance (the latter of which logi cruisers take a real beating).

lol goonwaffe

blarg we don't get this

rantrantrantrantrant



So, sticking by the first point, I have to agree that something must be done. However, I think the issue may be in the modules being used than the ships. Buff the RR modules (mostly amount repped per cycle) while increasing capacitor need. Then give all eight logi ships (logistics cruisers and their t1 counterparts) a role bonus that reduces capacitor need for their specific RR module type(s).

Though it may be better to fix the ships themselves. The Basi is too slow and has a large sig radius, too large for some alliances to consider for fleet combat. The Orineros is simply left to rot because the guardian does the same armor-fixing job with capacitor transfer abilities instead of remote tracking links.

In retrospect, it would seem there is a double-standard being held against the Orineros and Basilisk. It almost seems that everyone wants to forget that the Caldari and Gallente both exist and they want to focus on the Amarr/Minmatar douchfaggotry.

As well as creating new ones using these ships.

They can still do that. They can choose not to but having a good T1 Logi will not change there current effectiveness.

No you have. You can use those setups all you want. The fact that there are Spiderfleets with T2 Logi existing proves this. This adds to your arsenal, you are the one taking away from it.

T1 Ship Roles = WoW everyone

T1 SHIP ROLES = WoW. Everyone Freak Out Now Because It = WoW!!!



It breaks no varied strategy it just takes ships that are not used and boosts there effectiveness with said strategy. If you primary the new weak Logi and remove them from the field first you are left with your Spider and they have nothing. Tactics greater then all, new weapons just allow you to modify said tactics if you so choose and come with all the weaknesses along with benefits of streamlining said tactics.

Agree with OP.

The tiers and the drawbacks which come with them (less PG, CPU, HP, Slots) may have been usefull some time in the past. Especially when the price-differences between those tiers meant something (there was a time where the price difference for cruiser-tiers meant the same thing to those players as todays price-differences between Battleship-tiers).

Todays NPE gives players quiet a lot of isk and enough standing even for lvl 3 missions.

As for certain ships, minmatar cruisers are a good example: If the Rupture is better at being a Stabber than the Stabber itself, it is sad. Also the the rupture pretty much outweighs any bonuses a scythe could field.

Better are Caldari: Both Moa and Caracal are quiet good ships. The Blackbird is good enough for being first-target in any engagement, although just for lolECM. The Osprey ... well it can mine at least.