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Railguns

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Viribus
Wilderness
IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII
#21 - 2014-12-02 06:01:46 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Viribus wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:

Railguns arnt affected by target painters.


i've never seen someone more wrong

and i saw someone say that HMLs were good and ishtars were balanced

Dude a higher target sig radius doesn't increase damage like with missiles.


a higher sig doesn't "increase damage", it just makes targets easier to track

paints don't "increase damage" for missiles either; painting a drake isn't going to make light missiles do any more damage to it, since you're doing full damage anyway

increased sig radius just make it easier for missiles to hit small, moving targets

just
like
turrets

watch me be a scurb and get owned
ISD Ezwal
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#22 - 2014-12-02 11:06:12 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Anhenka wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Viribus wrote:
i can't say i have much faith in the ideas of someone who doesn't know that target painters help turrets

They don't help all turrets. Hence why tracking computers and links are so important. Read the railgun description.


They help all turrets.

Target sig vs Weapon sig, Distance to target vs optimal/falloff, and transversal speed. Every single turret uses these three bits in determining if they hit and for how much.

Those TPs fit under the Target sig part. And it is taken into account for EVERY SINGLE WEAPON SYSTEM (except smartbombs)

Railguns arnt affected by target painters.
Yes they are. Like all turret systems.
The target signature radius (which can be increased by applying Target Painters) affects both targeting speed and chance to hit. A higher chance to hit per shot fired of course leading to higher applied damage over time.

ISD Ezwal Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)
Porucznik Borewicz
GreenSwarm
#23 - 2014-12-02 11:34:09 UTC
Rekt by the wrecking shots applied with the help of a target painter.
Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#24 - 2014-12-02 15:46:42 UTC
Viribus wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:

Railguns arnt affected by target painters.


i've never seen someone more wrong

and i saw someone say that HMLs were good and ishtars were balanced


and they were very confused clearly ..
OP needs too learn the tracking formulas

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using
Mag's
Azn Empire
#25 - 2014-12-02 16:32:22 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Railguns arnt affected by target painters.
ShockedStraightLol

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
scorchlikeshiswhiskey
Totally Abstract
O X I D E
#26 - 2014-12-02 16:44:45 UTC
Oh the lulz.... I didn't realize there were people that actually thought painters were some sort of missile only TE, now I know better.
FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#27 - 2014-12-02 17:02:04 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Viribus wrote:
i can't say i have much faith in the ideas of someone who doesn't know that target painters help turrets

They don't help all turrets. Hence why tracking computers and links are so important. Read the railgun description.


Keep digging, OP.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

Schneevva
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#28 - 2014-12-02 17:19:06 UTC
Komi Toran wrote:
So, we've gotten threads for missiles, projectiles, and now rails. Besides sentries, is there any weapon system that is not the worst right now?


The one I don't use of course, it's overpowered.
Paranoid Loyd
#29 - 2014-12-02 19:24:15 UTC
Stop trolling

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Brigadine Ferathine
Presumed Dead Enterprises
Against ALL Authorities.
#30 - 2014-12-08 02:36:16 UTC
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Stop trolling

I am not trolling. If I am not mistaken they nerfed tracking for PvP reasons. My main complaint for the tracking is not PvP ratting, DEDs etc. PvPers always mess it up for everyone else. How it the world can my Megathron with a Max lvl tacking ship bonus 1 medium slot computer+ 1 low slow computer all T2 fitted optimal of 42km miss ships at 40km while sitting still moving 0.0 M/S. No that is not ok. CCP unnerf them please. My hit rate with that ship should be near 100% not 75% or lower.
Aran Hotchkiss
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#31 - 2014-12-08 03:02:12 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Stop trolling

PvPers always mess it up for everyone else.


I'd say about..... 80% of everything built in EvE is blown up in PvP.... pinning the cause of your 'problem' on them is going to lose you what little regard people still have for you/your argument.


Check the tracking speed of your rails. Add angular velocity to your overview. If a target's angular is higher than your tracking speed, you're going to miss.

You should have enough control over your herd of cats to make them understand. If they constantly make misstakes, get better cats.
Brigadine Ferathine
Presumed Dead Enterprises
Against ALL Authorities.
#32 - 2014-12-08 03:38:44 UTC
Aran Hotchkiss wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Stop trolling

PvPers always mess it up for everyone else.


I'd say about..... 80% of everything built in EvE is blown up in PvP.... pinning the cause of your 'problem' on them is going to lose you what little regard people still have for you/your argument.


Check the tracking speed of your rails. Add angular velocity to your overview. If a target's angular is higher than your tracking speed, you're going to miss.

If CCP could figure out how to make things fit on the overview or other places so we don't end up with one big overview in space would be great, but that's a whole other can of worms.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#33 - 2014-12-08 06:01:17 UTC
ISD Ezwal wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Anhenka wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Viribus wrote:
i can't say i have much faith in the ideas of someone who doesn't know that target painters help turrets

They don't help all turrets. Hence why tracking computers and links are so important. Read the railgun description.


They help all turrets.

Target sig vs Weapon sig, Distance to target vs optimal/falloff, and transversal speed. Every single turret uses these three bits in determining if they hit and for how much.

Those TPs fit under the Target sig part. And it is taken into account for EVERY SINGLE WEAPON SYSTEM (except smartbombs)

Railguns arnt affected by target painters.
Yes they are. Like all turret systems.
The target signature radius (which can be increased by applying Target Painters) affects both targeting speed and chance to hit. A higher chance to hit per shot fired of course leading to higher applied damage over time.


When even ISD says your thread is bad... your thread is bad.

Painters help all turrets track. Period. There was a discussion of the math here about three weeks ago.
Brigadine Ferathine
Presumed Dead Enterprises
Against ALL Authorities.
#34 - 2014-12-08 06:10:38 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
Zhilia Mann wrote:
When even ISD says your thread is bad... your thread is bad.

Painters help all turrets track. Period. There was a discussion of the math here about three weeks ago.

He didn't say my tread was bad he just said my claim about target painters wasn't true. It doesn't make my other points irrelevant. Hybrids are still damage type locked have horrible midrange among other things.



Fixed quoting. ISD Ezwal.
Joe Risalo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#35 - 2014-12-08 06:24:24 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Ezwal
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Zhilia Mann wrote:
When even ISD says your thread is bad... your thread is bad.

Painters help all turrets track. Period. There was a discussion of the math here about three weeks ago.

He didn't say my tread was bad he just said my claim about target painters wasn't true. It doesn't make my other points irrelevant. Hybrids are still damage type locked have horrible midrange among other things.



Fixed quoting. ISD Ezwal.


If your primary focus is PVE, get a missile boat... Fit it with t2 cruise and 2 target painters...
You'll be quite happy with the outcome..

However, if you've ever PVP'd at long range, you'd probably cry the first time you got hit by two turret vollies before your first missile volley even landed....
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#36 - 2014-12-08 06:31:07 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Bigtime hybrid user here.

Railguns are awesome and have been buffed considerably over the years. There is a reason that there are a lot of PvP railgun fleets after all. And PvP is MUCH harder than PvE.

If you are missing things as they are coming towards you then you are using the weapons all wrong.

Post your fit OP.

How did you Veterans start?
Brigadine Ferathine
Presumed Dead Enterprises
Against ALL Authorities.
#37 - 2014-12-08 06:42:27 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Bigtime hybrid user here.

Railguns are awesome and have been buffed considerably over the years. There is a reason that there are a lot of PvP railgun fleets after all. And PvP is MUCH harder than PvE.

If you are missing things as they are coming towards you then you are using the weapons all wrong.

Post your fit OP.

I am not putting my fit on an open board sorry.
James Baboli
Warp to Pharmacy
#38 - 2014-12-08 08:09:12 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
ShahFluffers wrote:
Bigtime hybrid user here.

Railguns are awesome and have been buffed considerably over the years. There is a reason that there are a lot of PvP railgun fleets after all. And PvP is MUCH harder than PvE.

If you are missing things as they are coming towards you then you are using the weapons all wrong.

Post your fit OP.

I am not putting my fit on an open board sorry.

Then your fit is either FAR FAR too shiny, or you know it will be torn to shreds because it is bad.

Talking more,

Flying crazier,

And drinking more

Making battleships worth the warp
Severnij Veter
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#39 - 2014-12-08 10:14:24 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Railguns have consistently gotten nerfed in and since odyssey. Large rails I will use a megathron as an example. My ratting mega can miss with a midslot tracking computer and a low slot tracking computer combined with the ships tracking bonus. How does a ship miss another battleship in its optimal with all skills at maximum? This is not ok. Galentee has taken some big nerf hits from CCP on drones too. They took away my rails and drones. All I have left is my bag of rocks. The story is the same for the ships with small and mediums too.

Railguns already have the disadvantage of not being able to change damage types or use external tracking(target painters). As far as I am concerned CCP has nerfed us right out of the same.


Aye, same story

"I would rather die a thousand deaths than surrender".

General Robert E. Lee.
Tineoidea Asanari
Perkone
Caldari State
#40 - 2014-12-08 11:17:41 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
He didn't say my tread was bad he just said my claim about target painters wasn't true. It doesn't make my other points irrelevant. Hybrids are still damage type locked have horrible midrange among other things.


So why exactly don't you use Target Painters now that you know how awesome they are? Also, I was not able to not hit NPC battleships on optimal range from my very bad skilled megathron right now. And I really have only crappy gunnery skills.
What might be a part of the problem is your alliance - Volition Cult are living in Providence, arent they? The rats there are Sansha, if they apply tracking disrupt on you, dont wonder that you dont hit anymore. Switching to Blaster and Webs might be the way to go here, as tracking disruption is some really effective ewar.


On the other hand, thanks for posting that railguns and drones are underpowered. That gave me many laughs, as those are the most used weapons in any kind of content in EVE. Weapons that need a facelifting are the close range lasers, which they get in the next patch and drones might be a little bit overpowered right now.
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