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Did My Mackinaw Just Kill A Catalyst? I'm Confused.
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Dumbledorf Slackbrain
Doomheim
#1 - 2014-12-01 01:33:21 UTC
OK, here's the setting: Three accounts, three computers, one Mackinaw, two Covetors all busily mining away in a .06 asteroid belt. I'd lost a Covetor to a loony tunes suicide ganker long enough so that my kill right was expired, hence the Mackinaw. I missed this guy when he showed up in Local but not when he popped up in my asteroid belt. I launched fifteen Hammerhead 2's, target locked but did not attack, figured he might just fade and I didn't want Concorde to get all weird about it. But then he opened up on my Mack, I loosed the Hammerheads on him, Concord showed up, he blew up, my Mack was in a helluva mess but not dead and salvage ships came out of nowhere I guess anticipating a Mackinaw feast. I thought Concorde claimed the kill but then later on I noted on ZKill I was credited with the kill. Can you actually get kill rights on somebody you just killed? And yes, I do have kill rights on this guy. I always figured if I got a PvP kill it would be by accident, and this isn't that far off.
Ned Thomas
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2014-12-01 01:40:32 UTC
To the best of my knowledge, you get a kill right in hisec the moment someone commits a criminal act against you. I could be wrong on that. Also, so long as you do damage to someone and they die, then you'll show up on a killmail. If the only other entities on the killmail are NPC's, you'll be credited with the kill. Again, I could be wrong on that.
Lugia3
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2014-12-01 01:44:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugia3
1) You got killrights on him because he attacked you illegally in highsec.

2) Don't sit there and wait for him to engage or warp out. It's a 5 million isk ship that is 100% expendable. He is not going to warp out if you drop drones. Warp yourself out when you see him on d-scan.

3) CONCORD Police Commander is an npc. If you shoot someone who dies to npc's, last player who affected the target gets the killmail.

"CCP Dolan is full of shit." - CCP Bettik
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#4 - 2014-12-01 01:56:45 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
First off... props to you for playing smart and active. You saved your Mackinaw by doing this.

Second... you are confusing kill rights versus aggression rules.


Kills rights only occur when someone kills you in empire space (either in high or low-sec). With this kill right you can turn your attacker "suspect status" anytime over the course of 30 days (which means anyone can attack him/her anytime, anywhere). However, if this person is already an "outlaw" (has a security status lower then -5.0) this won't really affect him/her because he/she is already "kill on sight" to everyone, anywhere.
You can also sell this kill right to anyone who wants it (either for money or for free).

Aggression rules are more or less "of the moment" mechanics. If someone attacks you without a war declaration in high-sec, they have "aggressed" and you (along with everyone else in the area) are allowed to engage with impunity.


Lastly... even if CONCORD eventually intervened against someone you were fighting off, you will still be registered as taking part in the kill.
Though... from the sound of it... it is very possible that you killed your assailant before CONCORD could respond and that is why the NPCs don't show up on it.

edit: CONCORD shows up on the killmail on the EVE-kill boards.
And that ganker looks like he was betting on stupid (which the OP has shown he isn't completely). Tech 2 guns, Void ammo, Tech 2 Mag Stabs, damage rigs... the guy probably put out ~8,800 damage (680dps x 13 seconds) before he was nuked.
That is enough damage to only take out an anti-tanked Mackinaw... not a tanked or even a plain untanked one. What?

I suggest you really tank your barges for next time OP. This humiliation may not go unanswered. Lol

How did you Veterans start?
John E Normus
New Order Logistics
CODE.
#5 - 2014-12-01 02:05:39 UTC
You did good bro. Congratulations on your first pvp kill!

Between Ignorance and Wisdom
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#6 - 2014-12-01 03:09:25 UTC
The fact that your Mackinaw "was in a helluva mess" from just one Catalyst already means that you're doing something terribly wrong. But why worry about putting defensive modules on your ship, when CCP can just nerf ganking/buff CONCORD some more instead?

Congrats on getting a kill mail and everything, but you really should look into ways of not making this a problem to begin with.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
Hal Morsh
Doomheim
#7 - 2014-12-01 03:25:30 UTC
I had an omen navy issue open fire on my barge. He forgot to activate his killright though, that I got from shooting one of his abandoned "blue" wrecks. So he got Concorded and I got a killmail and some lewts.

Funny stuff happens in eve, always keep your eyes open for it.

Oh, I perfectly understand, Hal Morsh — a mission like this requires courage, skill, and heroism… qualities you are clearly lacking. Have you forgotten you're one of the bloody immortals!?
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#8 - 2014-12-01 03:30:42 UTC
Ganked once. Didn't buy a permit.

Goes to be ganked twice. Still didn't buy a permit.

I guess three times will be the charm eh?

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Dumbledorf Slackbrain
Doomheim
#9 - 2014-12-01 04:31:45 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Ganked once. Didn't buy a permit.

Goes to be ganked twice. Still didn't buy a permit.

I guess three times will be the charm eh?


You read it wrong: Successfully Ganked once, no permit. Second Gank did not work out all that well for Mr. Ganker, he's dead and I'm not. Third time? Yeah, it's gonna be fun. I'm gonna keep it clean and not repeat what I told the guy what he could do with his permit.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#10 - 2014-12-01 04:56:24 UTC
Dumbledorf Slackbrain wrote:
I'm gonna keep it clean and not repeat what I told the guy what he could do with his permit.

*grabs popcorn*

I look forward to your future appearance in the Crime and Punishment forums. Blink

How did you Veterans start?
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#11 - 2014-12-01 05:09:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Sabriz Adoudel
Dumbledorf Slackbrain wrote:
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Ganked once. Didn't buy a permit.

Goes to be ganked twice. Still didn't buy a permit.

I guess three times will be the charm eh?


You read it wrong: Successfully Ganked once, no permit. Second Gank did not work out all that well for Mr. Ganker, he's dead and I'm not. Third time? Yeah, it's gonna be fun. I'm gonna keep it clean and not repeat what I told the guy what he could do with his permit.


I look forward to more productive negotiations about your CODE compliance in future.

Antimatter (or Void) negotiations.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#12 - 2014-12-01 05:54:20 UTC
Dumbledorf Slackbrain wrote:

You read it wrong: Successfully Ganked once, no permit. Second Gank did not work out all that well for Mr. Ganker, he's dead and I'm not. Third time? Yeah, it's gonna be fun. I'm gonna keep it clean and not repeat what I told the guy what he could do with his permit.

Set your overview up so you can see their sec status. If they are below -5 sec status you can fire first and not wait. Of course that means concord doesn't intervene.... So you probably want a Skiff in that case. At which point you should get some fun.
Liafcipe9000
Critically Preposterous
#13 - 2014-12-01 06:20:05 UTC
> fifteen hammerheads

wat.










srsly wat.
Destiny Corrupted
Deadly Viper Kitten Mitten Sewing Company
Senpai's Afterschool Anime and Gaming Club
#14 - 2014-12-01 06:24:41 UTC
He had 3 barges on grid.

I wrote some true EVE stories! And no, they're not of the generic "my 0.0 alliance had lots of 0.0 fleets and took a lot of 0.0 space" sort. Check them out here:

https://truestories.eveonline.com/users/2074-destiny-corrupted
ForTheEmpire2014
Doomheim
#15 - 2014-12-01 07:09:51 UTC
I got to attack an obelisk with a proc, he was suspect and being mauled by an ishtar and pinned by an aries. lucky me:)
Oh, and probably bad to be flying your freighter around when you have a kill-right on you.
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#16 - 2014-12-01 10:45:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Ocih
Liafcipe9000 wrote:
> fifteen hammerheads

wat.










srsly wat.



I usually go with Macki/ Proc/ Proc or Skiff/ Proc/ proc so it's 15 Hob II's but the Proc tank is 250% of a Macki and Skiff is 300% so the Hobs still do their job.
Bagatur I
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#17 - 2014-12-01 12:11:12 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:

Kills rights only occur when someone kills you in empire space (either in high or low-sec).


That is not true!
Serene Repose
#18 - 2014-12-01 12:17:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Serene Repose
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
I look forward to more productive negotiations about your CODE compliance in future.
Antimatter (or Void) negotiations.
Ever hear of the Moonies? You guys missed with the name...CODE (ugh), and Moonie is so....EVE-like.
You guys should get together.

We must accommodate the idiocracy.
Mistah Ewedynao
Ice Axe Psycho Killers
#19 - 2014-12-01 15:44:30 UTC
Serene Repose wrote:
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
I look forward to more productive negotiations about your CODE compliance in future.
Antimatter (or Void) negotiations.
Ever hear of the Moonies? You guys missed with the name...CODE (ugh), and Moonie is so....EVE-like.
You guys should get together.



Moonies, Goonies, CODE'ies

Pretty much all the same........Tools

Nerf Goons

Nuke em from orbit....it's the only way to be sure.
Medalyn Isis
Doomheim
#20 - 2014-12-01 15:59:37 UTC
Yeah you killed him, can see the kill on zkill; well done. Now we shall all laugh at the fail ganker Snigie Audanie. Keep doing the lords work Dumbledorf.
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