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Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
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Features already available in other MMOs that EVE doesnt have.

First post
Author
Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
#21 - 2014-11-26 01:22:10 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Poje wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
nope.. It goes agaisnt eve concept of consequence. On a game where your reputation is the most important asset and scamming is allowed you cannot allow name changes.


To counter that, they could make available the past infos like they do for Corp history, like : "Formely known as...."


This has proposed in the past. The problem lies in name recognition.

If I am leery of someone (or am told to be leery of someone), I should to be able to ID that person right away just from their name. Having to check the bio of everyone I meet just to make sure I know who they are (and by extension, what they are capable of) would be extremely tedious and time consuming... things I can't usually afford when I am hunting or being hunted by people.


I think that if you had that pilot in your contact and/or watchlists, then that would mitigate much of the "name recognition" problems.

My freighter pilot has many known gankers and their scouts in her contact lists, all labled with the moniker "A**hole Ganker" complete with a super negative rating. This is, of course, no insult intended to the player behind the gankship, but it's a personal note for me to pay attention should one of those show up in local.

If I put FOLLOWTHECODE ORDIE in my lists on one day and lable it properly, and two months later I'm scouting for my freighter and Veldspar Queen shows up in local, but has an angry red minus sign and is labled "A**hole Ganker", then I might try rerouting my freighter. I also might kill Queenie and ask questions later, but maybe Queenie was just recently purchased... maybe not. Such is EvE. So there will still be room for conflicts, choices, and consequenses.

--Gadget

Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist

Given an hour to save New Eden, how would respected scientist, Albertus Eisenstein compose his thoughts? "Fifty-five minutes to define the problem; save the galaxy in five."

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
Infinite Pew
#22 - 2014-11-26 01:51:37 UTC
Gadget Helmsdottir wrote:
I think that if you had that pilot in your contact and/or watchlists, then that would mitigate much of the "name recognition" problems.

That doesn't really work when...

- you are trying to decide whether or not you want to engage a specific player (or Fleet Commander**) that you would otherwise wish to avoid altogether. And that decision usually can't take more than a second or two.

- you have dozens of people from many different places (and all utilizing different tactics) set red for the above reason.


**NOTE: even if you see a group of people whom you know that a certain FC is affiliated with... it does not mean that they are always following that person. Many groups have different FCs with some being MUCH better than others.
Many times I have seen the same fleet behave in completely different ways depending on who is running it... going from "this will be EASY" to "Jesus Christ, RUN FOR IT!"

Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
#23 - 2014-11-26 02:14:28 UTC
Poje wrote:
Name change : Simple, be able to change the name of a toon.

I can see allowing this once and once only for a character that is less than 1 year old. After that one change, or after the year then no way.


Poje wrote:
- Character revamp : Change the race and sex of a toon.

I agree with the others no, you formed a character and you have to live with it.

Poje wrote:
- Skill respec : Be able to respec your skills! (Simple, just put all your SPs in a bank and reassign them where u want in your skills)

NO, and by the way did I say NO already, if not then NO.
You made choices in how you wanted to train your character and you have to live with them.
If you want a major change then start a new character or buy one that has the skills you want.

Poje wrote:
All those features could be available for a fee and im sure many players would be willing to pay for it.

We do not care about what other games do, we care about EVE and in EVE these things are not allowed for a large number of reasons many of them already posted.
Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
#24 - 2014-11-26 02:14:40 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Gadget Helmsdottir wrote:
I think that if you had that pilot in your contact and/or watchlists, then that would mitigate much of the "name recognition" problems.

That doesn't really work when...

- you are trying to decide whether or not you want to engage a specific player (or Fleet Commander**) that you would otherwise wish to avoid altogether. And that decision usually can't take more than a second or two.


That's partly the pilot's fault for having improper intelligence. Either the pilot needs to fire her G2 and get someone else to better prepare her pilot recognition files, or she needs to take a risk...

Quote:
- you have dozens of people from many different places (and all utilizing different tactics) set red for the above reason.


Labels fix this. The notebook also helps. In a hairball, take risks...

Quote:

**NOTE: even if you see a group of people whom you know that a certain FC is affiliated with... it does not mean that they are always following that person. Many groups have different FCs with some being MUCH better than others.
Many times I have seen the same fleet behave in completely different ways depending on who is running it... going from "this will be EASY" to "Jesus Christ, RUN FOR IT!"


Then look for the pilots' patterns. Humans are more responsive to movement patterns than names anyway. It's how we're wired. You are more likely to see the pattern and understand that Joe Schmoe is probably leading that group faster than the reverse.




Look, I understand that in certain circumstances, an enemy's name change might mess up a pilot's finely tuned machine of target aquisition and removal. Good. Then name changes can become a weapon. We can currently rename ships to sow confusion on D-Scan for those with no time to do their homework. This is the same thing.

--Gadget

Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist

Given an hour to save New Eden, how would respected scientist, Albertus Eisenstein compose his thoughts? "Fifty-five minutes to define the problem; save the galaxy in five."

Irya Boone
The Scope
#25 - 2014-11-26 02:33:05 UTC
I would say no to all of them except for the skill respec

It would be nice To Give player 1 respec but give it only after 6 month of playing , in order to Help new player who had made terrible choices in the begining because of lack of informations.

like mining , ..;rushing Battleships , big guns etc etc

CCP it's time to remove Off Grid Boost and Put Them on Killmail too, add Logi on killmails .... Open that damn door !!

you shall all bow and pray BoB

Poje
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2014-11-26 16:20:15 UTC
Thx guys for posting and i agree with some of your statements, but the main problem i have with players opposed to any of the features i proposed is this :

This is EVE.


Nothing i have proposed is complicated or would unbalance the game in any way, its just offering features that should be already available.

Don't forget that we already have Clones, Neural remaps, trading of Characters and buying of ingame money with RL money, lol.



Thx.
Tabyll Altol
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#27 - 2014-11-26 16:35:36 UTC
Poje wrote:
For me, EVE is the best MMO of all time and thats why ive been playing it for almost 8 years now!

But yesterday, i was checking to change the name of one of my alts and i noticed that it wasnt an available feature. I was very surprised since in other MMOs i played, it was.

So here are 3 features i've seen in other MMOs that would be great to have in EVE :

- Name change : Simple, be able to change the name of a toon.


- Character revamp : Change the race and sex of a toon.


- Skill respec : Be able to respec your skills! (Simple, just put all your SPs in a bank and reassign them where u want in your skills)


All those features could be available for a fee and im sure many players would be willing to pay for it.



Thx.


Deal with your decisions (1/3) and the skills in eve i like learning in rl if your good at math you can´t just say now i won´t be good at math anymore but i´m now better at english and now can speak russian. If you wanna a skill respec go play some other games. This feature should never, ever come to eve (expept you loose 99% of your skillpoints, would be fine with that).

-1

And your the ******** search feature before you post.
Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2014-11-26 16:43:43 UTC
Poje wrote:
Thx guys for posting and i agree with some of your statements, but the main problem i have with players opposed to any of the features i proposed is this :

This is EVE.


Nothing i have proposed is complicated or would unbalance the game in any way, its just offering features that should be already available.

Don't forget that we already have Clones, Neural remaps, trading of Characters and buying of ingame money with RL money, lol.



Thx.


All of the proposals have been done to death in the forums before and shot down in roaring flames. I'm also against being able to trade characters but that's already too embedded probably...
Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
#29 - 2014-11-26 17:54:57 UTC
Sounds like the typical WoW kid response to giving Eve a go for about 2 seconds before logging off to ***** on the forums about how (in the words of the great Henry Bowers) "this bum fight ain't done right."

"Tomahawks?"

"----in' A, right?"

"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."

"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."

DaeHan Minhyok
Logical Outcomes
#30 - 2014-11-26 18:08:07 UTC
Poje wrote:
For me, EVE is the best MMO of all time and thats why ive been playing it for almost 8 years now!

But yesterday, i was checking to change the name of one of my alts and i noticed that it wasnt an available feature. I was very surprised since in other MMOs i played, it was.

So here are 3 features i've seen in other MMOs that would be great to have in EVE :

- Name change : Simple, be able to change the name of a toon.


- Character revamp : Change the race and sex of a toon.


- Skill respec : Be able to respec your skills! (Simple, just put all your SPs in a bank and reassign them where u want in your skills)


All those features could be available for a fee and im sure many players would be willing to pay for it.



Thx.


How could you have played this game for so long and suggest ideas this contradictory to the essence of what eve is?
Komi Toran
Perkone
Caldari State
#31 - 2014-11-26 18:23:19 UTC
WoW currently has a deal where you automatically level to 90. Eve needs a deal where new characters automatically gain 100,000,000 SP.

Damn, I could have sworn this time it would be the right thread...
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#32 - 2014-11-26 18:48:18 UTC
Poje wrote:
Thx guys for posting and i agree with some of your statements, but the main problem i have with players opposed to any of the features i proposed is this :

This is EVE.


Nothing i have proposed is complicated or would unbalance the game in any way, its just offering features that should be already available.

Don't forget that we already have Clones, Neural remaps, trading of Characters and buying of ingame money with RL money, lol.



Thx.


if you really believe this then you havent been acknowledging posts and arent sincerely open to feed back.

- recognising people by name is important. Making that ability to recognise other players anymore complicated or time consuming than reading a single line of letters is going to be horrible. dont do it.

Name changing has already been discussed to death.

- changing your avatar is fine. its not a widely used means of recognition and you can already change apparel and pose at will.

- skill respecs are one of the worst ideas you could have. In other games you have a limit to what you can have trained, so respeccing is probably the only way you can change how your characters works, and it will also likely be the only way to try everything at least once because having skill-A trained means you cannot train skill-B and/or skill-C takes up a large proportion of your limited skill potential.

EVE has a completely different way of skilling and you have an unlimited amount of potential SP. In EVE if you want to start an entirely new career and take your char in a different direction you can at any time, there is no hard limit to your training that would warrant a re-spec. There is no point in EVE where skill-A prevents you from training skill-B and skill-C can take as much training as it likes because you have an unlimited supply of SP.

skill respecs are not required with EVE's skill system, and as they'd just enables FOTM style gameplay, its probably more interesting without it anyways.

TL:DR

-no
-yes
-no

Quote:
How could you have played this game for so long and suggest ideas this contradictory to the essence of what eve is?


perhaps he hasnt gotten into the whole 'meta' thing. maybes hes recently bought the char.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Helios Panala
#33 - 2014-11-26 20:01:12 UTC
I'm not totally adverse to these suggestions, not as vanity options though but as part of a possible expansion of espionage/counter-espionage.
Burner clones with new names, falsified histories and a different appearance. Possibly with some small amount of SP moved around to aid the deception. I'm not really into the whole spying/awoxing thing but it does seem like an area of the game that could use some attention, if only as an attempt to make espionage more game based and less meta-game based.
Poje
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2014-11-26 21:05:30 UTC
Sobaan Tali wrote:
Sounds like the typical WoW kid response to giving Eve a go for about 2 seconds before logging off to ***** on the forums about how (in the words of the great Henry Bowers) "this bum fight ain't done right."


In January, i will have 8 years done in EVE and i have 15 years of MMO experience.

If you guys opened your eyes to what is ALREADY going on in this game, you would know that all the features i proposed will be there in the futur.

Just a matter of time.
Bullet Therapist
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#35 - 2014-11-26 21:25:45 UTC
Poje wrote:
Sobaan Tali wrote:
Sounds like the typical WoW kid response to giving Eve a go for about 2 seconds before logging off to ***** on the forums about how (in the words of the great Henry Bowers) "this bum fight ain't done right."


In January, i will have 8 years done in EVE and i have 15 years of MMO experience.

If you guys opened your eyes to what is ALREADY going on in this game, you would know that all the features i proposed will be there in the futur.

Just a matter of time.


Don't be so sure. I don't think that we'll ever see the ability to change a character name, given it's importance as an intel too and the potential for abuse.

If there's ever an ability to redistribute SP, and I'm not sure we ever will, it will probably be severely limited, with only a small proportion of your SP being re-allocatable.
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#36 - 2014-11-26 21:58:55 UTC
Just because a feature is convenient and popular doesn't mean it's good for a game. Most of those features that almost every MMO has but EVE doesn't are actually one of the many nails in the coffin that make those games very short-lived. Not just many of them, MOST of them. Examples of what makes MMOs fail are abundant and abundantly clear but game designers choose to ignore these details in favor of get-rich-quick schemes in which they count on players to fail to realize that the games they are investing heavily in are going to suck really quick. Apparently, it works.

It all boils down to one continuing mistake: the game revolves around giving the player a problem and allowing them to seek a solution. The fun is in giving the player enough tools to work with but without solving the problem for them. The players who are stumped always run to the forums and other chat media to beg for easy solutions and/or scorn the game for presenting difficult problems. The real measure of a game is in how determined the players are to solve these problems, but game designers will, time and time again, listen to the beggars and scorners. It's when the game designers start playing the game for the players that everyone loses their reason to log in anymore.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."

Doddy
Excidium.
#37 - 2014-11-26 22:49:40 UTC
Name change and character respec re sex and race is stupid and not in keeping with eve lore. Skill respec would be fine so long as sp was lost in the process.
Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
#38 - 2014-11-27 05:17:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Gadget Helmsdottir
Doddy wrote:
Name change and character respec re sex and race is stupid and not in keeping with eve lore. Skill respec would be fine so long as sp was lost in the process.



What?

I'm pretty sure you're completely backwards here.

People don't want name changes to be allowed, because they claim they will lose a source of instant intelligence. What lore does changing one's name go against?

This smacks of being too complacent if you ask me. RL Navies follow the careers of enemy and ally officers above a certain rank. However, it's up to their Intellegence departments to guess if a certain ship actually is being commanded by Captain So-and-so. This isn't a perfect science, guessing is the key word here. Asking your allies might work wonders, but asking the enemy -- or just a rival -- for up to date Captains Lists doesn't work. So, your Intelligence department keeps tabs on your rivals at the same time as trying to hide your own Navy's lists.

In game, this translates to keeping good notes. Use the tools provided in game, such as contact lists, labels, watchlists, and the lovely notepad. Use out of game resources like you might for anything else. If name changes were to be implemented tomorrow, you know damned well that within a day of implementation, someone will have a website that lists every name change purchaced with both the old name and new name listed. Also, use the social aspect of the game. Tell your allies that Pilot So-and-so is now known as Pilot Newname. Information is power. Sell that info if you like. Lie if you must. But above all... work for the intel.

If all else fails, and you still aren't sure about a pilot, because of lack of intel, improper briefing, or lack of time to make a decision, then do what real commanders have done since the history of naval warefare... take a risk. IRL, a commander has no real way of getting 100% accuracy of who's in command of another vessel. That enemy captain may have been recently transferred, the intel could be just plain wrong, maybe the commander was killed in action by an earlier attack. No, there's no real way of knowing for absolute sure who's in charge over there... minus two: realtime onboard spies, and pattern recognition. Both of these are availble in game already.

If a pilot does her homework and has decent intel channels, then there should be no serious change in playing the game for the most part. Good note-work will become muscle memory. Perhaps new careers could arise -- set someone up as the corp or alliance Intelligence Officer. Actually, I would be suprised if this isn't already in place. Someone vetts new recruits and looks for spies; therefore, most large entities already have a counter-intel department. Use them.

Now, for all that "loss" of intel, you have pilots that cannot correct past mistakes. I hate seeing a non-capitalized name! They cannot make a purchaced character their own. They aren't allowed to grow up or change interests. And I hear, "A player needs to live with her mistakes!" and "Make the right choice the first time!" If a player can gets suckered by a market or contracts scam, they can bounce back from that... even learn from it. Misspelling your name, or having a change of heart three years in isn't a reason to damn a player to have a wonky named (or looking) pilot. No. This change is completely cosmetic, and because it disturbs the complacency of a few rather loud pilots it gets shouted over.

Sex and Race change... Once again, what lore does this go against. Are Caldari are still Gallente, and what are the Minmatar... Amarr subjects or no?

No, if a pilot can stick her experiences in a new body just for ease of travel (Jump Clones) then just making the plumbing different in the new body would be a breeze. And, I'm sure that an idividual can change nationality or her name if they have enough resources and clout. Immortal pod-pilots have both. In all three cases, the EvE beauracracy would carry notes of any changes in the pilot's biometrics and history for all to see at a glance.

Skill re-allotment, however, does go against everything that is EvE. The first two things are cosmetic, and only matter to a few individuals. Skills are the meat of EvE, and the formula that CCP uses, even with its tweaks, is part of what makes EvE such a worthwile game. Allowing skill realocation, or a skill pool, would just make EvE pay to win, because those willing to pay the cash would have a severe advantage in versitility.

Worse yet, having the correct skill set up would become an expectation. And those unwilling or unable to shell out RL cash in order to tailor their character for the moment would be left in the dust to those who will. The nature of the game would change, and not for the better IMO.

--Gadget

Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist

Given an hour to save New Eden, how would respected scientist, Albertus Eisenstein compose his thoughts? "Fifty-five minutes to define the problem; save the galaxy in five."

Antillie Sa'Kan
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#39 - 2014-11-27 05:44:52 UTC
Poje wrote:
If you guys opened your eyes to what is ALREADY going on in this game, you would know that all the features i proposed will be there in the futur.

Just a matter of time.

[Citation Needed]
Adrie Atticus
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#40 - 2014-11-27 09:34:57 UTC
Poje wrote:
Thx guys for posting and i agree with some of your statements, but the main problem i have with players opposed to any of the features i proposed is this :

This is EVE.


Nothing i have proposed is complicated or would unbalance the game in any way, its just offering features that should be already available.

Don't forget that we already have Clones, Neural remaps, trading of Characters and buying of ingame money with RL money, lol.



Thx.


Changing character names would be almost a clean slate to a lot of people. If you're doing bad things then your name reflects that, most people know who Cannibal Kane is and take his "oh well, looks like I have to wardec you" as a promise of fun times instead of empty blabber.

Neural remaps/character recustomization are available.

SP reset is the dumbest idea possible and is akin to "Respec to another class" in your favourite MMO (WoW) instead of just being a talent respec in your favourite MMO (WoW).

Either all of these have been discussed to death, are stupid or still born.