Intergalactic Summit

I wouldn't worry about it, Gwen. We're clearly so far away from healthy here as to make the point moot.

The man comes to a forum for citizens of the cluster to compare notes and opinions for the reason of suggesting it would do it's job better if nobody spoke.

Yes, we just have different opinions about the value of an outsider's opinion on certain issues. I am more than willing to discuss a wide variety of topics in a public forum with those outside the Federation - but our internal politics and failures is not one of them. In order for someone to assess whether we have followed our ideals, the person in question must actually hold to those ideals. I would not pipe in on a discussion about what it means to be Caldari. In the same vein, I do not hold put any worth to the opinions of outsiders about what it means to follow our ideals.

If you would reread my post, Mister Tomas, I believe you will observe that I never criticized the Federation at all. I praised it, in fact. Further, if you would read earlier in the thread, you will notice I have done the same several times already. And I understand and even somewhat agree with your statement that it can be useless and even self-destructive to discuss ideological failings with someone who fundamentally doesn't understand your ideals.

However, if anything, the only thing I criticized was you, and in the gentlest way possible - I was trying to give you a little friendly advice about how you might avoid starting another argument. If what you meant was that you don't want to hear a foreigners opinion about anything, then I might accuse you of being a bit of a xenophobe.

Your first mistake is to assume that the summit is a place of good discussion and that all topics have not been debated, hashed, and eventually devolved into shouting matches.

The point about up holding other peoples views and their creeds goes to a point but I highly doubt the founders of our society would be ok with us saying to the Amarr "Well it's their way" or to the Sansha "at least they are happy" especially when they have been known to take our citizens and force those chains on them. I bet most Minmatar will also say that they are happier now than reduced to children due to Vitoxin.

The cluster changes, the Gallente change with it to deal with new challenges and even create some of our own such as the rogue drones. But, instead of just sitting by, becoming isolationist and stagnate at the expense of the next Amarr conquest due to their religion, the Caldari slipping more and more into a trade war instead of open army against army warfare....and never mind the constant dangers from the pirates such as the weakened Sansha and Blood Raiders, we must remain proactive and at the very least and raise voices to harshness and injustice.

Invite with open arms and a soft voice but carry a big stick.

Indeed. The Sotiyo-Urbaata Drive, stargate research, the monumental strides made before the collapse of the Criellere Project - these are testimony to the fact that any time the minds of the Federation and the State work together, rather than against each other, there is no limit to what we can accomplish.

It's one of the reasons I advocate peace between our peoples. If we didn't have to fight each other, we could fight genuine threats to the stability and prosperity of the cluster like the Serpentis, the Guristas and the Sanshas - together, we'd be almost unstoppable.

Behold the Gallentean who laments his loss of the proverbial fig leaf during an open discussion about the faults of the Federation. Give him a strobe-lit room with opiates and writhing bodies and he would forget that modesty were ever a word.


I am not surprised, in the least.

Would you mind telling that to, say, purely hypothetically, just an example off the top of my head here... other Amarrians?

Starve a donkey, then wave a carrot at it. Have you forced it to walk towards you, or merely encouraged it? And are you or are you not being cruel?

Donkeys being as strong as they are, the rope might realistically be classified as "encouragement" as well.

But let's not overextend the metaphor here: the point I'm trying to make is that there is no such thing as forcing somebody to do something: There is only "encouraging" them so strongly that the alternatives become more than they are willing to bear. So for the purposes of this conversation, that's what I will intend the word "forced" to mean whenever I use it, okay?

Just to overextend the metaphore here; what about vitoxin that makes many people simply do what they are told; almost like in a child-like or brain dead state?