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Intergalactic Summit

 
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First Arek'Jaalan Symposium : Restructuring & Leadership - YC116-YC117
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Ollie Rundle
#161 - 2014-11-06 11:44:21 UTC
Gehen Sealbreaker wrote:
Anslo wrote:
Gehen Sealbreaker wrote:

Anslo wrote:
Huola Coalition fully withdraws any and all offers of assistance, fleet support and/or otherwise, to this project as it stands.


Who?


You're going to regret this.


((OOC : Above exchange simplified due to limitations on nested quotes - 2 intermediate replies omitted))

Anslo wrote:
Aaaand items submitted.

I said you'd regret it. And this is only the opening act! Just wait for the real show to start rocking the cluster.


Did... did you helped in delivering these items, potentially opening a Pandora's Box, because I mocked what I perceived as self-importance on your part?

I was quite expecting gatecamps, pointless shows of military superiority over my non-combatant associates, but this...
I need to think about this.

*troubled voice recording* Mr. Themachine, this first step of the Symposium is overdue... Perhaps we should get this discussion back on track, and, well, proceed...


If you bait a bear be prepared for it to bite.

Well done, Anslo. If nothing else, you've made things interesting.
Anslo
Scope Works
#162 - 2014-11-06 12:56:21 UTC
Eran Mintor wrote:
Shaera Taam wrote:

While I tend to respect and admire you, Anslo, as a man of decisive action, I find it hard to admire anyone who would put so many lives in danger for no other reason than a pique of spite.


Clearly you haven't seen how he flies.

-Eran

Edit: Also who is the Huola Coaltion? I've never heard of such a thing either.

Ask yourself how you didn't take Huola a few months ago.

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Foley Aberas Jones
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#163 - 2014-11-06 13:25:58 UTC
Eran Mintor wrote:
Shaera Taam wrote:

While I tend to respect and admire you, Anslo, as a man of decisive action, I find it hard to admire anyone who would put so many lives in danger for no other reason than a pique of spite.


Clearly you haven't seen how he flies.

-Eran.


Clearly you haven't removed that stick from your ass
Gwen Ikiryo
Alexylva Paradox
#164 - 2014-11-06 14:36:08 UTC
Gehen Sealbreaker wrote:
Did... did you helped in delivering these items, potentially opening a Pandora's Box, because I mocked what I perceived as self-importance on your part?

I was quite expecting gatecamps, pointless shows of military superiority over my non-combatant associates, but this...
I need to think about this.

*troubled voice recording* Mr. Themachine, this first step of the Symposium is overdue... Perhaps we should get this discussion back on track, and, well, proceed...


Mister Sealbreaker,

I really wouldn't let yourself fret too much about it - If he hadn't done it first, someone certainly would have, as I said. Neither his motives nor the act itself will have any ultimate effect on the final state of the situation.

What I would suggest is most important thing to work towards now is damage control, and to investigate Dr. Tukoss's circumstances and motives. I would suggest that attempting to firmly establish the common link because the systems he listed in his statement would be a good start, and fairly suitable towards the projects capabilities.
Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#165 - 2014-11-06 14:57:22 UTC
Gwen Ikiryo wrote:
Gehen Sealbreaker wrote:
Did... did you helped in delivering these items, potentially opening a Pandora's Box, because I mocked what I perceived as self-importance on your part?

I was quite expecting gatecamps, pointless shows of military superiority over my non-combatant associates, but this...
I need to think about this.

*troubled voice recording* Mr. Themachine, this first step of the Symposium is overdue... Perhaps we should get this discussion back on track, and, well, proceed...


Mister Sealbreaker,

I really wouldn't let yourself fret too much about it - If he hadn't done it first, someone certainly would have, as I said. Neither his motives nor the act itself will have any ultimate effect on the final state of the situation.

What I would suggest is most important thing to work towards now is damage control, and to investigate Dr. Tukoss's circumstances and motives. I would suggest that attempting to firmly establish the common link because the systems he listed in his statement would be a good start, and fairly suitable towards the projects capabilities.


As I already said before, the body parts should be examined, a hypothesis of his intent should be drawn up and then a plan has to be put together for the worst case scenario. But so far all I'm seeing is finger-pointing instead of actual work being done.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#166 - 2014-11-06 16:38:52 UTC
Ollie Rundle wrote:

If you bait a bear be prepared for it to bite.

Well done, Anslo. If nothing else, you've made things interesting.


I did warn the good Doctor Sealbreaker that Anslo is more a man of reckless action than sedentary navel-gazing and words. He misunderstood my comments to be a simple criticism of his organisations combat record. The point is that when Anslo gets angry, these days, he seeks redress by undocking and doing things with ships, in space.

That could be shooting ships, sure, but it could also be exploding laboratory complexes, interdicting supply routes or delivering chunks of jovian into a container in open space.

We may make our living as combat pilots, but we aren't stupid. Anslo understood that Doctor Sealbreaker's ricebowl was measured contemplation and control. He took those things away.

I'm kinda proud, actually.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Anslo
Scope Works
#167 - 2014-11-06 16:45:11 UTC
You're making me blush Tuulinen~

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Ollie Rundle
#168 - 2014-11-06 16:47:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Ollie Rundle
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
I did warn the good Doctor Sealbreaker that Anslo is more a man of reckless action than sedentary navel-gazing and words. He misunderstood my comments to be a simple criticism of his organisations combat record. The point is that when Anslo gets angry, these days, he seeks redress by undocking and doing things with ships, in space.

That could be shooting ships, sure, but it could also be exploding laboratory complexes, interdicting supply routes or delivering chunks of jovian into a container in open space.

We may make our living as combat pilots, but we aren't stupid. Anslo understood that Doctor Sealbreaker's ricebowl was measured contemplation and control. He took those things away.

I'm kinda proud, actually.


At present, I remain unconvinced that Anslo's lesson has been fully absorbed. Time will tell one way or the other, I suppose.
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#169 - 2014-11-06 17:15:50 UTC
Anslo wrote:
You're making me blush Tuulinen~


Senpai noticed you?

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.
Anslo
Scope Works
#170 - 2014-11-06 17:38:21 UTC
Finally after all the time senpai noticed~~

[center]-_For the Proveldtariat_/-[/center]
Unit XS365BT
Unit Commune
#171 - 2014-11-08 22:24:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Unit XS365BT
While we have made our current stance regarding this symposium public via the Arek'Jaalan mailing list, it has been requested that we use this medium to reiterate the specifics of our position.

To that end, we have simplified our initial communication on this matter.

1) This symposium and it's stated intent stand in opposition to the initial and ongoing goals and intended structure of the Arek'Jaalan project. The attempt to create a single command node for the project, while taking command power out of the hands of the current division heads, should not be allowed to proceed.

2) As the Arek'Jaalan project was begun by Pilot Tukoss, we fail to see how either Pilot TheMachine or Pilot Sealbreaker have gained the authority to perform the actions this Symposium is suggesting.

3) As no official statement has been made regarding a potential change in leadership or structure by either pilot Tukoss or his current employers, we would suggest that any attempt at a hostile takeover of the project bears a high possibility of being classed as illegal, if so, this could cause Eifyr and Co to cease funding for Site One.

In conclusion,

We do not believe that this symposium has the authority required to demand or implement changes to the structure of Arek'Jaalan.

Neither pilot TheMachine or Sealbreaker have the authority to speak on behalf of the project as a whole. Yet the language used above could cause confusion in this matter.

Given the numbers involved in the project, the 15 votes stated in the OP is a negligible percentage of the total possible vote, .

We Return

Unit XS365BT. Designated Communications Officer. Unit Commune.
Mizhara Del'thul
Kyn'aldrnari
#172 - 2014-11-08 23:14:31 UTC
Knowing the people involved, the funding is readily available. Tukoss is currently a highly suspect fellow and anyone blindly following his lead needs a little primer in basic critical thought. Not to mention that any project involving capsuleers from every corner of New Eden, even in spite of rather obvious... unsavory affiliations, will be organized pretty much exactly how they themselves want it to be.

There's no "authority" involved in this project and there never was. If you can herd enough of these cats together, you might get something rolling but the amount of people who'll just fall in line to any "authority" can likely be counted on one hand.

Just let the vote show who falls into which camps, then let those camps do their own thing. You'll never manage to herd all the cats into one corral.
Eran Mintor
Metropolis Commercial Consortium
#173 - 2014-11-09 09:33:28 UTC
Who needs to herd cats when you have tuna?

-Eran
Jace Sarice
#174 - 2014-11-09 17:12:41 UTC
I have little interest in the project itself. But if there is a way I can benefit from it, I may be willing to assist with any required logistics.
Caviar Liberta
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#175 - 2014-11-10 15:03:37 UTC
Solecist Project wrote:
This screams for a long con with hostile takeover.
I suggest being well aware of who you let join your ranks.



No need to worry about such things.

*looks at something off camera*

There are measures put in place to prevent such things from happening.
Shae Mataar
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#176 - 2014-11-10 20:35:53 UTC
Unit XS365BT wrote:
While we have made our current stance regarding this symposium public via the Arek'Jaalan mailing list, it has been requested that we use this medium to reiterate the specifics of our position.

To that end, we have simplified our initial communication on this matter.

1) This symposium and it's stated intent stand in opposition to the initial and ongoing goals and intended structure of the Arek'Jaalan project. The attempt to create a single command node for the project, while taking command power out of the hands of the current division heads, should not be allowed to proceed.

2) As the Arek'Jaalan project was begun by Pilot Tukoss, we fail to see how either Pilot TheMachine or Pilot Sealbreaker have gained the authority to perform the actions this Symposium is suggesting.

3) As no official statement has been made regarding a potential change in leadership or structure by either pilot Tukoss or his current employers, we would suggest that any attempt at a hostile takeover of the project bears a high possibility of being classed as illegal, if so, this could cause Eifyr and Co to cease funding for Site One.

In conclusion,

We do not believe that this symposium has the authority required to demand or implement changes to the structure of Arek'Jaalan.

Neither pilot TheMachine or Sealbreaker have the authority to speak on behalf of the project as a whole. Yet the language used above could cause confusion in this matter.

Given the numbers involved in the project, the 15 votes stated in the OP is a negligible percentage of the total possible vote.

We Return


waitaminit

the opposition to finding some sort of tukoss-free structure to hanging these divisions on is... what, exactly?

from what i've seen, gehen and joe started this symposium to see if there was in interest in restarting the project without the weakness of having one man at the head. that's what it was. a weakness. and a proven one: tukoss disappeared and a'j died.

now is as good a time as any to step up, turn a critical eye on the original structure of a'j, and fix it.

i bring that which you fear the most

freedom

no matter what the price
Joe Themachine
Sleeper Tech. Research Foundation
#177 - 2014-11-11 07:06:59 UTC
Fellow A’Js. Thank you so much for your patience and for your awesome participation in part of the symposium. It is now time to vote on the proposals outlined herein.
I hereby call part 1 of the First Arek'Jaalan Symposium: Restructuring & Leadership - YC116-YC117 concluded, and call to order part 2 of the forum. Please visit to vote.

Voting Call: Part 2 of First Arek'Jaalan Symposium (YC 116/117)





OOC comment: Admin, please lock this thread.
Gehen Sealbreaker
Sealbreaker Labs
#178 - 2014-11-11 09:27:00 UTC
Shae Mataar wrote:
Unit XS365BT wrote:
While we have made our current stance regarding this symposium public via the Arek'Jaalan mailing list, it has been requested that we use this medium to reiterate the specifics of our position.

To that end, we have simplified our initial communication on this matter.

1) This symposium and it's stated intent stand in opposition to the initial and ongoing goals and intended structure of the Arek'Jaalan project. The attempt to create a single command node for the project, while taking command power out of the hands of the current division heads, should not be allowed to proceed.

2) As the Arek'Jaalan project was begun by Pilot Tukoss, we fail to see how either Pilot TheMachine or Pilot Sealbreaker have gained the authority to perform the actions this Symposium is suggesting.

3) As no official statement has been made regarding a potential change in leadership or structure by either pilot Tukoss or his current employers, we would suggest that any attempt at a hostile takeover of the project bears a high possibility of being classed as illegal, if so, this could cause Eifyr and Co to cease funding for Site One.

In conclusion,

We do not believe that this symposium has the authority required to demand or implement changes to the structure of Arek'Jaalan.

Neither pilot TheMachine or Sealbreaker have the authority to speak on behalf of the project as a whole. Yet the language used above could cause confusion in this matter.

Given the numbers involved in the project, the 15 votes stated in the OP is a negligible percentage of the total possible vote.

We Return


waitaminit

the opposition to finding some sort of tukoss-free structure to hanging these divisions on is... what, exactly?

from what i've seen, gehen and joe started this symposium to see if there was in interest in restarting the project without the weakness of having one man at the head. that's what it was. a weakness. and a proven one: tukoss disappeared and a'j died.

now is as good a time as any to step up, turn a critical eye on the original structure of a'j, and fix it.


It's good to see that some people get it.

Unit, I agree that the 15 votes Joe waited to start this was a low number, however there was no way of telling exactly how many people were still listenning. Some people discussing here arrived very late to the fray. (Some, like Julianus Soter, are still lost in self-contemplation.)
In the end, people were warned, and with nearly all former Division Leaders participating, there is no point denying the very real need for restructuration this project needs. Remember that if you want to keep the thiings as-is, simply vote against all proposed changes.

I understand that my language can make it seem that I have any authority over the project to outsiders, but I doubt any member of the project would be confused, and I have been clear at all times: I am the head of Project Astrosurvey of the Multidisciplinary Division, and a founding member of Arek'Jalaan. Nothing more. I take personnal stances such as this one because I see the greater picture, but if you disagree with me, it's no problem. This symposium was created with exactly this in mind: for every member of Arek'Jalaan to voice their opinion.

Caviar Liberta wrote:
No need to worry about such things.

*looks at something off camera*

There are measures put in place to prevent such things from happening.


Yes, I doubt Nation will make another attempt at convincing us they are on the same boat as us, after Citizen Arson's one.
Still, it's good to know that Moira. is still active. You were an important part of Arek'Jalaan, and the project still having your interest means a lot for it's future.
Joe Themachine
Sleeper Tech. Research Foundation
#179 - 2014-11-11 19:49:43 UTC
I have to yet again agree with Gehen. The simple way to keep everything as is is to vote everything down - not voting is silent agreement to the majority decision of the actual voters - it constitutes a mandate to continue.

Regarding the 15 vote mandate - there is no precedence or bylaw to draw on what constitutes a mandate threshold, so if you'd like to set a threshold for future mandates, please run for office, and create the rule with the council so that we don't run into this dilemma again.

Either way participating in the process is the way to go.

Thanks for your feedback. It's always welcome.
Ollie Rundle
#180 - 2014-11-12 14:54:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Ollie Rundle
Joe Themachine wrote:
I have to yet again agree with Gehen. The simple way to keep everything as is is to vote everything down - not voting is silent agreement to the majority decision of the actual voters - it constitutes a mandate to continue.


There is no option in your first section to 'vote everything down' just a choice between a 'general' council and a 'science' council. The former with a regulatory function, the latter with an advisory function.

Arek'Jaalan did not have either of these structures in the past. And as you have deliberately chosen to ignore/unilaterally reject the proposal to do away with an elected council tier - which would have more accurately reflected the original motivating goals of project - you have effectively drawn a line through 'keeping everything as is'.

Which is presumably why Unit has raised their concerns.

Anslo, The Antiquarian and others have effectively demonstrated the impotence and limitations of a top-heavy structure over-burdened by bureaucratic indecision. It seems a pity you weren't paying attention.