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[Rhea] Introducing the Bowhead

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Arronicus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#21 - 2014-11-10 11:21:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Arronicus
Catherine Laartii wrote:
Arronicus wrote:
Waha! Take that, tugboat! Bowhead is a much better name.

Unfortunately, as many predicted, the hp is sufficiently low that this is perfect for gankers. Paired with that speed bonus instead of an agility bonus, and maximum 3 fit battleships.... eh.... I think we're not going to see many bowheads at all.

It CAN fit DC, and since it doesn't need cargo expanders, you can fit bulkheads on it. Dunno about those mids tho...maybe chain ecm burst? Not sure of their hisec legality.


45625 hull with skills,123187 with 2 bulkheads 3 capital transverse bulkheads (tech 1, ofc), 60% resists from damage control. so, 308k hull EHP, plus the what, 50k ehp combined from shields and armor. Gives roughly the same tank as a freighter, at the expense of not being able to fit any agility mods except a 100mn mwd to help get up to speed a little faster.

Would have giving it 50% more hp even really hurt, considering the limited role?
Aivlis Eldelbar
State War Academy
Caldari State
#22 - 2014-11-10 11:21:36 UTC
Quote:
[...] way we could avoid heavier skill requirements that had nothing to do with its role.
This means we are going to introduce a new skill!


GG CCP Lol

In all seriousness, really liking the concept, and the fact we are getting new spaceships to play with.
CCP Rise
C C P
C C P Alliance
#23 - 2014-11-10 11:26:18 UTC
I have in-game fitting window showing around 350k EHP with a DCU II, 2x reinforced bulkheads II, 3x Transverse bulkhead I

This is in the same range as tank-oriented freighters - I'm sure people using the hauler would want as much as possible but this range should be reasonable, yes?

@ccp_rise
Dustpuppy
New Eden Ferengi
#24 - 2014-11-10 11:27:22 UTC
Would like to see at least one High slot (for a cloak). Jump fatigue only makes sense when moving inventory to low/null sec or within low/null sec. But my assumption might be wrong, maybe cloak is not intended for freighters.

Side question:
With 1.6 mio hangar - can such a ship be used to move capitals through Highsec?
Arronicus
State War Academy
Caldari State
#25 - 2014-11-10 11:31:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Arronicus
Sentient Blade wrote:

Crazy idea... slightly less hull, more mids, more shield HP, and a 1000% bonus to the effects of overheating and heat damage absorbed. 500,000k EHP for 30 - 40 seconds then your modules are burnt out.



You'd get 1 shot by a rookie ship.

Hardeners heated to over 100%

Dustpuppy wrote:

Side question:
With 1.6 mio hangar - can such a ship be used to move capitals through Highsec?



Assembled only in SMB afaik


Rear Admiral Charlie wrote:
What size are the rigs going to be?


My money is on capital.
Rear Admiral Charlie
Dank Krabs and Spicy Memes
Rainbow Knights
#26 - 2014-11-10 11:31:45 UTC
What size are the rigs going to be?
Edward Olmops
Gunboat Commando
#27 - 2014-11-10 11:34:14 UTC
My first impulse was:
can we please have more capacity?
Like 5 BS?

If I want to move all my stuff from one system to another, if I am thinking of a whole corp of lazy, perma-broke or newbie buddies who all want their stuff moved then 3 BS are not much.

Then again, when I think of nullsec and the long-term effects of high mobility, I think maybe 3 BS is a good spot.
It replaces a Carrier, it is even a bit BETTER than a Carrier, but it's still in the same ballpark.
You cannot throw 100 BS around, but there is still the possibility to easily deploy a group of cruisers or BCs.

Also, the defenses should discourage moving too high values without an escort.
afkalt
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#28 - 2014-11-10 11:45:54 UTC  |  Edited by: afkalt
CCP Rise wrote:
I have in-game fitting window showing around 350k EHP with a DCU II, 2x reinforced bulkheads II, 3x Transverse bulkhead I

This is in the same range as tank-oriented freighters - I'm sure people using the hauler would want as much as possible but this range should be reasonable, yes?



Given what you expect people to haul in it - probably not to be honest.


Edit to add context: This is given the standard advice of only hauling <1b and when you see freighters full of mere trit getting popped....no, no I do not think it is enough. Maybe if they were immune to scanning so at least to make it a punt on killing them.


Also: These look big enough to get a packaged capital into - or are there restrictions around the bays for that?
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#29 - 2014-11-10 11:53:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Zappity
I think it needs more tank. Freighter loads top out at about 1b max for gank efficiency so this would be no different. I don't think 1b is high enough for this ship considering the cargo.

You want the cutoff to be blingy mission fits, not a couple of standard fits. I typically carry around just over a bil in an Orca but wouldn't go higher. Why would I use this instead apart from the battleship size?

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Sentient Blade
Crisis Atmosphere
Coalition of the Unfortunate
#30 - 2014-11-10 11:57:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Sentient Blade
CCP Rise wrote:
I'm sure people using the hauler would want as much as possible but this range should be reasonable, yes?


You'd end up having more EHP inside the ship than outside it, and that seems like bad design by whichever NPCs built it.

I know the two roles are far from equal, but a double AIF + DCII carrier, which is expected to move less ships at once, pushes close to a million before heat, and that has the benefit of a jump drive to reduce its exposure to risk.

Now we're talking a big lumbering freighter which is likely going to be carrying more ships, in a region of space where you can't realistically take pre-emptive action against your attackers (without getting yourself GCC'd and unable to undock something fight off whatever is left), and where you can't pop a cyno to bring in instant help.

500k to 1 million is completely reasonable in these circumstances.
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#31 - 2014-11-10 11:59:07 UTC  |  Edited by: dexington
Would it be unrealistic to hope for a T2 jump freighter version in the future?, would be awesome for solo people outside hi-sec.

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
corbexx
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#32 - 2014-11-10 11:59:53 UTC
Sentient Blade wrote:

Crazy idea... slightly less hull, more mids, more shield HP, and a 1000% bonus to the effects of overheating and heat damage absorbed. 500,000k EHP for 30 - 40 seconds then your modules are burnt out.


I don't think you realise what happens when you get 100% resist. but what you propose would get you instantly killed (red giants how do they work)

Corbexx for CSM X - Wormholes still deserve better
Fonac
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#33 - 2014-11-10 11:59:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Fonac
My first thought, is that instead of a procentwise increase, it should be defecit numbers. example, 250k per lvl.. or something like it.
Makes more sense to have it at lvl 5 then.

the EHP should be much much higher(Same thing with all the freigthers tbh...) Suicide ganking is bad enough as it is, this just continue the trend.

If i where to use this kind of ships, it would be because i had multiple large hulls i needed to move, if i had to move a battleship, i would just fly the ship there, instead of putting it into a slow transporter, that has less EHP than what i can get by flying the ship itself, and with much less risk associated....
corbexx
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#34 - 2014-11-10 12:02:56 UTC
Zappity wrote:
I think it needs more tank. Freighter loads top out at about 1b max for gank efficiency so this would be no different. I don't think 1b is high enough for this ship considering the cargo.

You want the cutoff to be blingy mission fits, not a couple of standard fits. I typically carry around just over a bil in an Orca but wouldn't go higher. Why would I use this instead apart from the battleship size?


People if they have any sense wont transport blingy fits, they will strip the expensive mods move them on there own in a tanky t3 or something and use this to haul the hull and rigs of several ships

Corbexx for CSM X - Wormholes still deserve better
FistyMcBumBardier
State War Academy
Caldari State
#35 - 2014-11-10 12:08:43 UTC  |  Edited by: FistyMcBumBardier
Dustpuppy wrote:
Would like to see at least one High slot (for a cloak). Jump fatigue only makes sense when moving inventory to low/null sec or within low/null sec. But my assumption might be wrong, maybe cloak is not intended for freighters.

Side question:
With 1.6 mio hangar - can such a ship be used to move capitals through Highsec?



They do not need a cloak if they are designed for highsec use. If they make a low sec/ null oriented version of this ship then yes.

Can not wait to go Harpooning for these things.

Fun biology fact: Right whales can have testes weighing over 500 kilograms each, that is almost the same as male humans having two 1/2 litre jugs of baby milk between our legs.
Makari Aeron
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#36 - 2014-11-10 12:09:27 UTC
.......only 1.625m m3 ship maintence? I was hoping for 2.5m m3 :S Better than a carrier in null but...meh. Not bad, but yeah definitely a high sec ship. Will probably get one anyawys because they look kinda cool.

CCP RedDawn: Ugly people are just playing life on HARD mode. Personally, I'm playing on an INFERNO difficulty.

CCP Goliath: I often believe that the best way to get something done is to shout at the person trying to help you. http://goo.gl/PKGDP
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#37 - 2014-11-10 12:11:15 UTC
corbexx wrote:
Zappity wrote:
I think it needs more tank. Freighter loads top out at about 1b max for gank efficiency so this would be no different. I don't think 1b is high enough for this ship considering the cargo.

You want the cutoff to be blingy mission fits, not a couple of standard fits. I typically carry around just over a bil in an Orca but wouldn't go higher. Why would I use this instead apart from the battleship size?


People if they have any sense wont transport blingy fits, they will strip the expensive mods move them on there own in a tanky t3 or something and use this to haul the hull and rigs of several ships

Well lots of people DON'T have sense and they should be ganked for it. But I want a ship transporter, not a repurposed mining hull. Enough to haul a couple of fit T3s and a battleship without being ganked. This wouldn't achieve that. Otherwise this is so niche (stripped battleship hulls only) that it won't see much use. If that's the goal then fine, I just misunderstood.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
FireFrenzy
Cynosural Samurai
#38 - 2014-11-10 12:15:24 UTC
Ofcourse this assumes people who buy the giant hauly freighter of haulerie-ing dont actually want to haul **** in it...

And even if i take the bling off my incursion vargur and machariel the combined hulls of them would still cost more then the freighter they are sitting in... (and then there's the logis, t3, and other assorted odds and ends in ammo i haul around) and probably have more ehp maybe... Now HTFU and such are all valid answers but it might be interesting to see whats what first...

Because unless these are the most overpowered gank magnets the world has ever seen i'll end up flying one to and fro and loving it in all probability...

That said:
http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l182/Ecksarelle/ThisThreadisworthlesswithoutPics.gif
Arden Elenduil
Unlimited Bear Works
#39 - 2014-11-10 12:16:01 UTC
CCP Rise

Seeing the kind of gank magnet this ship can be, are there any plans on finally making it so that stuff actually drops from an SMA once the ship is destroyed?
Otherwise it would be very much OP in terms of shifting hardware.
Delekon
Lethal Devotion
#40 - 2014-11-10 12:20:26 UTC
Can the mass be lowered to 300000000? So it can fit in all wormhole types.

If it stays like this the ship will only be available to the residents of the c5/c6.
You can also give us a rig that reduces mass for this ship, by smth like 20% (sort of the opposite of the planned higgs anchor rig) . This way we get to use it without making the ship more bump-able in highsec.

Otherwise totally cool idea.