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[Proposal] Buff Carriers (cargo hold, corp hangars)
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Partsking
New Eden Marshals Service
#1 - 2011-12-14 20:01:30 UTC
At the minimum, carriers should have the storage capacity of an Orca. If EVE carriers were RL, they'd all be using a single closet as storage for the entire ship (size-wise) leading to some pissed off janitors.

Change it. There's no reason not to.
erwin goldblatt
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2011-12-14 20:03:44 UTC
carebear.

fact.
Partsking
New Eden Marshals Service
#3 - 2011-12-14 20:06:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Partsking
erwin goldblatt wrote:
carebear.

fact.


Neverownedacapital

fact

Go pew moar ice.
erwin goldblatt
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2011-12-14 20:08:13 UTC
I will - cos the hold on MY orca is big enough.
Whendee
Ardent Spirits
#5 - 2011-12-14 20:17:23 UTC
Cargo expanders in the lows and the T2 cargo rigs work just fine.

Nub
Partsking
New Eden Marshals Service
#6 - 2011-12-14 20:25:03 UTC
Whendee wrote:
Cargo expanders in the lows and the T2 cargo rigs work just fine.

Nub


Wat.

The killmail from that would be delicious.

I'm aware I can fit expanders and ****, dingleberry. That doesn't fix the core storage issue that all carriers suffer from.
Temmu Guerra
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2011-12-14 20:37:12 UTC
he wants carriers to be the new JF's
Partsking
New Eden Marshals Service
#8 - 2011-12-14 20:43:34 UTC
Temmu Guerra wrote:
he wants carriers to be the new JF's


Not quite. A buffed carrier in this regard is nowhere close to the size of a JF. Don't be naive.


Back to poasting;

Perhaps half Orca stats would please those elite JF pilots screaming "NOES. I paid billions to have that spaze.". A compromise if you will.
Drake Draconis
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2011-12-14 20:47:33 UTC
Aside from your flagrant attitude.... maybe you should take the time to give us your reasons you feel a carrier should be turned into an industiralist hauler and spend a little less time coming across as a playground bully.

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Temmu Guerra
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2011-12-14 21:01:22 UTC
On a serious note I do ask why the necessity for this change. Yes it would be nice to store fuel + more then 1 capital mod in there to swap from triage to pantheon fit on the fly but it is not necessary as you make it sound to be. That is why you either A) have a hauling alt / hauling ***** to follow you around with that stuffs, or B) you make wise choices before undocking.
Partsking
New Eden Marshals Service
#11 - 2011-12-14 21:02:13 UTC
Drake Draconis wrote:
Aside from your flagrant attitude.... maybe you should take the time to give us your reasons you feel a carrier should be turned into an industiralist hauler and spend a little less time coming across as a playground bully.



I'm just retrolling the trollers, bro. I expected such.

Now, since you've replied all serious and such, I'll respond in kind. The carrier's primary role is to support deployment to low/null space. Sure, she can fit a nice contingent of ships with her but the cargo space to support the deployment of those ships is severely lacking. So, you have an average skilled player with access to an average 1.2 billion isk asset meant for that sort of deployment with the storage capacity of rigged out Badger II.

Once again, if we're going to try to apply balance and RL stats to pixels, it should at least be semi-realistic in nature. It just makes no sense as it is right now.


Drake Draconis
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2011-12-14 21:13:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Drake Draconis
Partsking wrote:
Drake Draconis wrote:
Aside from your flagrant attitude.... maybe you should take the time to give us your reasons you feel a carrier should be turned into an industiralist hauler and spend a little less time coming across as a playground bully.



I'm just retrolling the trollers, bro. I expected such.

Now, since you've replied all serious and such, I'll respond in kind. The carrier's primary role is to support deployment to low/null space. Sure, she can fit a nice contingent of ships with her but the cargo space to support the deployment of those ships is severely lacking. So, you have an average skilled player with access to an average 1.2 billion isk asset meant for that sort of deployment with the storage capacity of rigged out Badger II.

Once again, if we're going to try to apply balance and RL stats to pixels, it should at least be semi-realistic in nature. It just makes no sense as it is right now.




RL life or not..the Carrier's role is of 2 major purposes.

1: To commence triage on the battlefield. (logistics *and why the #### did CCP use that damn word?*)
2: To Haul ships to its destination or provide support in that sense.


The Carrier is not an industiralist ship...its not designed to haul cargo en-masse.

Now last I checked....you can haul a ship with ammo/charges in its cargo bay...but nothing else....and guns can't be loaded for some odd reason. (feel free to correct me on that point)

The only other thing youd haul would be modules and fittings...and they aren't that large.

A Jump Freighter is superiour in every respect when it comes to hauling supplies of that nature. A JF isn't best suited to hauling ships that are fitted however.... but thats where the carrier fills that niche to a point.


So I get you want to stike a balance...but the tools are already present....until you can give me a valid argument aside from "This would be nice"....can't really support this.

PS: IRL A Carrier is not a cargo hauler either...it relies on its flotilla and outside support to get its supplies...and comparing a floating city to one in EVE is a bit of a stretch...ok maybe not even close to that....and its internal supplies as far as that carrier is concerned is not one of cargo hauling to other bases of operation..that's tasked to cargo haulers...such as C-31's or even ship freighters. Your logic at that rate is reaching....


PS2: Not that im saying this a terrible idea....just hard to justify.

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Sepheir Sepheron
State War Academy
Caldari State
#13 - 2011-12-14 21:21:55 UTC
erwin goldblatt wrote:
carebear.

fact.


Are you implying a carebear's opinion is any less valuable than your own?
The way you're sounding right now you look like an idiot.
Partsking
New Eden Marshals Service
#14 - 2011-12-14 21:37:55 UTC
Drake Draconis wrote:
Partsking wrote:
Drake Draconis wrote:
Aside from your flagrant attitude.... maybe you should take the time to give us your reasons you feel a carrier should be turned into an industiralist hauler and spend a little less time coming across as a playground bully.



I'm just retrolling the trollers, bro. I expected such.

Now, since you've replied all serious and such, I'll respond in kind. The carrier's primary role is to support deployment to low/null space. Sure, she can fit a nice contingent of ships with her but the cargo space to support the deployment of those ships is severely lacking. So, you have an average skilled player with access to an average 1.2 billion isk asset meant for that sort of deployment with the storage capacity of rigged out Badger II.

Once again, if we're going to try to apply balance and RL stats to pixels, it should at least be semi-realistic in nature. It just makes no sense as it is right now.




RL life or not..the Carrier's role is of 2 major purposes.

1: To commence triage on the battlefield. (logistics *and why the #### did CCP use that damn word?*)
2: To Haul ships to its destination or provide support in that sense.


The Carrier is not an industiralist ship...its not designed to haul cargo en-masse.

Now last I checked....you can haul a ship with ammo/charges in its cargo bay...but nothing else....and guns can't be loaded for some odd reason. (feel free to correct me on that point)

The only other thing youd haul would be modules and fittings...and they aren't that large.

A Jump Freighter is superiour in every respect when it comes to hauling supplies of that nature. A JF isn't best suited to hauling ships that are fitted however.... but thats where the carrier fills that niche to a point.


So I get you want to stike a balance...but the tools are already present....until you can give me a valid argument aside from "This would be nice"....can't really support this.

PS: IRL A Carrier is not a cargo hauler either...it relies on its flotilla and outside support to get its supplies...and comparing a floating city to one in EVE is a bit of a stretch...ok maybe not even close to that....and its internal supplies as far as that carrier is concerned is not one of cargo hauling to other bases of operation..that's tasked to cargo haulers...such as C-31's or even ship freighters. Your logic at that rate is reaching....


PS2: Not that im saying this a terrible idea....just hard to justify.


On the surface, it could be difficult to justify given all the *other* tools at our disposal. However, the average grunt that would benefit from this sort of change the most probably doesn't have a multi-billion isk JF and skilled character at the ready and definitely not his own flotilla of alts and ships to support a simple deployment.

The orca comparison I made was based simply on size so I retract that. One is an industrial and the other not. However, I still propose some buff to at least a third of capacity in both areas.
Drake Draconis
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#15 - 2011-12-14 23:01:16 UTC
Partsking wrote:

On the surface, it could be difficult to justify given all the *other* tools at our disposal. However, the average grunt that would benefit from this sort of change the most probably doesn't have a multi-billion isk JF and skilled character at the ready and definitely not his own flotilla of alts and ships to support a simple deployment.

The orca comparison I made was based simply on size so I retract that. One is an industrial and the other not. However, I still propose some buff to at least a third of capacity in both areas.



It's not as expensive as it seems to afford a JF....specially if your attempting to support a multi billion if not trillion alliance that requiers supplies to field caps...such as a carrier.


JFs are expensive because of long range and massive cargo hulaing capability...but they are risky to use and employ...I myself am a JF pilot...and currently working towards a second one to aid my corp/alliance.

As far as carriers are concerned...they fill their niche quite well...the only thing I'd like to see is a bit more offensive capabilities if not some additional defense...as far as cargo hauling.... not really convinced it will do much...but then it wouldn't hurt either.

Carriers don't do a whole heck of alot....a carrier in IRL is capable of inititating attacks and strikes by deployment of its fighter craft.

A carrier in EVE isn't even close to that....it drops fighters sure....but they are just frigate sized drones that could...possibly be a problem....but not an offensive problem....at best.


I may not have a solid answer to your argument...but a JF is more preferable for the role you seek than a Carrier would be...but as I've said yet again....there's no harm in buffing cargo space either.

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mxzf
Shovel Bros
#16 - 2011-12-14 23:16:34 UTC
Have you looked into the Rorqual? Yes, it is an extra two weeks of training (for Barge 5, if you don't already have it), but it seems to fill the role you're looking for and doesn't require reworking any existing ships.

I will admit that I wouldn't mind seeing some more cargo room in carriers, but there are alternatives.
Drake Draconis
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2011-12-14 23:29:20 UTC
mxzf wrote:
Have you looked into the Rorqual? Yes, it is an extra two weeks of training (for Barge 5, if you don't already have it), but it seems to fill the role you're looking for and doesn't require reworking any existing ships.

I will admit that I wouldn't mind seeing some more cargo room in carriers, but there are alternatives.


Wouldn't work...Rorquals are restriced to only carrying Industrialist class ships in the ship maint array.

While it can haul... a JF wins out even with price tag attached.

Granted the Rorqual is likely going to do better in its nasty array of drone defenses....but then an Orca would surpass it as far as ship carrying ability...even a Carrier...offense and defense is debatable.

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Emperor Salazar
Remote Soviet Industries
Insidious Empire
#18 - 2011-12-16 13:47:44 UTC
Supported. This will make evaccing space that has been taken from you much easier. Good idea OP.
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#19 - 2011-12-16 17:33:37 UTC
Drake Draconis wrote:
Aside from your flagrant attitude.... maybe you should take the time to give us your reasons you feel a carrier should be turned into an industiralist hauler and spend a little less time coming across as a playground bully.




lol, that's rich coming from you, Zero-Seven.


Anyway OP - these things are not meant to be industrials. Haul stuff in other ways.

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Drake Draconis
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#20 - 2011-12-16 18:01:45 UTC
Bumblefck wrote:
Drake Draconis wrote:
Aside from your flagrant attitude.... maybe you should take the time to give us your reasons you feel a carrier should be turned into an industiralist hauler and spend a little less time coming across as a playground bully.




lol, that's rich coming from you, Zero-Seven.


Anyway OP - these things are not meant to be industrials. Haul stuff in other ways.


Name is Drake Draconis...if you can't read...then please GTFO.

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