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Breaking News: No more SP loss and clone grades

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Primary This Rifter
Mutual Fund of the Something
#121 - 2014-11-07 20:45:18 UTC
Press Z when you die or you lose skillpoints.
It's a great mechanic guys, it makes the game harder.
RomeStar
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#122 - 2014-11-07 20:46:16 UTC
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
It's an isk sink, which is needed.

A minor sink that can be compensated for in other ways.
If CCP were concerned about the balance of sinks versus faucets they wouldn't have been steadily increasing ISK faucets as of late.

Gregor Parud wrote:
Also, just because you want things easy doesn't mean it's good. You know, easy blues, easy farming, easy RMT, easy ganks.

Med clones and SP loss wasn't hard. It was just dumb. Removing it doesn't really make the game any easier.


Removing it does make it easier because now you don't have to earn a living if you die free rookie ship free pods tell me how it made it harder?

Signatured removed, CCP Phantom
Primary This Rifter
Mutual Fund of the Something
#123 - 2014-11-07 20:47:10 UTC
You can't be serious.
Tikitina
Doomheim
#124 - 2014-11-07 20:53:05 UTC
RomeStar wrote:
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
It's an isk sink, which is needed.

A minor sink that can be compensated for in other ways.
If CCP were concerned about the balance of sinks versus faucets they wouldn't have been steadily increasing ISK faucets as of late.

Gregor Parud wrote:
Also, just because you want things easy doesn't mean it's good. You know, easy blues, easy farming, easy RMT, easy ganks.

Med clones and SP loss wasn't hard. It was just dumb. Removing it doesn't really make the game any easier.


Removing it does make it easier because now you don't have to earn a living if you die free rookie ship free pods tell me how it made it harder?



The fact that a MedClone can cost as much as a warship up to a Command Ship is insane.
Tikitina
Doomheim
#125 - 2014-11-07 21:01:41 UTC
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Ama Scelesta wrote:
Easy to fix. Allow local clone jumps with no cooldown. Allows you to leave your clone with unwanted implants at home whenever you need to go out, but don't want to take advantage/risk them.

This needs to happen, I think I remember CCP saying they were open to it.



I say remove all jump clones and just allow you to plug and unplug implants whenever.
Unezka Turigahl
Det Som Engang Var
#126 - 2014-11-07 21:05:48 UTC
Nah, remove implants too. All of them. Attribute ones, tank ones, hardwirings. All of them. Then they can remove pods all together. Ship blows up, there's you corpse.
cyndrogen
The Greatest Corp in the Universe
#127 - 2014-11-07 21:15:16 UTC
clone changes? meh.... anyway let me get back to not caring about clone costs.... maybe 2% of the game gives a crap about these changes.

Every day in every way I improve my skills and get better.
Indahmawar Fazmarai
#128 - 2014-11-07 22:35:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Indahmawar Fazmarai
Final thought: they should have removed grades to prevent SP loss and keep a flat rate for clone cost (say, 1 million iSK per unit).

Free and irrelevant clones are just a respawn point. But, whatever... This is the coming of The Golden Age (TM).
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#129 - 2014-11-07 23:05:51 UTC
I can see a use for this change.

You see when you get blapped in the usual bubble camp, and all they got was a frigate and a skinny corpse and freebie implants, sometimes you get a convo to the order of "HA HA HAV FUN PAYING FOR NEW CLONE GOBACKTOWOWPHAGWELEETMARSHAMARSHAMARSHA!"


Because when you do nullsec right, you know not to garnish someone elses stats with your loss, especially when you expect loss. But they get pretty upset when they pop that egg and all they got was a frozen corpse.

So I would say this change is more of a thumb in the eye for the kind of player who would make hay about clone costs, not for their own losses but for that "last resort at least you gotta pay for expensive clone" type who is going to bounce their leetness around between their face and the monitor for a minute or two (and then forget about the whole thing).

Frankly it was getting to that point where it's like "Hmmm I know I'm gonna die, and my clone is going to cost more than the ship.... hmmm.... best I not go/use my cheap same-account alt whose clones are so cheap I'd have to get killed 900000 times to run out of ISK".


Is this the end of PVP or the dreaded WoWification?

Doubt it. This could mean better encounters though. Some of you will feel the wrath of my 80 million SP and my Kestrel.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#130 - 2014-11-08 00:13:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
IF: the maximum SP you could accumulate in 1 year is around 22 million SP, let's round it to 24 million:

THEN: 1 PLEX of training you could get 2 million SP. apply an instant-gratification premium and you get 1 million SP
...per PLEX, that you could have instantly, but then lose upon loss of your pod.

What would be a fair drawback? is the removal upon death enough, or does it need to be more like permadeath?

if it was more like 500,000 SP for 1 PLEX but also permanent, with no drawbacks, would you be OK with that?

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Mike Adoulin
Happys Happy Hamster Hunting Club
#131 - 2014-11-08 01:55:00 UTC
Hmmmm.

So do I get a refund from CCP for all the damn ISK I wasted on clone upgrades?

Bear

Everything in EVE is a trap.

And if it isn't, it's your job to make it a trap...:)

You want to know what immorality in EVE Online looks like? Look no further than Ripard "Jester" Teg.

Chribba is the Chuck Norris of EVE.
Bibosikus
Air
#132 - 2014-11-08 10:39:02 UTC
Unezka Turigahl wrote:
Nah, remove implants too. All of them. Attribute ones, tank ones, hardwirings. All of them. Then they can remove pods all together. Ship blows up, there's you corpse.


.. and compensate by adding Level 6 to skills coveted by implants Cool

Doubt that would happen, but +1 to the main proposal. Anything that facilitates pvp and gets carebears thinking about jumping into low sec in a frigate had got to be good for the game.

Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#133 - 2014-11-08 10:44:06 UTC
Bibosikus wrote:
Unezka Turigahl wrote:
Nah, remove implants too. All of them. Attribute ones, tank ones, hardwirings. All of them. Then they can remove pods all together. Ship blows up, there's you corpse.


.. and compensate by adding Level 6 to skills coveted by implants Cool

Doubt that would happen, but +1 to the main proposal. Anything that facilitates pvp and gets carebears thinking about jumping into low sec in a frigate had got to be good for the game.

include free ships and fitting here and you have my vote.

because 'anything that facilitates pvp...' Cool

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#134 - 2014-11-08 10:55:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
March rabbit wrote:
Bibosikus wrote:
Unezka Turigahl wrote:
Nah, remove implants too. All of them. Attribute ones, tank ones, hardwirings. All of them. Then they can remove pods all together. Ship blows up, there's you corpse.


.. and compensate by adding Level 6 to skills coveted by implants Cool

Doubt that would happen, but +1 to the main proposal. Anything that facilitates pvp and gets carebears thinking about jumping into low sec in a frigate had got to be good for the game.

include free ships and fitting here and you have my vote.

because 'anything that facilitates pvp...' Cool


It's the same clowns asking for the same things; "make it easier, make it take less effort because that's better somehow".

We might as well diminish the whole game to a single button, the one who mashes it first wins.
Primary This Rifter
Mutual Fund of the Something
#135 - 2014-11-08 12:36:20 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
It's the same clowns asking for the same things; "make it easier, make it take less effort because that's better somehow".

Yeah, because clicking through a menu that upgrades my clone when I die qualifies as effort and not busywork with a tax.
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#136 - 2014-11-08 14:31:28 UTC
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
It's the same clowns asking for the same things; "make it easier, make it take less effort because that's better somehow".

Yeah, because clicking through a menu that upgrades my clone when I die qualifies as effort and not busywork with a tax.

when you buy stuff on market - this is busywork
when you fit your ships - this is busywork
.....

let's remove it all?

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Morganta
The Greater Goon
#137 - 2014-11-08 17:27:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Morganta
I think this change is great, clone costs are so high on high skill characters it does make random gang PVP less feasible

I also think most of the people against this are in one of 2 camps

those who have yet to realize how burdensome high level clone costs are because they don't have SP themselves

and some higher level players who are trembling in fear that their no-risk system of watching for titan pilots to log on will be destroyed as high SP characters jump into frigs and not giant space willies
(you can bet theres more pilots than titans in game so many of them will not be shackled to a ship)
Ama Scelesta
#138 - 2014-11-08 17:37:11 UTC
March rabbit wrote:
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
It's the same clowns asking for the same things; "make it easier, make it take less effort because that's better somehow".

Yeah, because clicking through a menu that upgrades my clone when I die qualifies as effort and not busywork with a tax.

when you buy stuff on market - this is busywork
when you fit your ships - this is busywork
.....

let's remove it all?

There are no sacred cows or mandatory features in a game. You always do what your carefully planned game design goals require. Things that don't aren't included in that and don't contribute anything positive to the experience are trashed. The market is not a necessity in all games nor is ship fitting/avatar equipping. In EVE they serve valuable purposes and provide better gameplay. The existence of a market is fundamental in a game like this. A proper market mechanic isn't strictly speaking necessary, but it is vital to facilitating the vast amount of trading needed to keep the wheels of the economy running smoothly and conveniently. Fitting ships on the other hand offer increased options for industry and trading, while providing massive gameplay improving opportunities for all players. The current medical clone system on the other hand provides nothing of interest or beneficial to the game. It's just a tax that benefits no one and disincentivizes certain activities. If anything it has an overall negative impact on the game with no redeeming qualities. The only bad thing about getting rid of it now is that it didn't happen a lot sooner.
Val'Dore
PlanetCorp InterStellar
#139 - 2014-11-08 18:43:11 UTC
I think perhaps instead of just doing away with them:

One time upgrade purchase, increase the cost 10x, make them available after you reach that point in sp, and have each clone upgrade buff the pod stats. Keep the sp loss removal.

Star Jump Drive A new way to traverse the galaxy.

I invented Tiericide
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#140 - 2014-11-08 18:52:17 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:

It's the same clowns asking for the same things; "make it easier, make it take less effort because that's better somehow".

We might as well diminish the whole game to a single button, the one who mashes it first wins.


Feel free to tell us what we gain from paying a tax on getting killed.