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Breaking News: No more SP loss and clone grades

First post
Author
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#101 - 2014-11-07 17:37:06 UTC
Arec Bardwin wrote:
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
...and CCP Despair Clock reached 10:45 PM.
I'll start running for the hills when ccp introduces lifetime subscriptions.


depends on how they price them imo, at a low price that just suggests a grab the money and run situation. at say $1,500 that is 100 months at the standard price, and well that price might make sense, although it is high enough I wonder how many would take it? Also if they offer say one each year at fanfest for the charity auction that seems reasonable to me.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#102 - 2014-11-07 17:39:54 UTC
Ruskarn Andedare wrote:
Glomps wrote:
Clone costs have always been meaningless and it's implants that cause players to stay docked. This change does almost nothing and they should have looked at removing learning implants instead.


It's not only the cost though, it's the remembering.



It's also the management of that cost vs the benefit.

You can jump to a implantless (or light) clone. You can't reduce your medical clone cost.

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter

Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#103 - 2014-11-07 17:43:59 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Vincent Athena wrote:
Adrie Atticus wrote:
Taking bets on which isk sink is going to increase in magnitude now that clone costs are gone.

It is, and will continue to be, the co-payment needed to get items from the LP store. An oldie but goodie from a Dev:

"A freebie, last 24hrs transaction stats for a selection of faucets and sinks -
as you can see, Concord is a very generous organization!



Trade Total

* Market Transaction 5,848,221,406,963

Faucets
* Bounty Prizes 876,039,478,466
* Agent Mission Reward 68,923,141,163
* Agent Mission Time Bonus 63,450,447,585
* Insurance Payouts 111,942,877,603

Sinks
* Sales Tax 6,227,911,218
* Brokers fee 6,733,818,276
* PI Construction Costs 7,575,185,000
* PI Import Tax 290,289,843
* PI Export Tax 3,355,153,925
* Insurance Cost 43,021,823,156
* Clone Activation 20,197,210,000
* Sovereignty Bill 59,332,000,000
* LP Store 135,343,150,000 "

I note Industry costs missing off that sinks list unless I'm blind. Which I suspect is quite weighty also.


I would guess it was probably a decent amount overall due to volume, but I can only speculate that it greatly increased with the recent industry changes. looking at my old industry spreadsheet I don't even have it listed anywhere. if I remember right it was around 11k per hour per slot? although some of that depended on the facility, and standings.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#104 - 2014-11-07 17:48:41 UTC
Sir Constantin wrote:
All this little things give depth to the game.

If they want more pvp in null, then make so you cant lose your implants. I know a few players that have +4, +5 implants and they don't want to go to null and lose the implants. I know, you can jump-clone but, that's kind of annoying aswell.



then the "perceived" barrier to entry for pvp would be a pirate implant set with 6% hardwires... I'd have no problem paying 3-5 bil several times for different jumpclones if I knew it wouldn't ever go away. but that is quite a large advantage over any new player. To get that kind of bonus I really think the threat of loss should remain.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Warde Guildencrantz
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#105 - 2014-11-07 18:11:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Warde Guildencrantz
Long as they don't get rid of slaves or snakes...implant sets that fit playstyles are something I really like about eve.

TunDraGon ~ Low sec piracy since 2003 ~ Youtube ~ Join Us

Primary This Rifter
Mutual Fund of the Something
#106 - 2014-11-07 18:15:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Primary This Rifter
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Ruskarn Andedare wrote:
Glomps wrote:
Clone costs have always been meaningless and it's implants that cause players to stay docked. This change does almost nothing and they should have looked at removing learning implants instead.


It's not only the cost though, it's the remembering.



It's also the management of that cost vs the benefit.

You can jump to a implantless (or light) clone. You can't reduce your medical clone cost.

Anyone that argues against this point is being a pedant and nothing less.
Yes, there is technically an alternative, but it's not one that anyone considers acceptable, so it may as well not even be a choice.
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#107 - 2014-11-07 18:15:53 UTC
It's almost as if some dev who kept klinging (and for good reason) to the old EVE, the good EVE, left and now all the carebare fcks have taken over. We'll have raids, and mounts and pandas.
Primary This Rifter
Mutual Fund of the Something
#108 - 2014-11-07 18:17:19 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
It's almost as if some dev who kept klinging (and for good reason) to the old EVE, the good EVE, left and now all the carebare fcks have taken over. We'll have raids, and mounts and pandas.

"I liked having a stupid tax in my game and I think this somehow made it 1337."
Gregor Parud
Imperial Academy
#109 - 2014-11-07 18:21:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Gregor Parud
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
It's almost as if some dev who kept klinging (and for good reason) to the old EVE, the good EVE, left and now all the carebare fcks have taken over. We'll have raids, and mounts and pandas.

"I liked having a stupid tax in my game and I think this somehow made it 1337."


It's an isk sink, which is needed. Also, just because you want things easy doesn't mean it's good. You know, easy blues, easy farming, easy RMT, easy ganks.
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#110 - 2014-11-07 18:58:42 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Gregor Parud wrote:
It's almost as if some dev who kept klinging (and for good reason) to the old EVE, the good EVE, left and now all the carebare fcks have taken over. We'll have raids, and mounts and pandas.

"I liked having a stupid tax in my game and I think this somehow made it 1337."


It's an isk sink, which is needed. Also, just because you want things easy doesn't mean it's good. You know, easy blues, easy farming, easy RMT, easy ganks.

I'm really not sure what you thought was "hard" about the old system. They removed a pointless annoyance, making room for future mechanics that actually have meaning and could well make for more "hard" decisions.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#111 - 2014-11-07 19:08:48 UTC
Speaking of new clone mechanics I can see a lot of possibilities for them, assuming CCP doesn't just let this drop.

1: Genetically engineered clones that allow certain advantages (and disadvantages) in any number of things, including what learning implants provide now. Or perhaps you could obtain a clone specifically designed to participate in EVE's sister games (DUST or Legion, and Valkyrie)... same character but different capabilities and aptitudes.

2: Permanent implants, where you have a contract with the cloning company to have certain implants already implanted before you even jump into the clone. Very useful in a situation where the odds of frequent character death in isolated area's is high.

3: The introduction of multipurpose implants, the catch being that these need to be put in place at a particular stage of the clones development to keep the implant from being rejected... basically you would be growing the clone around a particularly powerful and flexible implant or set of implants.

Only the tip of the iceberg of course, but any one of the above would have more meaning and impact on the game than the minor "experience tax" we have had up to this point.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.

Primary This Rifter
Mutual Fund of the Something
#112 - 2014-11-07 19:34:48 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:
It's an isk sink, which is needed.

A minor sink that can be compensated for in other ways.
If CCP were concerned about the balance of sinks versus faucets they wouldn't have been steadily increasing ISK faucets as of late.

Gregor Parud wrote:
Also, just because you want things easy doesn't mean it's good. You know, easy blues, easy farming, easy RMT, easy ganks.

Med clones and SP loss wasn't hard. It was just dumb. Removing it doesn't really make the game any easier.
Primary This Rifter
Mutual Fund of the Something
#113 - 2014-11-07 19:35:41 UTC
"Oh I got podded should I upgrade my clone or not I can't decide this game is so hard" said nobody ever.
Gogela
Epic Ganking Time
CODE.
#114 - 2014-11-07 19:46:43 UTC
Ranger 1 wrote:
Speaking of new clone mechanics I can see a lot of possibilities for them, assuming CCP doesn't just let this drop.

1: Genetically engineered clones that allow certain advantages (and disadvantages) in any number of things, including what learning implants provide now. Or perhaps you could obtain a clone specifically designed to participate in EVE's sister games (DUST or Legion, and Valkyrie)... same character but different capabilities and aptitudes.

2: Permanent implants, where you have a contract with the cloning company to have certain implants already implanted before you even jump into the clone. Very useful in a situation where the odds of frequent character death in isolated area's is high.

3: The introduction of multipurpose implants, the catch being that these need to be put in place at a particular stage of the clones development to keep the implant from being rejected... basically you would be growing the clone around a particularly powerful and flexible implant or set of implants.

Only the tip of the iceberg of course, but any one of the above would have more meaning and impact on the game than the minor "experience tax" we have had up to this point.


This is pretty neat. Very positive though... it might be cool to have some effects that follow you around a bit too. For instance, an implant that fits outside the slot system, but cannot be removed. It might give you 5% agility, but if it's removed or you are podded it creates a neural shock that knocks down the willpower of all of your clones down by 10% for a month while you psyche recovers. There could be new consequences. Big smile

Signatures should be used responsibly...

Arec Bardwin
#115 - 2014-11-07 19:57:16 UTC
Gregor Parud wrote:

It's an isk sink, which is needed. Also, just because you want things easy doesn't mean it's good. You know, easy blues, easy farming, easy RMT, easy ganks.

Relax, we recently had a huge increase in taxes on anything built in this game. The clone cost isk sink should be insignificant compared to that.
Paul Panala
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#116 - 2014-11-07 20:02:32 UTC
Ama Scelesta wrote:
Color me unshocked. I am somewhat interested in the stats involved though. How much SP has been lost to the mechanic over the years, where and by whom?


It is less about people losing skill points, more than you have to buy a new clone every time you get pod killed. Might not seem like a big deal, but some of the higher end closes cost a lot.
Trin Javidan
Caymen Labs
#117 - 2014-11-07 20:08:16 UTC
So a CCP developer is handing out new information, on a "third party" website before EVE-O forums?
And to be active on that particular website, you need to pay a member fee aswell?


I see a confict of interest there, a violation with the EULA and a moral border that has just been crossed!

Troll away my post, but im rite!

Primary This Rifter
Mutual Fund of the Something
#118 - 2014-11-07 20:39:13 UTC
Trin Javidan wrote:
So a CCP developer is handing out new information, on a "third party" website before EVE-O forums?
And to be active on that particular website, you need to pay a member fee aswell?

Yes, this was part of their Twitch broadcast.
You don't need an account to watch them, and basic accounts are free.

There's no issue here whatsoever.
RomeStar
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#119 - 2014-11-07 20:41:18 UTC
Jean Luc Lemmont wrote:
March rabbit wrote:
Jean Luc Lemmont wrote:
And people with highskill points immediately rejoiced and jumped into Rifters

let me guess: next reason to not jump to rifter would be implants? Cool


Pfft. Anyone serious about PvP has a blank jump clone for just such occurances. Implants were never really a consideration except for the training fixated people. The real hangup was your clone costing literally 200 times the cost of your fitted frigate.



it wasn't the cost that was the problem it was the alpha clone and loss of SP. But don't worry I see ship replacement in the near future and the masses all coming out and saying that is the best thing CCP can do to bring new people into this game. The bar has been lowered and in will come 10 yr olds with daddys credit card (which for you scammers is a great thing) who wont care if they die in a pod because there are no repercussions. The good thing about this is the sales of frigates will increase thus my profitability will increase. How long until all risk is removed from EVE because after all greed is good right.

Signatured removed, CCP Phantom

RomeStar
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#120 - 2014-11-07 20:43:31 UTC
Paul Panala wrote:
Ama Scelesta wrote:
Color me unshocked. I am somewhat interested in the stats involved though. How much SP has been lost to the mechanic over the years, where and by whom?


It is less about people losing skill points, more than you have to buy a new clone every time you get pod killed. Might not seem like a big deal, but some of the higher end closes cost a lot.



Honestly if you have a high sp pilot and you have problems making isk then you either A. bought that pilot and still don't know how to make isk or B. Don't know how to make isk either way you wat m8

Signatured removed, CCP Phantom